That's all great in theory, but because radical groups like the ACLU has a stranglehold on the courts, we can't do things like call the INS when someone goes to a hospital. The UCLU would sue the hospital!!

If the jerky ACLU weren't around this would be solved a long time ago, but things like the fence are the rare things we can do without coming under the threat of a lawsuit (although I'm sure they'll come up with a lawsuit anyway).

I hope they build that fence QUICKLY.

Thanks, Jack.

I love the diversity of cultures and ethnicities of my neighborhood. I have neighbors walking around in saris and turbans, people cooking and sharing their fajitas, convenience stores owned by Asians selling more varieties of fish than my supermarket with nothing English written on the packaging. I get along well with all of them and when my car is stuck in a snow drift, these people will help push me out. And you know something? We all get along just fine. My Mexican nieghbor and I can hardly communicate. How to solve that? For me to learn a little Spanish and for him to learn a little English...no big deal. If I was stuck in a foxhole fighting off the barbarians, he'd be my first choice to be fighting by my side.

I hope our current "fence mentality" doesn't change the face of our country or the attitudes of all the immigrants who helped to shape it. Concentration on the legal status of our citizens would cost less and be more productive than a fence surrounding our country.

RickG:

Thanks for the comment and the read. I think you could do a lot worse than having that neighbor on your side, rather than a lot of the folks who share your nationality. I agree with you. I also hope it doesn't go further to alienate the country on our border to the south, which happens to be a major source of oil for us. It ain't as though we've ever been a friend to them, but I think the fence mentality might go a lot further than we'd wish toward solidifying enmity.

Jack

Todd:
If the fence will make you feel better I hope you get it. It ain't going to stop any illegal aliens, but it's a nice, expensive gesture and it will give the folks who need those something to cheer about.

Every Friday afternoon at 5 pm you can drive past any of a dozen locations in Albuquerque and see the illegal aliens lined up to cash their paychecks at high fees and buy international money orders to send home. Lines of 500 or more.

A nation that can't figure out where to catch them on Friday afternoon ain't going to figure out how to stop them with a fence.

But I hope you get it anyway if it will make you feel better. Nothing wrong with feeling good.

Jack

Todd:

After thinking a while about your ACLU comments I finally figured out what bothered me about it.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something about the ACLU. My impression is they don't have any power. They're just lawyers, same as any other lawyers, filing lawsuits, defending people who are accused of crimes, or in the case of prosecutors, accusing people of crimes.

Lawyers. Doing what all lawyers do. No power there.

My understanding is that judges hold the power. Judges and juries. Judges appointed by the prez of the US with the advice and consent of Congress. Juries of our peers.

If I've got that right, the ACLU isn't the problem. They see police, prosecutors, someone doing something they believe is illegal. They file lawsuits to try the legality of the matter.

Sounds as though the problem with hospitals not calling the US Immigration Service isn't the ACLU. Sounds as though the problem is with what the laws say and what they don't say hospitals can do when people in the country illegally check in.

But the hospitals were only a tiny piece of what I mentioned. What about the cops when they stop them calling Immigration? MVD? What about cheering because your elected representatives did something REAL such as making it a criminal act to hire illegals, to harbor them, to rent to them?

Those, at least, wouldn't just be feel-good measures. Those would deal with illegal aliens. If they couldn't get jobs, couldn't find a place to live, they'd quit coming here, and the ones here would go home.

Fence?

Nothing at all. Absolutely nothing but a lot of shell game tricks to salve the outcry before the election.

Illusion.

Jack

I think the word "fence" is a euphemism. After all, if you put up a "wall" it keeps the bad people out. A "fence" is just a way to protect your property and not be offensive. Let's call it what it really is. It is a way to say "America is ours. Stay out! If you are on vacation, then c'mon in and spend your money. If you are an investor, please put some of that hard cash here. But if you want to come here to get a job, support your family and do it with dignity and honor, then stay the heck away. This isn't political comment on whether or not I support the structure. They should just call a fence a fence and a wall a wall.

I don't know how I feel about illegals. I'm broke and I resent being asking "do you speak Spanish?" at a job interview. I want the same free medical care as people who haven't lived here for 55 years. I live in a town that is full of millionaires (mostly snowbords) but is also called called Burrito Springs because of the very large Spanish population. My next door neighbor doesn't speak English. She's really trying and says "Hello, Nancy" and her 3 year old waves at me too. She works all day on the porch (called a lanai in FL) making burritos and tamales and then sells them from her van on the other side of town. Her live-in boyfriend/husband (not sure) is a roofer. I think they're here on a work Visa. I never asked. The other day my bell rang. I am not quite sure what she said, but she had a plate full of meat, rice and beans and said "for you. good, not too spicy." I guess the time I went over and almost passed out from the hot stuff made an impression. I smiled because she must have really practiced before she came over. Her 3 year old said "Nancy" and gave me a hug. Her 7 month old daughter in her arms just giggled. Her 9 year old, who lives with her ex (speaks perfect English) asked me to select an item from a catalog & make a contribution since they're raising money for her elementary school. Put blonde hair and blue eyes on all of them and they're your typical American family.

take the cash for the fence and make it reward money

Rick and Jack.....you are open minded nice people who can think rationally. thank you.

fxsterling:

Suppose all the illegal aliens went home today, and no more came.

Which problem the US has would be solved?

Less welfare and health care? Maybe. But in the overall scheme of things just how significant is that?

More outdoor heavy lifting, dirty hands jobs for Americans who don't want them? The people who want those jobs already have them. If others want them they can get them, despite illegals.

So, what precise major problem would be solved if the illegal alien 'problem' were solved this moment?

I'd appreciate hearing your answer.

Jack

fxsterling:

I posted this on the earlier entry in response to your comment there. I guess you must'a didn't come across it.

Jack

Justx:

I've got a feeling if you could boil it all down and scrape what's left on the bottom of the pot up for a close look the blonde hair, blue eye lackinghood on the particular illegal aliens folks are disturbed about would show up as a primary ingredient.

These illegals made the mistake of coming from places where people had too much pigment in their skins to talk good English.

Thanks for the comment.

Shalini:
Thanks for the read and the comment. I agree with you about RickG. As for myself, there's plenty I'm not open-minded about. I appreciate niceness in others, but it's not something I aspire to.

Gracias,
Jack

I can play 2 games in building a home .First contract the work out to any one .Low prices no insurance no taxes no quality and pay some one to clean up the mess and mistakes           The other way is to build the home with experienced professionals    I"m in the middle but for the last 10 years most builder pay less for the trades thanks to the Amigo .That's wrong prices for labor should have gone up. Most people see the trades people as low life's and don't need more cash. As time goes on the trades will become less inviting and filled with poor workmanship we as people don't mind this we are about low prices at any cost             PS I have many buddies that came to the US and forgot to check in   They aren't breaking any laws that are being enforced . TAXES are paid at the check-outs of walmarts that's it      I think the Goverment has no Idea whats going on   THEY DON"T GIVE A S    also yes the US took lots of land from Mexico and this is payback fair enough

fxsterling:
Thanks for the reply. It's an honest and straightforward one. I'm going to think about it a while before I reply to it, assuming I do.
Thanks,
Jack

Fxsterling:

Youâ_Tve made a legitimate point, or several legitimate points.

First off, sloppy workmanship. Itâ_Ts been a lot of years since I worked in construction, but when I did, I saw enough of it to find it alarming. The problem was the result of the lowest-bidder mentality on the part of the folks hiring crews and the need for contractors to somehow milk a living out of the bids theyâ_Td made.

In those days most of the Mexican workers I worked with did work of about the same quality as American workers, but I definitely had to work for a cheaper wage because of them. I recall feeling considerable resentment in that regard. And Iâ_Tll concede that the quality of workmanship of Mexican workers might have declined since then.

Sending all the illegals home, or making it difficult or impossible to find jobs here would definitely help in higher wages for you and other American workers.

However, I canâ_Tt concede that a 700 mile fence will influence it one way or the other. This government has no commitment to enforce immigration laws. If it had, it wouldnâ_Tt need a fence to do it. Finding illegal aliens already here and deporting them would just be entirely too easy to do, and it isnâ_Tt being done. A fence wonâ_Tt stop new ones entering the country, and it wonâ_Tt do anything about the ones already here.

Secondly, I canâ_Tt agree that because we happened to have robbed Mexico of the US southwest, turnabout is fair play. That happened a long time ago, same as robbing and killing off as many Native Americans as got in the way of national expansion.

We live in today, you, and me, this country, Mexican Nationals, Native Americans. Whatâ_Ts done is done and thereâ_Ts no point attempting to make reparations for the sins of our fathers, assuming they were sins.

As I see it, every nation has a right and responsibility to look out for the needs of the citizenry within the national borders, first and foremost. This government has every right, and compelling responsibility, in my view, to assure that the US laborers have the best possible shot at making a living doing the work within that country.

I see your point and agree the government isnâ_Tt fulfilling the responsibility it has to you and others in your trade.

However, I think you and I might part company there. My view is that if illegal aliens constitute a serious problem here, itâ_Ts the responsibility of the elected government and the hired hands in the US Immigration Service to take meaningful actions to solve the problems.

Meaningful actions donâ_Tt include such eyewash as fences. This government doesnâ_Tt hesitate to send a man off to jail for years for possession of some illegal substance. Seems to me, a meaningful approach to the problem is for the government to recognize that the word, â_~illegalâ_T in the phrase, â_~illegal alienâ_T actually means illegal in a real sense.

Harboring a fugitive from justice is a Federal felony. Illegal aliens are fugitives from justice. You and I have to go through all manner of red tape to open bank accounts, rent homes and apartments, buy anything over a given amount, register an automobile, buy insurance.

My point is that illegal aliens arenâ_Tt difficult to locate. Fugitives from justice. Seems to me the only approach that would have any hope of doing anything to deal with illegal aliens involves severely penalizing those who aid them, those who harbor them, those who take advantage of them and what they offer in commerce.

Treating the problem in this way is common in any country where thereâ_Ts a commitment to the responsibility of government to the national labor force. Including Mexico, but almost anywhere else.

Iâ_Tm not opposed to dealing with legitimate problems, whether theyâ_Tre my problem, or not.

What Iâ_Tm opposed to is lies, misrepresentation, farce, trickery, illusion, and sleight of hand. Winks and nods for an electorate before election time.

Gracias. I enjoyed thinking about what you said.

Jack