An Ethical Dilemma...

Reply #43

DC81 — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 22:42:10 GMT

I believe this falls under the rules of finders keepers . Maybe if you would have won then you could have looked into finding the person and give them their four dollars back.

Reply #42

tntea — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:58:12 GMT

Please read the original post before voting.

Take the entire $9 in tickets [ 35 ] [76.09%]

Take only the $5 in tickets that you put in [ 3 ] [6.52%]

Contact a store employee [ 4 ] [8.70%]

Other (Please explain) [ 4 ] [8.70%]

Total Valid Votes [ 46 ]

Discarded Votes [ 3

Reply #41

pacattack05 — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 18:17:12 GMT

In the example stated, the person did not know who it belonged to.

Reply #40

Fibonacci — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 18:00:50 GMT

I don't consider this an ethical dilemma. Just a matterof doing the decent human thing--you can't keep what's not yours,especially when you know whose it is.

Reply #39

justxploring — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 07:13:08 GMT

You are so right, Bob! Once I asked for cash back when I used my debit card and got too much. I went back to the store and the cashier said to me do you know what kind of trouble you just caused?

No good deed goes unpunished.

PS: Thanks for feeding abandoned animals.

Reply #38

guesser — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 06:29:45 GMT

If the person that was at the machine prior to me was in shouting distance, I would yell at them, and if not, I'd keep all 9 tickets.

I also ask myself what would someone else do if I was at the opposite end of that - if I didn't know to grab all the tickets I had paid for ? They'd scroo me.... no doubt.

Reply #37

OldSchoolPa — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 00:24:12 GMT

I highly doubt any store monitors each person who uses such machines, so there is no way one could be certain WHO actually left the extra credits. Since money is a bearers instrument (except for when it can be distinctly linked to the true owner...i.e. ID in a bag of money, observing a person drop money and not notice it), I would have no problem purchasing 9 QPs.

Reply #36

rubberbandman — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:30:11 GMT

With astronomical odds, technically 4 extra dollars wouldnt benefit that much to your advantage.

Reply #35

pacattack05 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:08:10 GMT

Look in the yellow pages. They're right there next to tooth fairies and goblins.

Reply #34

MaddMike51 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:56:16 GMT

We all have spirit guides and guardian Angels helping us, just ask for their help and follow your intuition.

Where might I find these spirit guides and guardian angels ?

I can use their help.

Reply #33

myzeus — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:23:48 GMT

If I could find the rightful owner, I would return it. If you can't find the owner, why give it to someone else who does not own it

Reply #32

Raven62 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:48:30 GMT

How do you know if you have integrity (good moral character): By what you do when you are alone and no one is watching: Do you take what's not yours or do you return it to its' rightful owner

Reply #31

myzeus — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:32:10 GMT

I would take the entire amount. I agree, it would be impossible to trace the last person that used the machine. If you go to a clerk or anyone else, they may take it for themselves, so you would be giving it away. Strange things happen though, maybe it was meant for you to have those extra credits.

Here's something that happened to me and I think my guardians Angels (or spirit guides) had a hand in it. I went to the race track, I told the cashier I wanted a $2 bet on horse number 2. And I tho... [ More ]

Reply #30

BobP — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:59:29 GMT

Some time ago I decided to try not to be so honest I was being stupid about it. Three weeks ago the store charges us for a cheaper fruit then we were buying the next week we get home and the can of corn we paid for is missing, things kind of balance out.

You never know what kind of a can of worms you are opening. People come back to a store to return the $5.00 extra the cashier gave them by mistake. The cashier had replaced the missing $5.00 when counting out the drawer. The cashier is alr... [ More ]

Reply #29

TheGameGrl — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:04:58 GMT

Tried the honest way a few times- it never paid me back or made me think I did the RIGHT thing. My kids could have used a decent meal.

As to the casino scenario- Money found on the casino floor is technically their property, tickets found ON the machine, NOT there property. Unclaimed tickets are fair game. Casinos can only regulate if a player has his ticket stolen from his hands. If there are machines that still spew coins, those in the kettle are the customers, those that drop to the floor,... [ More ]

Reply #28

weshar75 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 01:31:54 GMT

The Select Market in Sheridan, Oregon has a Self-Serve Automated Terminal Machine. I buy from time to time Lottery out of them because you are not at the mercy of someone who may or may not know how to print tickets. The machine has warnings on it and when you go through the process of buying tickets it prompts you to validate choices and it does prompt a remaining balance after every purchase. Their are no refunds to the machines and all sales are final. The previous buyer ignored the machine a... [ More ]

Reply #27

MaddMike51 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 01:15:13 GMT

You could always claim that you didn't know there was $4 credit on the machine and was so surprised when the machine spit out $9 worth of tickets that you just figured it must be an of God!Which,in a way,it was.

Reply #26

benir4u — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:55:28 GMT

I understand your dilemma because I am in Cali with you and know these machines that you speak of, you take the tickets because if you don't someone else will and the store employee is not going to know what to do because the money can't be refunded and they would probably tell you to do the same thing. TAKE THE TICKETS. LOL

Reply #25

time*treat — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:48:40 GMT

From a strictly legal perspective ... if you found $100, it would be considered taxable income, but the person who lost the $100 couldn't write it off as a loss.

Reply #24

CaliWinner — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:39:57 GMT

Nah, for $4, it's not really worth it ;) I'm not losing sleep over it or anything, LOL.

My husband and I got bored and were discussing the legalities of the situation -- what if we had won, and someone found out that I had taken the $4. Could the person whose four dollars that was, try to sue for part of the winnings, I wonder? Would they have any legal standing? I thought not, since there's no way they could prove that even if they had bought the 4 tickets originally, that the winning ticket... [ More ]

Reply #23

konane — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:34:27 GMT

Reply #22

benmas — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:31:22 GMT

i have no problem with you taking the $4...if the original person was having trouble using the lottery machine than he could have asked the store clerk for help on how to use it ..since they didnt care that much leaving behind $4 then why should you go over all the trouble for returning $4..i mean if it was $50 or $100 then maybe its a different story and you tell somebody but $4 you take it since original owner didnt seem to care or he would have contacted the store himself

Reply #21

spy153 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:26:47 GMT

or, couldn't you have just printed out the credits/tickets (don't know how they work) then give that to the clerk?

Even if the clerk says, go ahead and use it. I would feel better because I at least brought it to someone's attention first. Chances are, though, it could have been a regular that was there and the clerk might have known who it was so as to give it back to them. And if not, and all other options have been exhausted, then there is nothing we can do.

If I went up to some machi... [ More ]

Reply #20

MaddMike51 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:01:23 GMT

Well,you could always go back to the scene of the crime and ask if there was a video camera trained on the lottery machine and if the answer is yes,ask to review the tape and start searching for the person that left the $4 credit so you can repay them and soothe your conciense.

Reply #19

CaliWinner — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:51:07 GMT

No, I know what some of you're saying -- that even if I had won, it wouldn't have necessarily been the same four tickets that they would have gotten if they had actually used the machine correctly. But karmically, I would have known that I had gotten that win through someone else's loss (small though it may be), and I would still have felt guilty about it. Some of you are surely thinking What's the big deal? , I know And I probably would have gotten over it quickly if I had millions of dollars.... [ More ]

Reply #18

RJOh — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:29:49 GMT

What is the ethical dilemma, you see something of value that doesn't belong to you but because you can take it and nobody will know, it's a dilemma? Is it ever ethical to take something that doesn't belong to you thinking if you don't a less ethical person will

Reply #17

time*treat — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:17:31 GMT

Well, it's just a simple fact.

When I want something and,

I don't want to pay for it.

I walk right through the door.

Walk right through the door.

Hey all right! If I get by, it's mine.

Mine all mine

Reply #16

Guru101 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:13:26 GMT

All I could think of, though, for the next couple of days was whatwould happen if I won the Mega Millions jackpot on one of the firstfour rows on the ticket (i.e. on the other person's money). I wouldhave felt guilty about that money for the rest of my life. So...I'mactually kind of glad I didn't win on Tuesday.

Actually, even if they did get their $4 worth when they were at the machine, that wouldn't mean they would have won compared to if they have left $4 in the machine and you would have... [ More ]

Reply #15

jarasan — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:08:16 GMT

I see many lottery errors occur, it could be avoided by reading and understanding how you are using your money. This might explain why so many people get in over their heads when making money decisions for eg. sub-prime mortgages, high credit card rates, unproductive $50k autos, etc., fill in whatever. Do yourself a favor, be informed when you play, know the odds, cost, payout, date of draw, and number of tix. you should have. We may take this for granted but not everybody does. JMO.

Reply #14

pacattack05 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 22:47:59 GMT

I would have felt guilty about that money for the rest of my life. So...I'm actually kind of glad I didn't win on Tuesday.

Don't feel guilty because of other people who weren't paying attention to detail. Secondly, even if the person wasn't careless and used all of the credits, he or she might have not gotten the same combos at that very moment when he or she was buying them. (the winning combos).

People are wreckless all the time.

There was a sign here at a deli I saw years ago which w... [ More ]

Reply #13

CaliWinner — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 22:37:10 GMT

Well, now that some people have posted, I'll go ahead and say what I did: I went ahead and took all 9 of the tickets.

To address some issues that have come up during discussion:

- the person who had put the money in was not standing nearby. If there was anyone nearby, I would have asked them about it, but no one was.

- I personally chose not to contact a store employee because I know from past experience that they have no control over the machine. It's overseen by an outside vendor. So... [ More ]

Reply #12

justxploring — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 22:15:28 GMT

In your situation, I think that was the best choice, but isn't seeing credits in a machine different? When the tickets print, you don't know what he/she would have gotten, so if you had gotten $9 tickets, which ones would you give to the clerks?

We don't have self-service machines either, so I'm not sure how they work.

Reply #11

JAP69 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 22:12:38 GMT

If I seen the actual person using the machine before me leave and have credits left I would bring it to their attention.

Otherwise its mine to use.

Reply #10

Coin Toss — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:57:40 GMT

If the person that had the credits in the machine was still there I'd tell them.

I'd like to say I'd tell the clerks, but what's to say they wouldn't take $4 worth of tickets for themself?

__________________________

This happened at one of the Fremont Street cainos in downtown Vegas and as far as I know it never was settled:

When the poker and slot machines started going to credits instead pf paying tokens into the till with every win a lot of people would walk off, not knowing they... [ More ]

Reply #9

hearsetrax — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:34:57 GMT

take the freebies and run like heck

Reply #8

four4me — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:20:53 GMT

Here's the same analogy only a slightly different place. You walk into a restroom you see a twenty dollar bill on the floor there is no one in the restroom except you do you pocket the money or walk outside the restroom and yell who dropped a twenty in the bathroom.

If theres fifty people in the room that here you yell, I'm willing to bet 20 or more will say it's mine.

Keep the tickets and be on your way.

Reply #7

manofmany — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:08:45 GMT

Well if I don't take it then the store clerk is going to. So, I would take the extra $4.

Reply #6

KY Floyd — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:25:31 GMT

The ethical thing in any analagous situation is to see if you can find the rightful owner. Assuming you can't get a cash refund from the machine and can't readily locate the person who deserves the credit the sensible thing is to get an extra $4 worth of tickets. Leaving the credit almost certainly means that somebody else will use it, and there's no logic in doing that.

The person who left the credit behind only has a claim on the $4, since they never actually bought the tickets, so your onl... [ More ]

Reply #5

spy153 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:25:11 GMT

We don't have those machines here, but I ran into something like that when I bought my mega millions tickets on tuesday. Someone had bought 5 tickets for the Virginia cash 5 and left them on the counter. I gave them back to the clerk and told them the person might be back for their ticket once they realized they had left it behind. If they had been mine and I left them, I would want to know I could come back to the store and claim them.

Reply #4

MaddMike51 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:13:06 GMT

I'd just buy more tickets and keep my mouth shut.

I was in a bar once and looked down at the floor and saw a twenty dollar bill folded in half.I put my foot on it and asked the guy next to me if he lost any money.He said that he had not.I asked him again and told him to check his wallet,to be sure he hadn't lost any money.He checked his wallet and assured me that he had all of his money.So I bent down and picked the money up.Turns out that it was 2 twentys folded in half.All of sudden this gu... [ More ]

Reply #3

justxploring — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:07:25 GMT

I checked other because it all depends on the store. If it's a local store where you are familiar with the clerks, I'd just tell them because that player might return. Maybe I'd take the tickets leave my name number. However, I do agree with Pac Scary that there's probably no way to trace them. If I got an extra $20 from an ATM and my receipt said $20 instead of $40 I would return the money as long as my bank statement didn't reflect the deduction. But this is different, since who is to say that... [ More ]

Reply #2

ThatScaryChick — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:54:51 GMT

I agree with Pac. If there is no way to trace it, who would I contact or give it too? I would probably just buy more tickets.

Reply #1

pacattack05 — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:52:13 GMT

If there was a way to contact the person who left the extra credits in, then I'd say something to the manager, but I highly doubt that person is traceable.

It's like finding a 5 dollar bill on the ground. Are you gonna pick it up and yell out loud...who dropped this money

An Ethical Dilemma...

CaliWinner — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 19:44:35 GMT

This is something I faced over the weekend, and I'm curious to see how some of you would have handled it.

So say you walk up to the automated lottery ticket purchase machine at your nearby grocery store (if you don't have such machines where you live, pretend you do). It's a machine where you can buy Mega Millions tickets, Super Lotto tickets (the state lotto here in CA), etc. You stick your $5 in, with the intention of buying five quick picks for the next Mega Millions drawing. But what's th... [ More ]