Court hears arguments on $559M lottery winner's plea to remain anonymous

Feb 14, 2018, 9:55 am (81 comments)

Powerball

NASHUA, N.H. — The mystery woman in possession of the winning $560 million Powerball ticket purchased last month in Merrimack, New Hampshire, is highly stressed and is preparing to have security guards in place should her name be revealed, according to her lawyers.

"She doesn't want to be a celebrity," said William Shaheen of Shaheen and Gordon law firm. Shaheen said his client, who has filed a lawsuit against the New Hampshire Lottery Commission seeking to keep her identity a secret even though she signed the back of the winning ticket, is entitled to her money and has already created The Good Karma Family Trust of 2018.

The problem, however, is that she signed the back of the ticket, which is now a public document, argues Assistant Attorney General John Conforti.

"When you win this kind of money, you realize you have responsibilities. A lot of people think it is just glitter -- there is a lot of stress involved," said Shaheen.

He said the winner is prepared if the judge does not rule in her favor and orders that the back of the ticket with her signature becomes public. According to Shaheen, security guards are queued and ready to begin duty if she loses her court case.

"You have to understand, this ticket is the most valuable piece of paper on the planet Earth," said Charles McIntyre, executive director of the New Hampshire Lottery Commission.

McIntyre said the commission does want to work with the winner and is prepared to allow the funds to be assigned to a trust and transferred. It will be up to the court to decide whether the ticket with the winner's signature becomes public under several Right-to-Know requests already received by the commission.

"She has unlimited choices in life now," McIntyre said of the woman, adding the winner must first learn how to say 'No.'

He also suggested that if Judge Charles Temple dismisses the lawsuit as requested by the commission and the woman's name does become public that she hold a press conference to answer questions from the media.

He stressed that the $560 million prize is the public's money that has been collected from 45 other jurisdictions around the nation.

"It is our biggest win ever," he said of New Hampshire, adding that while he is not downplaying the woman's desire for privacy, she now has no financial worries — ever.

Attorneys for both sides argued the merits of the case on Tuesday at Hillsborough County Superior Court; the winner was not present in the courtroom.

"We come to the court today in a Catch 22, not in our own making," said attorney Steven Gordon, representing the winner. He said his client followed the commission's instructions and signed her name and hometown on the ticket, essentially losing her right to anonymity, which could have been avoided if she had first assigned it to a trust.

Now, the woman known in court records as Jane Doe wants to cash in her ticket, he said, adding the ticket and the prize sits in limbo pending a court ruling on whether she can keep her identity private.

Gordon maintains that if her name is revealed, she could be subject to harassment, annoyance and possibly threats or violence.

"The lottery thrives on transparency," argued Conforti. He said taxpayers need to know that the commission is running the games in an appropriate manner with integrity and fairness.

The ticket is a public document, and the commission believes that it is best to be transparent with the lottery process so that the public can see that winners are not connected to the lottery or the state, or that winners are not in clusters or related, according to Conforti.

"We have a substantial public interest in disclosure of those public documents," he said, adding Doe is asking for a substantial extension of privacy protection under the state's Right-to-Know law.

(See NH Lottery Commission wants Powerball winner's lawsuit dismissed, citing Right-to-Know Law, Lottery Post, Feb. 13, 2018.)

Still, Gordon argued that the commission has nothing to do with the Powerball game, explaining that it is handled by the Multi-State Lottery Association, and that disclosure of her identity will reveal nothing about the commission's activities.

Union Leader

Comments

noise-gate

The more l read about this case, the more l see it as a circus. Stress? Is that a freaking joke or what! Millions of players have lost boatloads of money over the decades hoping to win any jackpot. Players have quit the game for good because of continued disappointment, and her lawyer is talking about Stress? Classic BS

Bleudog101

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 14, 2018

The more l read about this case, the more l see it as a circus. Stress? Is that a freaking joke or what! Millions of players have lost boatloads of money over the decades hoping to win any jackpot. Players have quit the game for good because of continued disappointment, and her lawyer is talking about Stress? Classic BS

Please Judge, dismiss this without prejudice.  It is getting old and now the vultures have really been keeping a keen eye on this case.

CDanaT's avatarCDanaT

Tough call (imho). I more than understand the rules and they are crystal clear on making the claim.

For her personal safety, I am all for that 110%.

I believe ,like all of us, we have heard "sign the back of your ticket" for years and years. Those of us that post on here, know undoubtedly, that with this massive win requires discretion, professional legal guidance and sound decision making prior to making the claim.

I was a bit curious about safety tips that the lottery posts on the TEXAS state website, so I went and took a gander:

www.txlottery.org/export/sites/lottery/Winners/Player_Protection/Security_Spotlight/index.html

The third line down says, " Sign your tickets upon receipt"

So then being a bit more curious I went to the FAQ section and here is what is posted there:

www.txlottery.org/export/sites/lottery/FAQ/index.html

WHAT SHOULD I DO WHEN I PURCHASE MY TICKETS ?

ANS: "Check your ticket(s) upon receipt to ensure they are correct and they are the ticket(s) you intended to purchase. Sign Your Ticket upon receipt" <-- Notice the caps on sign your ticket

There was an informative reply in the question of 

If I join a group of players, can more than one person claim a prize on the same ticket

No. The Texas Lottery Commission will pay only one claimant per ticket. A “claimant” can be an individual, a trust, a partnership, a corporation, or any other legal entity. The way in which you claim a prize cannot be changed after the ticket is validated and the prize is paid; therefore, careful consideration and professional advice, including but not limited to legal or financial advice, is recommended before the prize is claimed, especially for larger prizes or those prizes that are paid by installments. If you choose to claim the prize as a trust, partnership, or other legal entity, the legal documents that create the legal entity must be submitted for review to the Texas Lottery's Legal Services Division before claiming your prize. This is required to ensure the documents comply with the State Lottery Act and the Commission’s administrative rules. If you claim your prize as any entity other than an individual, a Federal Employer Identification Number (FEIN) is required.

Notice the difference between "sign your ticket upon receipt" and "careful consideration..legal or financial advice is recommended..  I know they are in 2 separate questions but some of the longer statement could apply to the what I do when I purchase my tickets.

 

In closing, while I understand her requests for privacy and possible misunderstanding of rules. She didn't complete a full research of the legal options available and she will have to endure public scrutiny, I believe. 

Thank goodness Texas allows us to claim anonymous on prizes of $1 Million or more   Thumbs Up

Just my 2 pennies worth on this article as written.

rcbbuckeye's avatarrcbbuckeye

If she had just claimed her money it would be done with. Who remembers past jackpot winners? Frankly, most winners that had bad things happen to them was the result of already hanging around bad characters, or blabbing themselves of winning a jackpot.

I find it kind of funny that the more she fights this, the more notoriety she's bringing on herself, especially if she loses the case.

NJJim's avatarNJJim

Unfortunately, the publicity of this case has dropped so many hints as to who is person is, you could probably just go local and ask the average citizen.  "A person active in the community"... come on! Nice to fight for your rights, but know when the fight is over.  Yes, you will have to move, or shore up your security for yourself and your family.  Every person that has become wealthy the old fashion way has had to do that.   The lottery folks will drag this on because its not their personal money, and they'll have to face the legal action that might come their way by previous winners that had to disclose.  I often wonder how I would react, where I would live, how I would fend off even the close relatives and friends.  But I never considered refusing to take the cash! take the cash!

Coin Toss's avatarCoin Toss

Maybe she is the real "Steve Player.'......

Green laugh

music*'s avatarmusic*

I Agree! CDanaT,  She should have known the rules before playing. Each State is different.

 Texas is now the seventh State to allow winners anonymity. Congratulations to Texas Lottery Players!

music* 

jacintasc

Quote: Originally posted by music* on Feb 14, 2018

I Agree! CDanaT,  She should have known the rules before playing. Each State is different.

 Texas is now the seventh State to allow winners anonymity. Congratulations to Texas Lottery Players!

music* 

I've never heard of this? If true I think it's great. But when did  become state law?

Tony Numbers's avatarTony Numbers

I'll claim the ticket for her for a ten percent commission.

music*'s avatarmusic*

Quote: Originally posted by jacintasc on Feb 14, 2018

I've never heard of this? If true I think it's great. But when did  become state law?

jacintasc, I have heard this since January 1, 2018. Winners of more than a million dollars may claim anonymously.  You could probably find more if you search Texas Lottery.com or such sites.

I am here in Fresno, CA but have lottery players in Texas who have told me this.

music*

Suzy-Dittlenose

With all this excessive commotion she has guaranteed herself more attention.  And with that attention will come more of the bad elements of shady characters and scam artists who deliberately hunt down lottery winners.  What a mess this has devolved into....

 

Surrender 

Bleudog101

Quote: Originally posted by Suzy-Dittlenose on Feb 14, 2018

With all this excessive commotion she has guaranteed herself more attention.  And with that attention will come more of the bad elements of shady characters and scam artists who deliberately hunt down lottery winners.  What a mess this has devolved into....

 

Surrender 

My point exactly.  Take a look @ the TV shows 'Lottery changed my life' and the other one 'Lottery dream home' or something like that.  We've never heard any harm coming to those folks, though I don't think they're wise having their first and last names splattered on the oversize check.  In retrospect the shows could have blurred or whited out the last names.

Suzy-Dittlenose

I just checked the population number for the town she lives in.  As of 2010 the population was 25,494 people.  That's a small town and soon everyone will know who she is.  You can't hide in small towns very well.   Perhaps she should buy the entire block she lives on and then build a wall around it....(grin).  Or, move to Mayberry where sheriff Andy Taylor and Barney Fife hang out....

LOL

sailmumm

Quote: Originally posted by Bleudog101 on Feb 14, 2018

Please Judge, dismiss this without prejudice.  It is getting old and now the vultures have really been keeping a keen eye on this case.

I have to ask....have you won a large jackpot or maybe worked for a State Lottery?  If you have then you do know her concerns a valid.  It seems that by following advice she shot herself in the foot by signing the ticket.  I have been involved with a HUGE win and the vultures are indeed circling.

lejardin's avatarlejardin

Well I am kind of looking at what IF she is successful and in time this changes the claiming anonymously issue for all of us?  She may have made a mistake by signing her name before doing her research but if just one Judge realizes how such a major win can impact a persons life for the negative rules in her favor won't we all benefit?

eddessaknight's avatareddessaknight

Quote: Originally posted by lejardin on Feb 14, 2018

Well I am kind of looking at what IF she is successful and in time this changes the claiming anonymously issue for all of us?  She may have made a mistake by signing her name before doing her research but if just one Judge realizes how such a major win can impact a persons life for the negative rules in her favor won't we all benefit?

I Agree!

ABSOLUTELY!!!

 

Bonne Chance
Eddessa_Knight with Lucky Light for All Sun Smiley

Artist77's avatarArtist77

Quote: Originally posted by eddessaknight on Feb 14, 2018

I Agree!

ABSOLUTELY!!!

 

Bonne Chance
Eddessa_Knight with Lucky Light for All Sun Smiley

I agree but I hope they don't over focus on the anonymous issue. The first issue/issue of first impression is that she followed the published lottery rules which said sign your ticket. By doing so, this automatically meant she could not claim anonymously. It is misleading and deceptive to the average lottery player. This needs to be clarified in the rules.

grwurston's avatargrwurston

Why did she sign the ticket?

A lottery ticket is a bearer instrument. Anyone possessing a winning ticket can claim it. 

By signing it, she proved it was hers.

Now everyone here at LP may know what to do if it was them, but anytime there is a huge jackpot people come out of the wood work to buy a ticket hoping to get lucky. A lot of these people have no idea how to even go about checking their numbers to see if they won anything, (which explains the self checkers in the stores) let alone knowing the different legalities involved in claiming a jackpot.

So if the lottery office tells them to sign the ticket in case you lose it, they are going to listen to them. Yeah, I know. How can anyone lose a $559 million winning ticket?  People lose their car keys, wallets, glasses, earrings, etc every day right?  Stranger things have happened...

Coin Toss's avatarCoin Toss

Maybe she's already been threatened, noy by name but by photo recognition. 

When you [;au lotto you are omn a surveillance camera. 

Just a thought.

LottoFanBoy

Everybody knows the rules beforehand. If you don't agree with them, why the F do you play? What she is just accomplishing is bringing more attention to her.

jacintasc

The attorney is taking a risk. Because she has 2 options

 

  1. Claim the ticket in her name
  2. Tell the lottery no thank you, but my privacy is not worth all these millions

 

So,  is the attorney just toying with her and knows she has to claim it in her name so that he gets paid??

No attorney in the USA actually cares about their client. They care about the paycheck. Because he has bills too.

 

You can't claim it in a trust now because the ticket cannot be altered otherwise it is VOID.

 

Homegirl, can't change state law. Like many people mentioned on here, why the heck did she play? Was she making a donation to the state?

msharkey2001's avatarmsharkey2001

Quote: Originally posted by sailmumm on Feb 14, 2018

I have to ask....have you won a large jackpot or maybe worked for a State Lottery?  If you have then you do know her concerns a valid.  It seems that by following advice she shot herself in the foot by signing the ticket.  I have been involved with a HUGE win and the vultures are indeed circling.

BS

Artist77's avatarArtist77

Quote: Originally posted by jacintasc on Feb 14, 2018

The attorney is taking a risk. Because she has 2 options

 

  1. Claim the ticket in her name
  2. Tell the lottery no thank you, but my privacy is not worth all these millions

 

So,  is the attorney just toying with her and knows she has to claim it in her name so that he gets paid??

No attorney in the USA actually cares about their client. They care about the paycheck. Because he has bills too.

 

You can't claim it in a trust now because the ticket cannot be altered otherwise it is VOID.

 

Homegirl, can't change state law. Like many people mentioned on here, why the heck did she play? Was she making a donation to the state?

Attorneys do not work for free. No one works for free and everyone expects to be paid for their work. He can accompany her but he cannot claim in her name and leave her at home.

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on Feb 14, 2018

Maybe she's already been threatened, noy by name but by photo recognition. 

When you [;au lotto you are omn a surveillance camera. 

Just a thought.

All of this could have been avoided, if our mystery winner showed up as Dr Zira.

jacintasc

Quote: Originally posted by Artist77 on Feb 14, 2018

Attorneys do not work for free. No one works for free and everyone expects to be paid for their work. He can accompany her but he cannot claim in her name and leave her at home.

I think you misunderstand. What I am saying is that her attorney knows that in order for him to get paid for his legal services, she has no other option but to claim the prize in a normal fashion like any other winner would.

TheGameGrl's avatarTheGameGrl

Hmmm...pro bono work still exists. Though not in this case. 

I do volunteer ...and I get paid in gratitude by the teens who are seeking guidance in studies. Some of us humans invest without a paycheck attached. 

This lady doesn't have a gun to her head forcing her to not claiming it. She is choosing to be that unicorn who is going to miraculously change a law simply by saying how much her ticket is worth. 

I'm rooting for the state to have it dismissed.

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by TheGameGrl on Feb 14, 2018

Hmmm...pro bono work still exists. Though not in this case. 

I do volunteer ...and I get paid in gratitude by the teens who are seeking guidance in studies. Some of us humans invest without a paycheck attached. 

This lady doesn't have a gun to her head forcing her to not claiming it. She is choosing to be that unicorn who is going to miraculously change a law simply by saying how much her ticket is worth. 

I'm rooting for the state to have it dismissed.

Hear hear!

lejardin's avatarlejardin

These jackpots have been increasing substantially over the years and what worked once years ago does not apply now.  Everyone knows the frenzy grows as the jackpots grow.  And yes, I am one who wants anonymity so I think this issue needs to be changed to protect winners identities.  Maybe at least give the winner the option.

Coin Toss's avatarCoin Toss

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 14, 2018

All of this could have been avoided, if our mystery winner showed up as Dr Zira.

Green laugh

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"Who remembers past jackpot winners?"

People who want their money. Especially people who want their money and aren't overly fussy about how they get it.

"so many hints as to who is person is"

If you think you've seen useful clues about who she is I've got a bridge that I'll sell you for cheap. Her lawyer knows the law isn't on her side so he's doing his best to win with BS. "The Good Karma Family Trust"? You need some pretty high boots to wade through the pile he's offering up. For the claim about being active in the community to be true all that's necessary is going to church on Easter or voting in a school board election. Or maybe even just getting some exercise in the community.

"the town she lives in"

What makes you think you know where she lives? Based on everything I've read the lottery hasn't even seen the ticket yet. Even if they have they haven't released any information. That means the only thing we know is where the ticket was sold. For all we know the winner is a man who live 40 miles away, and decided that it would be advantageous to self-identify as a woman for a while.

"if just one Judge realizes how such a major win can impact a persons life"

That's completely irrelevant. The legal argument is about releasing the winner's name as indicated by the name signed on the ticket, or releasing the name of a different legal entity that the prize is assigned to. The judge has to rule based on the law, and the law seems to be very clear. Based on the argument that the ticket can't be altered and is a public document I don't even see any wiggle room for a ruling that the name of the trust is functionally equivalent to the name of the actual person in terms of identifying the winner.

I had considered that the lottery might try to help her out by offering a barely adequate defense against the lawsuit, but it now appears that they're going for the win. That means that on the off chance the judge doesn't offer a sound legal argument that fits within the law we can expect an appeal.

jacintasc

I have a solution.

 

I will gladly change my name to hers and claim the prize. I will also be glad to be photographed as I spend MY millions. And she can change her name to mine and lead the private life she desires.

Bleudog101

Quote: Originally posted by KY Floyd on Feb 15, 2018

"Who remembers past jackpot winners?"

People who want their money. Especially people who want their money and aren't overly fussy about how they get it.

"so many hints as to who is person is"

If you think you've seen useful clues about who she is I've got a bridge that I'll sell you for cheap. Her lawyer knows the law isn't on her side so he's doing his best to win with BS. "The Good Karma Family Trust"? You need some pretty high boots to wade through the pile he's offering up. For the claim about being active in the community to be true all that's necessary is going to church on Easter or voting in a school board election. Or maybe even just getting some exercise in the community.

"the town she lives in"

What makes you think you know where she lives? Based on everything I've read the lottery hasn't even seen the ticket yet. Even if they have they haven't released any information. That means the only thing we know is where the ticket was sold. For all we know the winner is a man who live 40 miles away, and decided that it would be advantageous to self-identify as a woman for a while.

"if just one Judge realizes how such a major win can impact a persons life"

That's completely irrelevant. The legal argument is about releasing the winner's name as indicated by the name signed on the ticket, or releasing the name of a different legal entity that the prize is assigned to. The judge has to rule based on the law, and the law seems to be very clear. Based on the argument that the ticket can't be altered and is a public document I don't even see any wiggle room for a ruling that the name of the trust is functionally equivalent to the name of the actual person in terms of identifying the winner.

I had considered that the lottery might try to help her out by offering a barely adequate defense against the lawsuit, but it now appears that they're going for the win. That means that on the off chance the judge doesn't offer a sound legal argument that fits within the law we can expect an appeal.

KY Floyd...an excellent post, best one I've read so far!

 

My thought was way before any of this when it said NH won was that someone crossed the border from Massachusetts and had the winning ticket.  Many New Hampshire residents have won big time on Mass. scratch tickets.  That's what provoked my thought process that maybe the winners were reversed.

 

You are correct, I think, that she may not be from that town.  Look how many times truckers drive through states and won lotteries.

 

$8 won on PB last night, and $26 on KY Cashball 225, good thing, my balance was zero!

Long Odds

Quote: Originally posted by rcbbuckeye on Feb 14, 2018

If she had just claimed her money it would be done with. Who remembers past jackpot winners? Frankly, most winners that had bad things happen to them was the result of already hanging around bad characters, or blabbing themselves of winning a jackpot.

I find it kind of funny that the more she fights this, the more notoriety she's bringing on herself, especially if she loses the case.

"Who remembers past jackpot winners?" Those that would do a winner harm, try to scam them, get a piece of the winnings through nefarious means, etc.  There are plenty of stories of winners being harmed in various ways, even being killed solely as a result of a win (some for large amounts and some for more modest amounts). I'd venture to say that there are tens of thousands of attempts to contact winners of a prize of this size- all those people remember the winner (not for a minute, a day, months, a year- they remember forever).

Long Odds

Quote: Originally posted by KY Floyd on Feb 15, 2018

"Who remembers past jackpot winners?"

People who want their money. Especially people who want their money and aren't overly fussy about how they get it.

"so many hints as to who is person is"

If you think you've seen useful clues about who she is I've got a bridge that I'll sell you for cheap. Her lawyer knows the law isn't on her side so he's doing his best to win with BS. "The Good Karma Family Trust"? You need some pretty high boots to wade through the pile he's offering up. For the claim about being active in the community to be true all that's necessary is going to church on Easter or voting in a school board election. Or maybe even just getting some exercise in the community.

"the town she lives in"

What makes you think you know where she lives? Based on everything I've read the lottery hasn't even seen the ticket yet. Even if they have they haven't released any information. That means the only thing we know is where the ticket was sold. For all we know the winner is a man who live 40 miles away, and decided that it would be advantageous to self-identify as a woman for a while.

"if just one Judge realizes how such a major win can impact a persons life"

That's completely irrelevant. The legal argument is about releasing the winner's name as indicated by the name signed on the ticket, or releasing the name of a different legal entity that the prize is assigned to. The judge has to rule based on the law, and the law seems to be very clear. Based on the argument that the ticket can't be altered and is a public document I don't even see any wiggle room for a ruling that the name of the trust is functionally equivalent to the name of the actual person in terms of identifying the winner.

I had considered that the lottery might try to help her out by offering a barely adequate defense against the lawsuit, but it now appears that they're going for the win. That means that on the off chance the judge doesn't offer a sound legal argument that fits within the law we can expect an appeal.

Posted my response before reading further and seeing this post. You obviously are knowledgeable. Do you think because the NH Lottery posted instructions on their website as to what actions a winner should take that they were in some way providing legal guidance and assuming a role that they should not have could possibly factor into a positive outcome for the winner? This is the only avenue I can fathom would have any shot but I am not in the legal field. Thanks.

rcbbuckeye's avatarrcbbuckeye

Quote: Originally posted by Long Odds on Feb 15, 2018

Posted my response before reading further and seeing this post. You obviously are knowledgeable. Do you think because the NH Lottery posted instructions on their website as to what actions a winner should take that they were in some way providing legal guidance and assuming a role that they should not have could possibly factor into a positive outcome for the winner? This is the only avenue I can fathom would have any shot but I am not in the legal field. Thanks.

There are probably a few that would try to scam or harm a winner for their money.

Again, people that got into trouble after winning a jackpot are usually ones that couldn't keep quiet, that blabbed about it, and, or hung out with a bad crowd of "friends".

Yes, if I won a huge jackpot, I would claim anonymously. But, before Texas changed the law, I certainly wouldn't have been afraid to claim a jackpot with people finding out about it. It's being smart and not going out of my way to attract attention to myself.

To each...his own.

zephbe's avatarzephbe

Suppose it is not 'her' ticket.  Suppose it is a lottery pool ticket and she doesn't want to share.  Something about this case isn't right.  She can get the money and move.  She's making too much fuss about something that could have been over.

CDanaT's avatarCDanaT

Quote: Originally posted by rcbbuckeye on Feb 15, 2018

There are probably a few that would try to scam or harm a winner for their money.

Again, people that got into trouble after winning a jackpot are usually ones that couldn't keep quiet, that blabbed about it, and, or hung out with a bad crowd of "friends".

Yes, if I won a huge jackpot, I would claim anonymously. But, before Texas changed the law, I certainly wouldn't have been afraid to claim a jackpot with people finding out about it. It's being smart and not going out of my way to attract attention to myself.

To each...his own.

I Agree!

Caution and Discretion:

Simple words to consider, difficult for some to follow.

jacintasc

Is Todd monitoring these threads? Because I have a question. There are true anonymous states. And then there are states that allow to "claim anonymously". There is a difference in a true anonymous state which is state law and a lottery commission that allowed the winners name not to be published.

 

I hope someone out there understands what I am saying. Because California allowed a winner to claim anonymously in the past, but it is NOT a anonymous state. It has to do with state law.

 

So Todd, can you publish the TRUE anonymous states? Thank you.

Redd55

Did the guy who was murdered in front of his kids in Atlanta go out of his way to attract attention? I dont think so. He won about $400k plus which wasnt enough for him to quit his job and move. 

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by zephbe on Feb 15, 2018

Suppose it is not 'her' ticket.  Suppose it is a lottery pool ticket and she doesn't want to share.  Something about this case isn't right.  She can get the money and move.  She's making too much fuss about something that could have been over.

" Not her ticket, doesn't want to share with the rest of the lottery pool? " How do you spell extremely unlikely. The idea that the other members of the pool would be silent, while this circus goes about it's business is...

Stack47

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 15, 2018

" Not her ticket, doesn't want to share with the rest of the lottery pool? " How do you spell extremely unlikely. The idea that the other members of the pool would be silent, while this circus goes about it's business is...

The assumption is Ms Doe never gave them copies of their tickets. And that's a much better explanation than "She doesn't want to be a celebrity,"

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by Stack47 on Feb 15, 2018

The assumption is Ms Doe never gave them copies of their tickets. And that's a much better explanation than "She doesn't want to be a celebrity,"

That would make for a good movie script Stack, but all will be revealed in time.

I have to dig through the archives of my memory, but there was an incident many years ago here in CA, where the wife suddenly decided that she was not in love with her husband of 25 years anymore, so she left and never returned. Well one day a letter comes in the mail from the lottery office asking for particulars about her new mail box etc, the husband forwards the letter to he's attorney & the next thing you know, both the husband and the wife are in court over a " lottery win." To the best of my knowledge, the judge threw the book at the wife, calling her deceitful & an evil person, awarded him the entire jackpot win... community of property bud.

Then there was the case of that Latino guy from NY or NJ a few years back who suppposedly won the jackpot ALONE  despite him always playing along with the job pool.He too got nailed by the courts. It's risky behavior, and if you correct, the public that is siding with her at present, will turn on her in a NY minute... that's a fact Stack.

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"because the NH Lottery posted instructions on their website as to what actions a winner should  ..."

I don't think that's a great argument. At least not a great legal argument. I'm not even sure that the NH lottery says anything that matters much. A Google search of the NH Lottery website for the phrase "sign the ticket" turns up one result on the page about claiming prizes, and a few on news pages about winners. The news pages have a list offering several pieces of advice. The first is "Sign the ticket—the New Hampshire Lottery only pays the person who signs the back of the ticket." #3 is to talk to a lawyer, and #4 is to talk to a financial planner. The one on the page about how to claim a prize only has the requirement to sign the ticket in the section about claiming by mail.

Personally, I think that talking to a lawyer and financial planner should be among your very first steps, and as everyone should know, her lawyer would have told her not to sign her name. And notice that the advice doesn't say to sign your name - it only says to sign the ticket. Remember Mitt Romney a few years back? "Corporations are people, my friend." As everyone who has read the stories about this should know, the ticket can be signed with the name of a legal entity created to manage the prize, and/or by a representative of that entity.

As an interesting aside, the 2nd suggestion is to move the NH, since the prize won't be subject to state income tax. In the past I figured that the ticket became valuable the moment that winning numbers matching the ticket are certified, but I've since reached the conclusion that the doctrine of economic benefit means that the ticket only becomes valuable at some point after it's validated. That means that as a NY resident, if I buy a ticket while in NH and it wins a significant prize I can become a NH resident before claiming the prize, and pay 0% in state income tax instead of the 8.82% for NY's top bracket. That's about $31 million for the prize won by Jane Doe. Unlike some people, I don't  consider the advice from a state lottery to be legal advice that can be relied on, but it's still interesting to see that advice offered.

"Suppose it is not 'her' ticket."

So what's your theory? That she bought the ticket on behalf of a pool and none of the other members knows what numbers were played? It's possible, but life is should to be more difficult when you're stupid. And if they're all so stupid that they also don't know that the tickets were bought in Merrimack and that they might want to check things out just in case, then perhaps they should be removed from the gene pool before they breed even more stupid people.

zephbe's avatarzephbe

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 15, 2018

" Not her ticket, doesn't want to share with the rest of the lottery pool? " How do you spell extremely unlikely. The idea that the other members of the pool would be silent, while this circus goes about it's business is...

Some people don't give copies of the ticket(s) to pool members.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/01/13/news/powerball-office-pool/index.html

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by zephbe on Feb 16, 2018

Some people don't give copies of the ticket(s) to pool members.

http://money.cnn.com/2016/01/13/news/powerball-office-pool/index.html

l totally get what you saying Zephbe, however for her to not give the rest of the pool a copy of the winning ticket or tickets, she would have to be a clairvoyant. Squirrel away "that particular ticket" from all the others to pull this off? That is what l would find "extremely unlikely."

There was this case a few years ago involving  these hair stylists... same thing. One of the girls supposedly bought her winning ticket apart from the pool. I wonder what happened to that case?

Seattlejohn

Oh for God's sakes; quit your whining!  You played the lottery, knowing full well this was a possibility!  Now that you've won, you want to change the rules?  You'd better get good with the idea that you agreed to the rules when you bought your lottery ticket.  In a court of law, your case has no merit, and will be summarily dismissed...

Lynn2015's avatarLynn2015

Quote: Originally posted by Seattlejohn on Feb 16, 2018

Oh for God's sakes; quit your whining!  You played the lottery, knowing full well this was a possibility!  Now that you've won, you want to change the rules?  You'd better get good with the idea that you agreed to the rules when you bought your lottery ticket.  In a court of law, your case has no merit, and will be summarily dismissed...

Exactly..I agree wit u..

LookyLook

So far - and strangely - the New Hampshire Lottery, has agreed to make payment to a trust the winner has set up AFTER signing the ticket? How is that possible? 

She deserves her name to be made public as she is making a travesty of the rules and regulations of the lottery.

Coin Toss's avatarCoin Toss

This probably won't be popular but I hope she gets paid - anonymously and that this sets a precedent for all states with a lottery. 

The only entities I can see pushing 'right to know' are lotteries themselves, nothing sells more tickets like a big winner and the second entity is very nosy people and paranoid people, "They never said who won, the ________ lottery is keeping the money."

Can anyone point out any anonymous state that closed down its lottery?

Ut oh. 

Hiding Behind Computer

zephbe's avatarzephbe

https://bangordailynews.com/2018/02/16/news/new-england/nh-powerball-winner-suing-for-anonymity-will-get-her-money/

They are paying her through the trust while the court decides on her request.  So she has the money.

Stack47

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 16, 2018

That would make for a good movie script Stack, but all will be revealed in time.

I have to dig through the archives of my memory, but there was an incident many years ago here in CA, where the wife suddenly decided that she was not in love with her husband of 25 years anymore, so she left and never returned. Well one day a letter comes in the mail from the lottery office asking for particulars about her new mail box etc, the husband forwards the letter to he's attorney & the next thing you know, both the husband and the wife are in court over a " lottery win." To the best of my knowledge, the judge threw the book at the wife, calling her deceitful & an evil person, awarded him the entire jackpot win... community of property bud.

Then there was the case of that Latino guy from NY or NJ a few years back who suppposedly won the jackpot ALONE  despite him always playing along with the job pool.He too got nailed by the courts. It's risky behavior, and if you correct, the public that is siding with her at present, will turn on her in a NY minute... that's a fact Stack.

When someone on LP suggested a pool might be the reason she doesn't want her name published, I thought of lots of the articles here about people suing large prize winners. I personally know two people that shared a $20 million Ohio Lotto jackpot and participated in other pools and one was a 30 person pool that I was in too. There never was a question about them sharing with that pool because they didn't buy the tickets for the pool. There was one guy who said he made a deal with them that if any of them won a jackpot, they would share with the other. But it was never in writing so it never went anywhere.

Anyways if the person running the pool wins and can claim anonymously, it might be difficult for the others to find out. The thing is, even if their name isn't published, if it was a co-worker others would notice when they quit their job and neighbors will certainly notice a drastic change in lifestyles. 

The NH Lottery will give "poor Jane Doe" part of the winnings before the court rules next week. 

yupyup79

I live in Merrimack.  We dont know who it is.  https://www.facebook.com/groups/merrimackforum/  that group has a post every other day asking who knows.  No one does.  Many are quick to tell people to be quiet and stop asking questions so maybe the winner has defenders looking out trying to keep the light off her.  It's  a public group so you should be able to see or search it.

 

There's no guarantee the winner is from Merrimack,  could be Nashua or Manchester or another town/city nearby.  There are two restaurants that are next to or across the street from the store that sold the ticket.  Many people from out of town frequent them and may have stopped in to get a lotto ticket while they were there eating.

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by Stack47 on Feb 16, 2018

When someone on LP suggested a pool might be the reason she doesn't want her name published, I thought of lots of the articles here about people suing large prize winners. I personally know two people that shared a $20 million Ohio Lotto jackpot and participated in other pools and one was a 30 person pool that I was in too. There never was a question about them sharing with that pool because they didn't buy the tickets for the pool. There was one guy who said he made a deal with them that if any of them won a jackpot, they would share with the other. But it was never in writing so it never went anywhere.

Anyways if the person running the pool wins and can claim anonymously, it might be difficult for the others to find out. The thing is, even if their name isn't published, if it was a co-worker others would notice when they quit their job and neighbors will certainly notice a drastic change in lifestyles. 

The NH Lottery will give "poor Jane Doe" part of the winnings before the court rules next week. 

Interesting..

Goteki54's avatarGoteki54

EXACTLY!! The rules are the rules. If she doesn't want to abide by the rules, then she should forfeit the prize or give it all away, then she wouldn't have to worry about being "stressed". They're many people who are publicly known who are multii billionaires and don't "stress" about people knowing they have wealth. The only thing missing in this drama are the beginning and ending credits.Hit With Stick

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by CDanaT on Feb 14, 2018

Tough call (imho). I more than understand the rules and they are crystal clear on making the claim.

For her personal safety, I am all for that 110%.

I believe ,like all of us, we have heard "sign the back of your ticket" for years and years. Those of us that post on here, know undoubtedly, that with this massive win requires discretion, professional legal guidance and sound decision making prior to making the claim.

I was a bit curious about safety tips that the lottery posts on the TEXAS state website, so I went and took a gander:

www.txlottery.org/export/sites/lottery/Winners/Player_Protection/Security_Spotlight/index.html

The third line down says, " Sign your tickets upon receipt"

So then being a bit more curious I went to the FAQ section and here is what is posted there:

www.txlottery.org/export/sites/lottery/FAQ/index.html

WHAT SHOULD I DO WHEN I PURCHASE MY TICKETS ?

ANS: "Check your ticket(s) upon receipt to ensure they are correct and they are the ticket(s) you intended to purchase. Sign Your Ticket upon receipt" <-- Notice the caps on sign your ticket

There was an informative reply in the question of 

If I join a group of players, can more than one person claim a prize on the same ticket

No. The Texas Lottery Commission will pay only one claimant per ticket. A “claimant” can be an individual, a trust, a partnership, a corporation, or any other legal entity. The way in which you claim a prize cannot be changed after the ticket is validated and the prize is paid; therefore, careful consideration and professional advice, including but not limited to legal or financial advice, is recommended before the prize is claimed, especially for larger prizes or those prizes that are paid by installments. If you choose to claim the prize as a trust, partnership, or other legal entity, the legal documents that create the legal entity must be submitted for review to the Texas Lottery's Legal Services Division before claiming your prize. This is required to ensure the documents comply with the State Lottery Act and the Commission’s administrative rules. If you claim your prize as any entity other than an individual, a Federal Employer Identification Number (FEIN) is required.

Notice the difference between "sign your ticket upon receipt" and "careful consideration..legal or financial advice is recommended..  I know they are in 2 separate questions but some of the longer statement could apply to the what I do when I purchase my tickets.

 

In closing, while I understand her requests for privacy and possible misunderstanding of rules. She didn't complete a full research of the legal options available and she will have to endure public scrutiny, I believe. 

Thank goodness Texas allows us to claim anonymous on prizes of $1 Million or more   Thumbs Up

Just my 2 pennies worth on this article as written.

I hope that what is going on with this ticket will cause others to look up the rules for their own state.

Had this woman done her homework to find out that her state allowed her to claim ticket under a trust, she could have signed the ticket in PENCIL...put the ticket in a safe place and then call a financial advisor. 

Had she done this, we would not have this story.

GYM RICE

Wonder what her lawyer is charging her for all this? This looks to me like some lawyer trying to get as much money as possible out of her. All she had to do is add to the ticket " Jane Doe and then another name or institution Trust...Sure they would release the name of the trust with her name being one of the names in he trust, but she could have her lawyer go collect the money and never see the front of a camera. 

Heck she could still right on the ticket. Jane Doe(her name which is already on the ticket) and add, wants to stay anon Trust Fund. So JANE DOE WANTS TO STAY ANON TRUST FUND...Right that on the ticket. You wont be anon but it would be pretty funny.

Coin Toss's avatarCoin Toss

Maybe she should have signed Ann Nonymous.

Wink

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on Feb 23, 2018

Maybe she should have signed Ann Nonymous.

Wink

Well played Sir!

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by GYM RICE on Feb 22, 2018

Wonder what her lawyer is charging her for all this? This looks to me like some lawyer trying to get as much money as possible out of her. All she had to do is add to the ticket " Jane Doe and then another name or institution Trust...Sure they would release the name of the trust with her name being one of the names in he trust, but she could have her lawyer go collect the money and never see the front of a camera. 

Heck she could still right on the ticket. Jane Doe(her name which is already on the ticket) and add, wants to stay anon Trust Fund. So JANE DOE WANTS TO STAY ANON TRUST FUND...Right that on the ticket. You wont be anon but it would be pretty funny.

l *think her attorney/attorneys will charge her the “ going rate”..meaning if you a multi millionaire, you get charged whatever seems fair. Now a M millionaire “ seems fair” is quite different from a blue collar “ seems fair.” Since she is hellbent on keeping her name a secret, her attorneys will ask her to sign on the dotted line & l am willing to bet you soup to nuts, she won’t even blink, and why should she. This is after all, her own doings.The rich can afford to do that.

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"she could have signed the ticket in PENCIL"

And what good would that have done?

 

"Sure they would release the name of the trust with her name being one of the names"

Have you considered that, just maybe, not having her name publicized is what she's hoping for?

"Wonder what her lawyer is charging her for all this?"

I can't imagine that what they're charging for pressing her case is very significant in comparison to what they'll be charging to have their names publicized instead of hers if she wins. They probably won't encounter many of the hassles that the real winner might, but I'd imagine that if nothing else they could be getting a lot of phone calls. If it was me I'd want at least enough to cover somebody answering the phone for 6  months or more, but that still doesn't do anything about  the possibility that the legitimate business calls could be disrupted. At the very least it may all be predicated on billing her for a lot of other work stemming from the win.

noise-gate

Pencil? Oh brother.

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by KY Floyd on Feb 23, 2018

"she could have signed the ticket in PENCIL"

And what good would that have done?

 

"Sure they would release the name of the trust with her name being one of the names"

Have you considered that, just maybe, not having her name publicized is what she's hoping for?

"Wonder what her lawyer is charging her for all this?"

I can't imagine that what they're charging for pressing her case is very significant in comparison to what they'll be charging to have their names publicized instead of hers if she wins. They probably won't encounter many of the hassles that the real winner might, but I'd imagine that if nothing else they could be getting a lot of phone calls. If it was me I'd want at least enough to cover somebody answering the phone for 6  months or more, but that still doesn't do anything about  the possibility that the legitimate business calls could be disrupted. At the very least it may all be predicated on billing her for a lot of other work stemming from the win.

Signing the ticket in pencil ALLOWS you to ERASE your name and replace it with the name of the Trust you form BEFORE you submit the ticket (use an ink pen to sign name of Trust).

Use two trust to claim ticket:

Put the name of the Claiming Trust on back of ticket.....

When the media does a search on who owns the claiming trust they wii see it is owned by a Bridge Trust which by law ownership is not revealed.

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by noise-gate on Feb 23, 2018

Pencil? Oh brother.

See above response.

CDanaT's avatarCDanaT

Quote: Originally posted by Perfecttiming2 on Feb 25, 2018

Signing the ticket in pencil ALLOWS you to ERASE your name and replace it with the name of the Trust you form BEFORE you submit the ticket (use an ink pen to sign name of Trust).

Use two trust to claim ticket:

Put the name of the Claiming Trust on back of ticket.....

When the media does a search on who owns the claiming trust they wii see it is owned by a Bridge Trust which by law ownership is not revealed.

PT.... I will respectfully disagree with you on the pencil signing suggestion. Due to the close scrutinizing of the ticket by lottery officials, I would not want to take the chance of having an issue with the back of that ticket due to eraser usage.... Not saying that it would, just not going to take the chance.

Consider leaving it unsigned and secure it in a well hidden fire proof safe or a place that you feel confident of it's safe keeping at home. Go to your respective banking facility the next day they are open and purchase a safety deposit box, put it in there with some other paperwork or personal items and it will be fine/secure.

Then again, you can always keep the ticket with you 24/7, order in takeout and live like Howard Hughes until the day you collect. Sulk Off

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by CDanaT on Feb 25, 2018

PT.... I will respectfully disagree with you on the pencil signing suggestion. Due to the close scrutinizing of the ticket by lottery officials, I would not want to take the chance of having an issue with the back of that ticket due to eraser usage.... Not saying that it would, just not going to take the chance.

Consider leaving it unsigned and secure it in a well hidden fire proof safe or a place that you feel confident of it's safe keeping at home. Go to your respective banking facility the next day they are open and purchase a safety deposit box, put it in there with some other paperwork or personal items and it will be fine/secure.

Then again, you can always keep the ticket with you 24/7, order in takeout and live like Howard Hughes until the day you collect. Sulk Off

Hi!

When I signed my ticket in pencil.... I don’t press down....

The signature is light enough that when I erase....you see nothing....there is no trace of a pencil being used

Yet the signature is dark enough so that it shows up when I take a photo of the tickets (front and back).

noise-gate

Quote: Originally posted by Perfecttiming2 on Feb 25, 2018

See above response.

l did, l am still at hmmm.

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"The signature is light enough that when I erase....you see nothing"

Then you obviously recognize that the signature won't do anything to establish ownership and prevent somebody else from claiming it as theirs if they should somehow come into possession of it.

"Yet the signature is dark enough so that it shows up when I take a photo"

So we can safely assume that you don't know what Photoshop is?

TheGameGrl's avatarTheGameGrl

I read that the judge is allowing this ticket holder to claim in trust. And that the judge will later determine if the states right to publish said winner can still be upheld. Can someone verify this as I don't want to mislead on this topic but rather have accurate data for those following this topic. ?

CDanaT's avatarCDanaT

Quote: Originally posted by TheGameGrl on Feb 26, 2018

I read that the judge is allowing this ticket holder to claim in trust. And that the judge will later determine if the states right to publish said winner can still be upheld. Can someone verify this as I don't want to mislead on this topic but rather have accurate data for those following this topic. ?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-hampshire-powerball-winner-559-million-anonymous/

 

It is a response from the MSM.. so take it with a grain of salt as to actual 100% fact

hearsetrax's avatarhearsetrax

SkepticalI'm sure a few and many state lotteries are watching this case extremely closely

I hope it works out in her favor

TheGameGrl's avatarTheGameGrl

Quote: Originally posted by CDanaT on Feb 26, 2018

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-hampshire-powerball-winner-559-million-anonymous/

 

It is a response from the MSM.. so take it with a grain of salt as to actual 100% fact

Thanks CDanaT. 

Most was fluff but the judge did rule in part. So be it.

Redd55

It's HER money.  The issue is whether she can remain anonymous or not and while the court is reaching a decision, there is no reason why she should not be able to access HER money. 

Artist77's avatarArtist77

Quote: Originally posted by Redd55 on Feb 26, 2018

It's HER money.  The issue is whether she can remain anonymous or not and while the court is reaching a decision, there is no reason why she should not be able to access HER money. 

I agree. Again this is an example of courts applying equitable options. A lot of people are bring misled by lottery websites ( in states where you can claim via a trust, etc,) advising people to sign their tickets and not advising this locks winners into one option. Fair notice is an issue.

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"there is no reason why she should not be able to access HER money."

I doubt that there's anybody other than her and her lawyers who have delayed payment. It's an extremely safe bet that the lottery would be willing to process her claim just as quickly as any other claim, but as soon as she submits the claim the ticket with her name becomes subject to New Hampshire's laws and the lottery's rules. Until there's an injunction or a ruling on the lawsuit saying otherwise that would make the ticket, and therefore her name, subject to the lottery's normal policy on publicity.

The only rational conclusion is that she and her lawyers either held off on submitting the claim or got the process started but agreed to wait on payment while the lawsuit progressed.

maximumfun's avatarmaximumfun

Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted.

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by KY Floyd on Feb 26, 2018

"The signature is light enough that when I erase....you see nothing"

Then you obviously recognize that the signature won't do anything to establish ownership and prevent somebody else from claiming it as theirs if they should somehow come into possession of it.

"Yet the signature is dark enough so that it shows up when I take a photo"

So we can safely assume that you don't know what Photoshop is?

Tickets are signed in pencil, always kept in bank....in a safety deposit box...in a vault.

Since I do advanced plays , those tickets sit in vault safe from theft and photo shop for a considerable amount of time...I am the only one who has access.

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"safe from theft and photo shop"

The point that you're missing is that signing in pencil probably does nothing for your ability to prove ownership. You may think you can do a perfect job of erasing it, but if the ticket is inspected closely enough it will definitely be possible to determine that it was signed and then erased. I don't know how closely the lottery checks, but I certainly wouldn't take that chance. If they do discover that a signature has been erased or altered the best case scenario is that you have a hassle establishing your ownership interest and get to wait a long time to collect your money. Even if they've got a clear video showing you buying it, the fact that  a signature was erased will mean that they have to consider the possibility that somebody else was claiming ownership. The worst case scenario is that they refuse to pay based on the alteration.

What you're also missing is that the existence of photoshop means that your picture of a signed ticket has the same usefulness as a picture of an unsigned ticket. If it was a teenage girl walking through a mall in knit pants how would you know this isn't real?    https://twitter.com/lexNussbaum/status/968532960436736001   If the pencil signature could be successfully erased and somebody else somehow got possession of the ticket their signature on it would thoroughly trump (no pun intended) your photo and your insistence that your signature was really on the ticket and wasn't photoshopped onto a picture of the unsigned ticket.

 

"Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted."

Why? Once it became possible to collect while waiting for the lawsuit to progress what's the downside of collecting the money? If the lottery had simply allowed her to collect while waiting on the lawsuit it may have been possible for somebody to get the name on the ticket through a freedom of information request. Since the lottery was ordered by the judge to make the payment (to the trust) the lottery should have a  solid legal basis for refusing any such request, and whether or not the winner's identity is released will be based on the resolution of the lawsuit.

Perfecttiming2's avatarPerfecttiming2

Quote: Originally posted by KY Floyd on Feb 28, 2018

"safe from theft and photo shop"

The point that you're missing is that signing in pencil probably does nothing for your ability to prove ownership. You may think you can do a perfect job of erasing it, but if the ticket is inspected closely enough it will definitely be possible to determine that it was signed and then erased. I don't know how closely the lottery checks, but I certainly wouldn't take that chance. If they do discover that a signature has been erased or altered the best case scenario is that you have a hassle establishing your ownership interest and get to wait a long time to collect your money. Even if they've got a clear video showing you buying it, the fact that  a signature was erased will mean that they have to consider the possibility that somebody else was claiming ownership. The worst case scenario is that they refuse to pay based on the alteration.

What you're also missing is that the existence of photoshop means that your picture of a signed ticket has the same usefulness as a picture of an unsigned ticket. If it was a teenage girl walking through a mall in knit pants how would you know this isn't real?    https://twitter.com/lexNussbaum/status/968532960436736001   If the pencil signature could be successfully erased and somebody else somehow got possession of the ticket their signature on it would thoroughly trump (no pun intended) your photo and your insistence that your signature was really on the ticket and wasn't photoshopped onto a picture of the unsigned ticket.

 

"Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted."

Why? Once it became possible to collect while waiting for the lawsuit to progress what's the downside of collecting the money? If the lottery had simply allowed her to collect while waiting on the lawsuit it may have been possible for somebody to get the name on the ticket through a freedom of information request. Since the lottery was ordered by the judge to make the payment (to the trust) the lottery should have a  solid legal basis for refusing any such request, and whether or not the winner's identity is released will be based on the resolution of the lawsuit.

Ok, I can accept that you would not take that "chance".

 

If being on camera purchasing the ticket is not enough for proof of ownership, I am very comfortable with:

Signing the ticket in pencil (until I am ready to claim)

Presenting my receipt of the lottery ticket purchase which shows the date and time stamp of my lottery purchase which would match me in the store video (I request a receipt every time I play)

And placing the receipt and ticket in a bank deposit box (while maintaining old tickets from every year that I played the same set of numbers repeatedly).

If the burden of proof is on me, I think I have more than enough...

My profile (investigators say that they can create a profile of regular lottery players) would lead a trail right back to me.

If they determined that I erased my name in favor of a trust, the name erased would match the name of the owner of the trust if I had to produce it.

 

We can respectfully agree to disagree and Thanks for the dialogue!

KY Floyd's avatarKY Floyd

"We can respectfully agree to disagree"

Actually, we agree on a fair amount.

I don't make a lot of effort because the chance of winning enough to matter and then having somebody else try to claim it's their ticket is awfully close to zero, but some things require almost zero effort. I also play the same numbers for long periods of time. I don't keep all of the old tickets, but I've got a few old tickets (from multiple states) tucked away, including the first (or at least early) time I use a combination. I don't bother with receipts for ticket purchases, but there are plenty of credit card transactions showing that I've bought gas immediately before tickets with my numbers were purchased. There are also email servers for a rather large company that have proof that I knew when and where some of those tickets would be bought, as well as how the buyer would be dressed, a day or two before the purchase was made. FWIW, here in NY you can claim prizes without a ticket, as long as you can provide convincing proof that you own the missing ticket.

I happened to recently be in a state where I could remain anonymous and bought tickets for both PB and MM. I'm sure enough that I can easily establish ownership that I kept my head down in hopes that I wouldn't be easily recognized on the video if it were to be released to the public.

"If they determined that I erased my name in favor of a trust, the name erased would match the name of the owner of the trust"

I'd have thought that the rules about altered tickets is about alterations that attempt to portray a losing ticket as a winner and that any changes to the signature would only cause problems about ownership, but one of the other articles about Jane Doe's ticket reports that the NH lottery "told her she can't white-out her name from the back of the ticket, as any alteration (my emphasis) would invalidate it."

I'm sure (and it sounds like you are, too) that inability to establish legitimate ownership is extremely unlikely even without a signature. The chance that erasing a signature would turn a winning ticket into a worthless souvenir, OTOH, seems significant.

jacintasc

Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on Feb 14, 2018

Maybe she is the real "Steve Player.'......

Green laugh

 I don't understand. What is "Steve Player???"

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