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Court hears arguments on $559M lottery winner's plea to remain anonymous

Topic closed. 81 replies. Last post 3 years ago by jacintasc.

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KY Floyd's avatar - lysol avatar.jpg
NY
United States
Member #23834
October 16, 2005
4273 Posts
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"there is no reason why she should not be able to access HER money."

I doubt that there's anybody other than her and her lawyers who have delayed payment. It's an extremely safe bet that the lottery would be willing to process her claim just as quickly as any other claim, but as soon as she submits the claim the ticket with her name becomes subject to New Hampshire's laws and the lottery's rules. Until there's an injunction or a ruling on the lawsuit saying otherwise that would make the ticket, and therefore her name, subject to the lottery's normal policy on publicity.

The only rational conclusion is that she and her lawyers either held off on submitting the claim or got the process started but agreed to wait on payment while the lawsuit progressed.

    maximumfun's avatar - Lottery-030.jpg

    United States
    Member #124612
    March 16, 2012
    3713 Posts
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    Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted.

      Perfecttiming2's avatar - redcross

      United States
      Member #65959
      October 11, 2008
      202 Posts
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      "The signature is light enough that when I erase....you see nothing"

      Then you obviously recognize that the signature won't do anything to establish ownership and prevent somebody else from claiming it as theirs if they should somehow come into possession of it.

      "Yet the signature is dark enough so that it shows up when I take a photo"

      So we can safely assume that you don't know what Photoshop is?

      Tickets are signed in pencil, always kept in bank....in a safety deposit box...in a vault.

      Since I do advanced plays , those tickets sit in vault safe from theft and photo shop for a considerable amount of time...I am the only one who has access.

        KY Floyd's avatar - lysol avatar.jpg
        NY
        United States
        Member #23834
        October 16, 2005
        4273 Posts
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        "safe from theft and photo shop"

        The point that you're missing is that signing in pencil probably does nothing for your ability to prove ownership. You may think you can do a perfect job of erasing it, but if the ticket is inspected closely enough it will definitely be possible to determine that it was signed and then erased. I don't know how closely the lottery checks, but I certainly wouldn't take that chance. If they do discover that a signature has been erased or altered the best case scenario is that you have a hassle establishing your ownership interest and get to wait a long time to collect your money. Even if they've got a clear video showing you buying it, the fact that  a signature was erased will mean that they have to consider the possibility that somebody else was claiming ownership. The worst case scenario is that they refuse to pay based on the alteration.

        What you're also missing is that the existence of photoshop means that your picture of a signed ticket has the same usefulness as a picture of an unsigned ticket. If it was a teenage girl walking through a mall in knit pants how would you know this isn't real?    https://twitter.com/lexNussbaum/status/968532960436736001   If the pencil signature could be successfully erased and somebody else somehow got possession of the ticket their signature on it would thoroughly trump (no pun intended) your photo and your insistence that your signature was really on the ticket and wasn't photoshopped onto a picture of the unsigned ticket.

         

        "Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted."

        Why? Once it became possible to collect while waiting for the lawsuit to progress what's the downside of collecting the money? If the lottery had simply allowed her to collect while waiting on the lawsuit it may have been possible for somebody to get the name on the ticket through a freedom of information request. Since the lottery was ordered by the judge to make the payment (to the trust) the lottery should have a  solid legal basis for refusing any such request, and whether or not the winner's identity is released will be based on the resolution of the lawsuit.

          Perfecttiming2's avatar - redcross

          United States
          Member #65959
          October 11, 2008
          202 Posts
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          "safe from theft and photo shop"

          The point that you're missing is that signing in pencil probably does nothing for your ability to prove ownership. You may think you can do a perfect job of erasing it, but if the ticket is inspected closely enough it will definitely be possible to determine that it was signed and then erased. I don't know how closely the lottery checks, but I certainly wouldn't take that chance. If they do discover that a signature has been erased or altered the best case scenario is that you have a hassle establishing your ownership interest and get to wait a long time to collect your money. Even if they've got a clear video showing you buying it, the fact that  a signature was erased will mean that they have to consider the possibility that somebody else was claiming ownership. The worst case scenario is that they refuse to pay based on the alteration.

          What you're also missing is that the existence of photoshop means that your picture of a signed ticket has the same usefulness as a picture of an unsigned ticket. If it was a teenage girl walking through a mall in knit pants how would you know this isn't real?    https://twitter.com/lexNussbaum/status/968532960436736001   If the pencil signature could be successfully erased and somebody else somehow got possession of the ticket their signature on it would thoroughly trump (no pun intended) your photo and your insistence that your signature was really on the ticket and wasn't photoshopped onto a picture of the unsigned ticket.

           

          "Seems like taking the money before this "issue" is settled is rather short-sighted."

          Why? Once it became possible to collect while waiting for the lawsuit to progress what's the downside of collecting the money? If the lottery had simply allowed her to collect while waiting on the lawsuit it may have been possible for somebody to get the name on the ticket through a freedom of information request. Since the lottery was ordered by the judge to make the payment (to the trust) the lottery should have a  solid legal basis for refusing any such request, and whether or not the winner's identity is released will be based on the resolution of the lawsuit.

          Ok, I can accept that you would not take that "chance".

           

          If being on camera purchasing the ticket is not enough for proof of ownership, I am very comfortable with:

          Signing the ticket in pencil (until I am ready to claim)

          Presenting my receipt of the lottery ticket purchase which shows the date and time stamp of my lottery purchase which would match me in the store video (I request a receipt every time I play)

          And placing the receipt and ticket in a bank deposit box (while maintaining old tickets from every year that I played the same set of numbers repeatedly).

          If the burden of proof is on me, I think I have more than enough...

          My profile (investigators say that they can create a profile of regular lottery players) would lead a trail right back to me.

          If they determined that I erased my name in favor of a trust, the name erased would match the name of the owner of the trust if I had to produce it.

           

          We can respectfully agree to disagree and Thanks for the dialogue!

            KY Floyd's avatar - lysol avatar.jpg
            NY
            United States
            Member #23834
            October 16, 2005
            4273 Posts
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            "We can respectfully agree to disagree"

            Actually, we agree on a fair amount.

            I don't make a lot of effort because the chance of winning enough to matter and then having somebody else try to claim it's their ticket is awfully close to zero, but some things require almost zero effort. I also play the same numbers for long periods of time. I don't keep all of the old tickets, but I've got a few old tickets (from multiple states) tucked away, including the first (or at least early) time I use a combination. I don't bother with receipts for ticket purchases, but there are plenty of credit card transactions showing that I've bought gas immediately before tickets with my numbers were purchased. There are also email servers for a rather large company that have proof that I knew when and where some of those tickets would be bought, as well as how the buyer would be dressed, a day or two before the purchase was made. FWIW, here in NY you can claim prizes without a ticket, as long as you can provide convincing proof that you own the missing ticket.

            I happened to recently be in a state where I could remain anonymous and bought tickets for both PB and MM. I'm sure enough that I can easily establish ownership that I kept my head down in hopes that I wouldn't be easily recognized on the video if it were to be released to the public.

            "If they determined that I erased my name in favor of a trust, the name erased would match the name of the owner of the trust"

            I'd have thought that the rules about altered tickets is about alterations that attempt to portray a losing ticket as a winner and that any changes to the signature would only cause problems about ownership, but one of the other articles about Jane Doe's ticket reports that the NH lottery "told her she can't white-out her name from the back of the ticket, as any alteration (my emphasis) would invalidate it."

            I'm sure (and it sounds like you are, too) that inability to establish legitimate ownership is extremely unlikely even without a signature. The chance that erasing a signature would turn a winning ticket into a worthless souvenir, OTOH, seems significant.

              Avatar

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              Member #170703
              December 13, 2015
              202 Posts
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              Maybe she is the real "Steve Player.'......

              Green laugh

               I don't understand. What is "Steve Player???"