Will Gift Tax Apply if Someone Else Claims a Ticket?

Reply #31

Stack47 — Tue, 14 May 2013 05:13:42 GMT

I'm positive once the ticket expires I can't go back a week in time and try to cash it. A lottery ticket whether it's in a the trash basket or in a safe has no value until it's validated by a lottery terminal.

Reply #30

KY Floyd — Tue, 14 May 2013 03:43:02 GMT

What is the value of an unclaimed ticket to the buyer after the expiration point was passed?

According to you it's exactly the same as a week before it expired. Are you really foolish enough to believe that

Reply #29

Stack47 — Mon, 13 May 2013 21:09:53 GMT

What is the value of an unclaimed ticket to the buyer after the expiration point was passed?

You should Google constructive receipt .

I did and it applies to when a person or business receives ownership. In the scenario here, it's an implied ownership the friend or relative will have depending on the circumstances. What is the difference between this implied ownership than a living person's will?

They are buying them lottery tickets in every drawing and expect full compensation for th... [ More ]

Reply #28

KY Floyd — Mon, 13 May 2013 18:06:37 GMT

The instant it has value is the instant a drawing turns it into a winning ticket. Whether the player knows the value or not is irelevant.

You should Google constructive receipt .

Reply #27

PlayToWin47 — Mon, 13 May 2013 17:58:23 GMT

I may want to resort to the easy option that would avoid all the issues with the gift tax ... Just collect all the money myself and write checks to anyone that I want to give a gift to, making sure nobody gets more than the current excluded limit.

I like things easy

Reply #26

Stack47 — Sun, 12 May 2013 01:36:23 GMT

The instant it's known is when it's scanned by a lottery terminal. If you're making an argument that players are responsible to know the value, it took Robert Miles seven years to find out the true value of his lottery ticket.

Reply #25

KY Floyd — Sat, 11 May 2013 05:59:49 GMT

A ticket has value that differs from the selling price the instant it's known to be a winning ticket. Validating it is simply part of the claiming process.

Reply #24

HoLeeKau — Thu, 09 May 2013 22:12:10 GMT

But if OP had to claim all the tickets, the guv could double dip. First OP pays his taxes, then there's an additional 25% due for any gifts he gives over 12K or 13K or whatever it is now. And I believe that extra 25% is OP's responsibility, not the recipient.

Reply #23

PlayToWin47 — Thu, 09 May 2013 22:03:25 GMT

I didn't even think about that. That makes sense

Reply #22

Stack47 — Thu, 09 May 2013 21:26:31 GMT

This isn't a discussion about scratch-off players who you believe should claim their Free Ticket as gambling winnings on their 1040 or be imprisoned for tax evasion.

The value of the gift will be the value of the tickets at the time the gift is made.

Tickets cost $1 or $2 but have zero value before they are validated and I'm pretty sure the idea here is to give them the ticket so they can have it validated.

Reply #21

maelstrom — Thu, 09 May 2013 20:47:08 GMT

I don't think gift tax will be a problem because when your family members claim the prize they will be responsible for paying the taxes on the prize as regular income. The government will get their share.

Reply #20

PlayToWin47 — Thu, 09 May 2013 18:48:21 GMT

Yup ... Correct.

He doesn't even know which tickets he will be giving as gifts until the drawing is held and he learns what each ticket is worth

Exactly

Reply #19

rdgrnr — Thu, 09 May 2013 18:31:06 GMT

Welcome back, Jelly Man!

Glad to see you finally come out of hiding!

And don't worry, that post of mine you were avoiding is well buried by now.

Just like always, just as planned.

Reply #18

KY Floyd — Thu, 09 May 2013 18:07:00 GMT

you are buying those tickets for them based on that condition.

It's really very simple. He's not buying tickets for them. He freely admits it, and it's the only factual conclusion based on his plans. He's making plans to give large gifts if he has the chance to do so. He doesn't even know which tickets he will be giving as gifts until the drawing is held and he learns what each ticket is worth. The value of the gift will be the value of the tickets at the time the gift is made. Paying for th... [ More ]

Reply #17

PlayToWin47 — Thu, 09 May 2013 13:48:51 GMT

Hmm ... interesting

Reply #16

Stack47 — Thu, 09 May 2013 00:41:48 GMT

The problem is, I'm not actually buying the tickets for them.

If you're planning on giving them the secondary prize winning tickets if you win the jackpot, you are buying those tickets for them based on that condition. It might be as simple as them paying you the cost of the ticket.

What is considered a gift?

Any transfer to an individual, either directly or indirectly, where full consideration (measured in money or money's worth) is not received in return.

http://www.irs.gov/Busine... [ More ]

Reply #15

savagegoose — Wed, 08 May 2013 22:34:39 GMT

i have seen families win, and then organize a claim with everyone they want to share as part of the claiming ticket. this was organised by thir advisors. to avoid gift taxes. I cant see seperate tickets being any easier for the tax office to make a claim against than that setup. sure they had lawyers help.

just write good luck and their name on the back of the ticket. let the taxman try and prove anything.

Reply #14

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 19:54:39 GMT

The problem is, I'm not actually buying the tickets for them. They are just a secondary part of my game my system that I'm playing. I'm basically just willing to give them the lesser valued second prize wins should I win the biggie. If I were actually buying them, like for a gift, and giving them away before they won, I would be far less concerned about how this all plays out.

Reply #13

Stack47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 19:27:00 GMT

Initially, it seems obvious that if they claim the ticket, there would not be a problem. However, if someone (the IRS) looks close enough at the numbers and winning date on all of the winning tickets, it would be obvious that they are all part of the same system .

I believe the same rules would apply if you bought tickets for someone or even a group of people and one of the tickets won. Based on what you said, it's obvious your intentions are to buy those tickets for family members. I hope i... [ More ]

Reply #12

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 18:44:40 GMT

For what it's worth...

I have absolutely no problem paying my fair share of taxes, but I have a big problem with paying gift taxes!!! It is totally wrong that the government would want to tax me because I want to give some money to help out family or friends. What business is it of theirs how much I might want to give

Reply #11

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 18:33:54 GMT

...This also means that I win at least a little every drawing ... at least $2 per drawing. If I get (3) white balls ... $122; (4) white balls ... $1400; (5) white balls ... JP + $180,000.

I haven't even played this game for a year, and I've won the $122 twice.

I WOULD HAVE won the $122 another time, and the $1400 once if I hadn't revised my numbers!!! My OLD numbers came up ... GRRRR

Reply #10

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 17:46:12 GMT

That is what I have been reading.

Reply #9

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 17:38:18 GMT

Again ... excellent information concerning trusts ... Thank you!!!

I am quite certain that if I actually do win enough for the gift tax thing to be an issue, I will be talking to tax people and trust lawyers.

Reply #8

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 17:34:19 GMT

Yes, sort of.

Ok ... my system:

I pick 5 white balls, and HB 1 ... same 5 white balls, HB 2 ... all the way through the set ... $19 per drawing. If I get all 5 white balls, I automatically have the HB. I will also have 18 second place wins ... $10,000 per board (unless the lottery people rip me off per the pari-mutual thing). That means that I will have my jackpot ticket, and (3) others worth $40,000 or $50,000 (depending on where the HB is in realtion to that extra 20th board.

Bas... [ More ]

Reply #7

HoLeeKau — Wed, 08 May 2013 16:13:17 GMT

I agree with this. But I'm not an expert. Call a tax professional to make sure.

If you gave them the ticket before the draw, you gave them a gift of $1 or $2 which is well within the limits to avoid gift taxes.

Reply #6

four4me — Wed, 08 May 2013 15:54:35 GMT

no no no no no!

if you buy 100 tickets and they all turn out to be winners your only responsible for the tickets you cash in. if you give 99 of the winning tickets away then the people who received those tickets are responsible for them not you.

Reply #5

savagegoose — Wed, 08 May 2013 15:45:36 GMT

arwe you saying you are buying the same numbers on multiple tickets, and giving those tickets as gifts, if they win? i cant see how the lottery or tax office can determine whe the gift was made, before or after you know the value.

Reply #4

joshuacloak — Wed, 08 May 2013 15:13:26 GMT

for love of god, don't listin to these people like

GASMETERGUY

NASHVILLE, TENN

United States

Member #33768

February 20, 2006

931 Posts

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, or u be paying double taxes, first for claiming,and taxed again for giving away money

just create a trust

have trust CLAIM all tickets

the trust pays the taxes.....................

and trust can be set up to give any amount to whoever u want

as u be creating it,and setting up just like a contr... [ More ]

Reply #3

GASMETERGUY — Wed, 08 May 2013 14:16:47 GMT

Yes, gift taxes would apply. Because of the gift tax, lotteries go to extra length to be positive the person claiming the ticket is the same person who bought the ticket. If you were given a winning ticket, then you have recieved a gift of money and must pay gift taxes.

Reply #2

billionaire2bee — Wed, 08 May 2013 13:51:08 GMT

I dont think so since they are claiming the tickets in each of their own names....now if they wanted to give an amount that would exceed the gift amount i.e. over 13k then they would have to pay extra taxes on that....but not on a ticket they claim in their own name

Reply #1

RedStang — Wed, 08 May 2013 05:13:55 GMT

If their ss # is on it their probably screwed. If your married with a child you can do gift splitting. You and your wife can each give 13k to the kid without taxes. Might be wrong though. Always wondered how giving stocks/bonds work.

Will Gift Tax Apply if Someone Else Claims a Ticket?

PlayToWin47 — Wed, 08 May 2013 03:35:43 GMT

Info...

My system spans more than one playslip / ticket per drawing.

If I win a jackpot, there will be other separate tickets that will also win a sizeable amount, that exceeds the current gift tax exclusion limit.

Question...

If I give those other tickets to family, for them to claim themselves, would that trigger the gift tax BS?

Initially, it seems obvious that if they claim the ticket, there would not be a problem. However, if someone (the IRS) looks close enough at the number... [ More ]