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Will robber get to keep lottery jackpot?
Clarksville,Tennessee United States Member #8823 November 13, 2004 1781 Posts Online |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 11:39 am - IP Logged |
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When this hit the wire, I had an immediate impression related to mental illness, which the media reports elude to. They do not give the detail on whether this gentleman has a DPOA, guardian, court-appointed advocate, etc. The obvious issue here is as already pointed out - clearly court-order prohibited from gambling, so he gambles and goes on to cash a big winning ticket. I think the issue may be a little more complicated than face value. If he is functioning in the population but mentally ill or challenged in some manner, someone somewhere will argue he was not capable of understanding the probation terms and/or controlling his impulse to gamble. He clearly violated his probation but if he was, in fact, not able to comply in the first place with the terms of probation, he would not be responsible for subsequent actions and a good attorney will use the poor judgement of presenting his winning ticket himself in his defense. The issues are also more than just losing the winning ticket. VOP will put him back in the system. The other issue is that he may not meet the Lottery definition of a person prohibited from purchasing lottery ticket (underage, etc.) because the prohibition stems from court-ordered terms. Many times challenged individuals (including brain-injured) understand the concept of money and even how the lottery works - buy a ticket and get money back - but are not able to comprehend the finer points of how/why/where that money is generated or its tax implications, etc. It will be interesting to see where this goes. This amount of money may spur a good attorney somewhere to get involved (assuming he does not have means already) to see where this will go. At first I thought they might take the winnings but after reading this I think he may have a chance at keeping the winnings. if I was a lawyer I would probably take this take his case.
I love doubles and remember, it's just a game!!!!!!
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Huntsville AL United States Member #16820 June 1, 2005 60 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 12:14 pm - IP Logged |
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I'm never in favor of probation terms that have nothing to do with the "crime" committed. It's just a way of controlling people beyond their initial "punishment". He is more likely to cause fewer problems with a $50,000 income a year than nothing. But of course the fewer people under the "care" of the mental hospitals(sic) or the prison systems would necessitate fewer of those systems and "jobs" they create. It may be he robbed the bank to pay off gambling debts.
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United States Member #10921 January 23, 2005 708 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 9:03 pm - IP Logged |
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And robbers are what..... shmart? I think he may have a good defense that it is "cruel and unusual punishment" to forbid someone to play the Lottery.
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United States Member #54302 July 23, 2007 112 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 9:48 pm - IP Logged |
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And robbers are what..... shmart? He should have kept his mouth shut! I heard some jealous a-hole ratted him out to the probation officer... Snitches
One time - A thing occured to me - What's real - And what's for sale! 
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NY United States Member #24178 October 16, 2005 1311 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 9:56 pm - IP Logged |
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Time Treat make a really good point. Whatever crimes the guy has committed, taking away 50 grand a year in legitimate income isn't going to do much to reduce his interest in committing more crimes. My guess is that after talking with his lawyer he'll remember that the lottery ticket was given to him as a gift. That would mean he didn't violate his probation, and gets to keep the winnings. Too bad there's nothing inthe article about when he alledgedly bought the ticket. My guess would be that the store doesn't keep security tapes for very long, but he may have cashed the ticket in too much of a hurry.
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New Member massachusetts United States Member #56927 November 19, 2007 16 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 29, 2007, 11:37 pm - IP Logged |
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I would think that this guy must have some sort of gambling problem that was recognized by massachusetts or it wouldnt be part of his probationary terms...could be he supported a gambling habit that cause him to rob that bank...hard to say. with a prayer and 6 lucky numbers...im beach bound!
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Atwater, Ohio United States Member #33045 February 14, 2006 1153 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 30, 2007, 6:11 am - IP Logged |
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At first I thought they might take the winnings but after reading this I think he may have a chance at keeping the winnings. if I was a lawyer I would probably take this take his case.
When mental illness is added into the equation. "Elliott was placed on five years' probation after pleading guilty in October 2006 to unarmed robbery" Maybe when he robbed that bank he used his thumb and forefinger as a make believe gun. If he really knew that he couldn't buy lottery tickets, why did he buy one, win, cash it, and have his picture taken holding the check?
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New Member United States Member #54874 August 17, 2007 3 Posts Offline |
| Posted: November 30, 2007, 9:05 pm - IP Logged |
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This is really lame if they take away his prize.
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MI United States Member #20554 August 14, 2005 49 Posts Offline |
| Posted: December 1, 2007, 8:40 am - IP Logged |
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The only ones that will get any money from this are the lawyers. If it's determined he purchased and cashed the ticket illegally the money goes back to the state. But wait, they have a winning ticket and and no owner, who gets it now? Back to litigation If it's determined it's ok for him to keep getting the money, then doesn't he owe for all the past free mental health care he's received? Back to litigation. If the lottery commision determines that the ticket was illegal and tries to put the money back in the general fun, isn't it possible that the state mental health system declares that the money is theirs and decides to fight for it.?Back to litigation. Meanwhile, his family, the same ones that didn't want anything to do with him until now, are all trying to get themselves designated his legal guardian. Back to litigation. The way I see it, there is already 10-15 lawyers involved in this, so no matter the outcome, this poor guy will never see another penny of it. If he's smart he will go rob another bank and get thrown back in jail where neither his family or the lawyers can bother him.
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United States Member #983 December 30, 2002 443 Posts Offline |
| Posted: December 1, 2007, 11:49 pm - IP Logged |
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It seems to me that violating probation should involve put him back in jail, not taking his winnings. If they do take his winnings, that is equal to a $1 million dollar fine, and I would think a lawyer could see if there is precedent for that among people on similar probation who are caught gambling being fined a similar amount or having their entire winnings taken. Does the probation say "All gambling winnings shall be forfeited to the state"? The other problem I have is that cases like this make states more likely to go over big winners with a fine tooth comb to prove some way to make them ineligible to win the money. The state has a financial interest in it, they would make a million dollars profit by making someone "ineligible". That prize won't be going back in the pool to be won by someone else, it will be kept by the state. But yeah, not too smart to be photographed at lottery HQ. You would think someone who is as well aquainted with the legal system as a convicted bank robber would at least visit a lawyer and pick up the prize anonymously.
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