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Judge orders new trial in Arkansas lottery ticket suit

Topic closed. 102 replies. Last post 5 years ago by KY Floyd.

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rdgrnr's avatar - walt
Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
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Posted: May 26, 2012, 9:28 pm - IP Logged

On top of all this, just how far fetched is the possibility of a man finding a big ticket and fixing some financial problems? The lady in question did exactly the same thing only the circumstances were different. I'm 99.99% sure she was going to fix some financial issues and eat off of that money along with probably helping some people close to her. What else do you do with money? 

Maybe I should be out with my shotgun way "up thar in them thar hills 'a lookin' fer the big elk" that ate the million dollar scratch off that noone's a' claimed yet. I'll find that elk, bust a cap in 'em, cut 'em open a take that thar ticket up in to the lotto peoples for 'a cashin' it!!!! Oh, I gotta clean that thar ticket first, tho', or it'll be plenty unacceptable for 'em.

Yeah, maybe this is more manly and full of pride. Goin' to get my shotgun and buckshots right now I tell ya!!!!! Just you wait...

 

L.L.

Buckshots? Hmmm... You've never been around guns, have ya boy? Buckshots, LOL.

Ya know, Lucky Loser, I've spent time in Texas and I have a brother that lives there and I know a few ol' boys born and raised in Texas. Good ol' boys. 

And you don't sound or act like anybody that's in or from Texas.

And if you were a real Texan and you had something to say to me, you'd say it to me and not play childish rhetorical games while purportedly addressing somebody else.

You'd act like a man.

I think you're more likely from somewhere like California than Texas.

Probably SanFrancisco.


                                             
                     
                                         

 

 

 

 

                                                                                                   

"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"

                                                                                            --Edmund Burke

 

 

    Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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    Posted: May 26, 2012, 11:14 pm - IP Logged

    Buckshots? Hmmm... You've never been around guns, have ya boy? Buckshots, LOL.

    Ya know, Lucky Loser, I've spent time in Texas and I have a brother that lives there and I know a few ol' boys born and raised in Texas. Good ol' boys. 

    And you don't sound or act like anybody that's in or from Texas.

    And if you were a real Texan and you had something to say to me, you'd say it to me and not play childish rhetorical games while purportedly addressing somebody else.

    You'd act like a man.

    I think you're more likely from somewhere like California than Texas.

    Probably SanFrancisco.

    Okay, let's talk ridge...we should. Yeah, I am from Texas and I was born and raised here. This post was merely being sarchastic and havin' a little fun with the buckshots, elk, hills, etc, etc. I'd like to know one thing...just how does a Texan "sound" on a forum? I mean, you're reading my dialogues which are pretty straight forward with simple words...easy to understand. Does a Texan "write" a certain way on forums or what? Really, tell me what characteristics a true Texan possesses on a forum. How does one, in fact, "act" on a forum? 

    So, I'm not a real Texan if I decide to drop dialogues with someone because I see it as pointless and converse with others about my own dialogues? Only Texans do this? Hmmm. Well, a real man wouldn't drag a person's pride and/or their family into such a simple and straight forward conversation about getting lucky with lotto tickets found in a trash can...and a lady that's already done it.

    Also, I made two different posts to two different people and you chose the one about the buckshots. Why? Was the other one too hard to address because it made sense and was true? I mean, there was a lot more there for you to pick through and address. You seem to pick and choose your battles...the easier one's I might add. I could say lots of nasty things about you if I really wanted to but, it's not my style and it's not right. While I've addressed you as ridge all this time everywhere, you've called me boy and hinted at me being feminine or something...I don't know.

    So, what kind of man does those things, ridge? You tell me to act like a man...very interesting.

     

    L.L.

      rdgrnr's avatar - walt
      Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
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      Posted: May 26, 2012, 11:23 pm - IP Logged

      Okay, let's talk ridge...we should. Yeah, I am from Texas and I was born and raised here. This post was merely being sarchastic and havin' a little fun with the buckshots, elk, hills, etc, etc. I'd like to know one thing...just how does a Texan "sound" on a forum? I mean, you're reading my dialogues which are pretty straight forward with simple words...easy to understand. Does a Texan "write" a certain way on forums or what? Really, tell me what characteristics a true Texan possesses on a forum. How does one, in fact, "act" on a forum? 

      So, I'm not a real Texan if I decide to drop dialogues with someone because I see it as pointless and converse with others about my own dialogues? Only Texans do this? Hmmm. Well, a real man wouldn't drag a person's pride and/or their family into such a simple and straight forward conversation about getting lucky with lotto tickets found in a trash can...and a lady that's already done it.

      Also, I made two different posts to two different people and you chose the one about the buckshots. Why? Was the other one too hard to address because it made sense and was true? I mean, there was a lot more there for you to pick through and address. You seem to pick and choose your battles...the easier one's I might add. I could say lots of nasty things about you if I really wanted to but, it's not my style and it's not right. While I've addressed you as ridge all this time everywhere, you've called me boy and hinted at me being feminine or something...I don't know.

      So, what kind of man does those things, ridge? You tell me to act like a man...very interesting.

       

      L.L.

      Could I ignore you later?

      I'm a little busy right now.


                                                   
                           
                                               

       

       

       

       

                                                                                                         

      "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"

                                                                                                  --Edmund Burke

       

       

        Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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        Posted: May 27, 2012, 12:58 am - IP Logged

        Lurking

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          Posted: May 27, 2012, 3:19 am - IP Logged

          Suppose the judge now rules its 50/50, wouldn't that set a precident on how to rule on 'found' tickets going forward? 

           

          Wouldn't that open the flood gates of folks stealing other folks winning tickets and later claiming they 'found' them... and are gladly willing to share 50/50?

          There may be some legitimate question as to who is the rightful owner of the ticket, but it's certain that it isn't owned by more than one person. The people involved in the lawsuit  may settle it 50/50 or some other split, and the judge may encourage them to reach a compromise, but he's extremely unlikely to rule that the ticket's history has somehow resulted in shared ownership.

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            NY
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            Posted: May 27, 2012, 3:26 am - IP Logged

            Well some things to think about here are....applying a reasonable person standard.

             

            1.) Would a reasonable person have thrown away such a  high value ticket...no.

            2.) Was she negligent/or did she have an intent to abandon in throwing away the ticket? Probably not (unless the time period to claim had run).  I doubt anyone plays not to win.

            3.) is is possible the scanner misfunctioned?  Yes.

            But I am pulling for the finder as well.  It kind of reminds me of situations when someone gets rid of something (a painting, etc.) and it turns out to be high value.  In those cases (and usually where the ultimate owner is far removed from the orignal owner), it is usually finders keepers (unless there was some intent to deceive the owner or theft.)

            1. A reasonable person wouldn't throw away a ticket that they know to be that valuable, but reasonable people throw away what they believe are losing tickets all the time.

            2. It seems clear that she intended to abandon the ticket, but only because she thought it wasn't a winner.

            3. I'm guessing operator error is more likely, but I don't think it matters since I think it's clear that she thought the ticket wasn't a winner.

            If she had accidentally thrown the ticket in the garbage while throwing away tickets that really were losers there wouldn't have been an intent to abandon it. In that case it would be misplaced property and she would still be the rightful owner. Since it's clear that she intended to abandon the ticket the decision should turn on whether or not her mistaken belief that it was a losing ticket matters. I don't especially think that a mistake about the value of an item that is willfully and intentionally abandoned matters, but the law about lost and misplaced property is about  preserving a person's ownership when they make a mistake. If there isn't statutory law or precedent that is relevant to the particular facts of this case I don't think the judge can be faulted for ruling in favor of the original purchaser or the finder. A ruling for the manager is also reasonable, if the store owner granted her ownership of tickets reclaimed from the store's trash.

              Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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              Posted: May 27, 2012, 9:14 am - IP Logged

              1. A reasonable person wouldn't throw away a ticket that they know to be that valuable, but reasonable people throw away what they believe are losing tickets all the time.

              2. It seems clear that she intended to abandon the ticket, but only because she thought it wasn't a winner.

              3. I'm guessing operator error is more likely, but I don't think it matters since I think it's clear that she thought the ticket wasn't a winner.

              If she had accidentally thrown the ticket in the garbage while throwing away tickets that really were losers there wouldn't have been an intent to abandon it. In that case it would be misplaced property and she would still be the rightful owner. Since it's clear that she intended to abandon the ticket the decision should turn on whether or not her mistaken belief that it was a losing ticket matters. I don't especially think that a mistake about the value of an item that is willfully and intentionally abandoned matters, but the law about lost and misplaced property is about  preserving a person's ownership when they make a mistake. If there isn't statutory law or precedent that is relevant to the particular facts of this case I don't think the judge can be faulted for ruling in favor of the original purchaser or the finder. A ruling for the manager is also reasonable, if the store owner granted her ownership of tickets reclaimed from the store's trash.

              These are very, very good points you've made. The third sentence in your paragraph is where the judge should focus his questioning on this case. I say this because of the one point I've already established which is this: She said she scanned the ticket and the scanner diplayed a "no winner" obviously. But, she FIRST had an OPPORTUNITY and RESPONSIBILITY to READ and PROPERLY UNDERSTAND how to PLAY and WIN on this particular game.

              Had she done all these things, in the order listed, she woud've clearly known that she had a winning ticket in her hands REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE SCANNER DISPLAYED. This way, her claim of a scanner malfunction would be bullet proof and hold the seven seas (water)! As it currently stands, it appears she didn't know she had a winner due to her failure to properly interpret the ticket...and she tossed it. Then, another person came along who knew exactly how to interpret the ticket, did so, and proceeded to claim the winnings abandoned by someone else.

              Everything else with the ticket being in the trash can on the store's property is really just red tape and a bunch of BULLSH*T. People check cans every day all day and find small wins which are NEVER disputed. This is a high level trash can find of a scratch ticket. If it were a $1 find, it would've never made anybody's news and Sharon Jones would've simply been be $1 richer. Mrs. Duncan would've thought the $1 find was "cute" at best. 

              Trust me Floyd, it's all about the amount...nothing else. Money talks. Very good post.

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                kings mountain
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                Posted: May 27, 2012, 9:26 am - IP Logged

                I think both of these people would be better off if they privately agreed to split the prize money.  By the time all these lawsuits and appeals are finished, there will be no prize left to award, because the lawyers will have it all.

                Sue the scanner...it said, "not a winner"..unless we have another case of a crooked clerk.

                  Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                  Posted: May 27, 2012, 9:37 am - IP Logged

                  As a side note regarding the scanner, I think they should go back to the same store with the winning ticket and scan it again. If it scanned as a no winner the first time, it should still do it now as the ticket bar code should still be consistent. For that matter, try scanning it on several.


                  L.L.


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                    Posted: May 27, 2012, 10:14 am - IP Logged

                    As a side note regarding the scanner, I think they should go back to the same store with the winning ticket and scan it again. If it scanned as a no winner the first time, it should still do it now as the ticket bar code should still be consistent. For that matter, try scanning it on several.


                    L.L.

                    Excellent suggestion L.L.

                    I also have my doubts if the ticket was ever actually scanned to begin with. In either case, your idea makes a lot of sense.   Idea

                    Hopefully the judge in this case is reading this post as we speak.  Smash

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                      Kentucky
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                      Posted: May 27, 2012, 10:20 am - IP Logged

                      Oh, I understand exactly where YOU'RE coming from, STACK...and have no issues with it at all. My thing is that since the inception of discussing how a couple of us have since found tickets with prizes, IT JUST NOW BECAME ALL NASTY AND DISGUSTING...AS OPPOSED TO BEFORE NOW when the topic was originally posted. Feel me now? I'm just trying to keep it clean so it doesn't get out of hand. 

                      If it's all nasty and disgusting now, as it's been said, it should've been so when this topic first came about. You're okay, buddy. Hey, she found all that money doing what she wanted to do. Seems to me she kicked pride to the curb and it payed off!!! Her only mistake was that she spoke about it.


                      L.L.

                      I'm pretty sure anyone reading the first article thought about dumpster diving, but I would have to wear a hazmat suit to go into go into the bins I saw. Lots of stores have areas where players scratch tickets and throw the losing tickets into waste baskets, but who knows what else they throw or spit into those baskets. And those waste baskets are still inside the store where the "finders keepers" rule doesn't apply.

                      Jones did find something valuable doing something the majority of us wouldn't consider doing and hadn't she bragged about it, she could be spending the money as we speak. The lesson learned here is, if you want to be a dumpster diver, don't tell anyone what you found.

                        Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                        Posted: May 27, 2012, 10:39 am - IP Logged

                        Excellent suggestion L.L.

                        I also have my doubts if the ticket was ever actually scanned to begin with. In either case, your idea makes a lot of sense.   Idea

                        Hopefully the judge in this case is reading this post as we speak.  Smash

                        Yep, treat it just like a crime scene and go back to where everything initially took place. Pull the surveillance tape if there's one on file for that date and ckeck the footage so see if Mrs. Duncan scanned her ticket. If she did, then zoom in on the scanner to see what it displayed if possible. If she didn't scan it, then we have a case of clear misinterpretation on the player's part and it's her own fault.


                        L.L.

                          Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                          Posted: May 27, 2012, 10:43 am - IP Logged

                          I'm pretty sure anyone reading the first article thought about dumpster diving, but I would have to wear a hazmat suit to go into go into the bins I saw. Lots of stores have areas where players scratch tickets and throw the losing tickets into waste baskets, but who knows what else they throw or spit into those baskets. And those waste baskets are still inside the store where the "finders keepers" rule doesn't apply.

                          Jones did find something valuable doing something the majority of us wouldn't consider doing and hadn't she bragged about it, she could be spending the money as we speak. The lesson learned here is, if you want to be a dumpster diver, don't tell anyone what you found.

                          I'm with you on everything here and there are places I refuse to check for tickets...I do have limitations. Your very last sentence is TOPS!


                          L.L.


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                            Posted: May 27, 2012, 10:48 am - IP Logged

                            Yep, treat it just like a crime scene and go back to where everything initially took place. Pull the surveillance tape if there's one on file for that date and ckeck the footage so see if Mrs. Duncan scanned her ticket. If she did, then zoom in on the scanner to see what it displayed if possible. If she didn't scan it, then we have a case of clear misinterpretation on the player's part and it's her own fault.


                            L.L.

                            Good material for the next episode of CSI, but we ALSO need a murder to take place. Any hit men on this site?  Chair

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                              Kentucky
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                              Posted: May 27, 2012, 11:01 am - IP Logged

                              As a side note regarding the scanner, I think they should go back to the same store with the winning ticket and scan it again. If it scanned as a no winner the first time, it should still do it now as the ticket bar code should still be consistent. For that matter, try scanning it on several.


                              L.L.

                              http://myarkansaslottery.com/games/1000000-diamond-dazzler-game-no-087

                              There is a row of "winning numbers" and a row of "your numbers" and two of the numbers matched and the prize under the number was "$1 million". The ticket showed it was a winner regardless what the clerk said and Duncan was only 35 miles from the claims center in Little Rock. Duncan probably bought and scanned a losing ticket, but I don't believed she discarded the winning ticket unless she is abnormally stupid.