Has the Lotteries been infiltrated by the mob ?Prev Topic Next Topic

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d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 28, 2013, 1:39 pm

Its amazing to see anyone playing $1K on small games every week, paying in bundles of small bills. In a year thats at least $52K. So my guess is these guys are net positive on their plays. And if they are, then the $52k must yield wins in multiples of 1000x or more.

I have read about money laundering in casinos, but money laundering in lotteries ? Is it possible ? But how ? Let the consipracists ran wild !
MADDOG10

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Jun 28, 2013, 3:06 pm

They've been saying that for years, and it's been investigated many times with no validity..

But people do have different assumptions so I guess let them feed thier own minds..

KARMA...Has no menu. You get served what you deserve
Stack47

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Jun 28, 2013, 3:47 pm

Quote: Originally posted by d1nnl2 on Jun 28, 2013
Its amazing to see anyone playing $1K on small games every week, paying in bundles of small bills. In a year thats at least $52K. So my guess is these guys are net positive on their plays. And if they are, then the $52k must yield wins in multiples of 1000x or more.

I have read about money laundering in casinos, but money laundering in lotteries ? Is it possible ? But how ? Let the consipracists ran wild !

The "mob" has booked the same pick-3 numbers the lottery draws and pays $600 to $1. I doubt the on the inside with state lotteries because the controlled by a rival "mob" called our state legislators.
d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 28, 2013, 4:42 pm

Quote: Originally posted by MADDOG10 on Jun 28, 2013
They've been saying that for years, and it's been investigated many times with no validity..

But people do have different assumptions so I guess let them feed thier own minds..

I understand that but vigilance is required every day. Complacency is the enemy !
RJOh

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Jun 28, 2013, 4:53 pm

Quote: Originally posted by d1nnl2 on Jun 28, 2013
Its amazing to see anyone playing $1K on small games every week, paying in bundles of small bills. In a year thats at least $52K. So my guess is these guys are net positive on their plays. And if they are, then the $52k must yield wins in multiples of 1000x or more.

I have read about money laundering in casinos, but money laundering in lotteries ? Is it possible ? But how ? Let the consipracists ran wild !

Money laundering in the lotteries? Who do you think is buying the winning tickets of players who want to avoid paying taxes on their winnings?

* you don't need to buy every combination, just the winning ones *
Coin Toss

Zeta Reticuli Star System
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Jun 28, 2013, 5:11 pm

d1nnl2,

Actually you could say the mob has been infilitrated by the states. What used to be called 'policy' and was played in the inner cities for five cents became 'the number' and was run by a lot of guys named Guido and Vinny with a lot of runners named Tony Bagodonuts. (As Stack alluded to). Bagodonuts were brown paper bags filled with bet slips and cash, of someone asked "What's in the bag?" the answer was "Donuts".

For a while in Jersey (North Jersey anyway) hitting the number paid $500 but if the middle digit was 1 it paid $450. You can get away with stuff like that when you have the only game in town.

I've posted this before but......I was home on leave from the army when Jersey ok'd the state lottery. I'm a junior and the phne rang and a guy on the phone said, "He 'Joe', don' forget you hit with us you get paid by us and nobody else knows nuttin'. (He thought it was my father on the phone.)

As far as lotteries and money laundering I'm thinking that would be quite a trick and require a lot more big winners. And does anyone laundering money bother with one dollar bills? Isn't that the mainstay of lottery purchases?

Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any. So many systems, so many theories, so few jackpot winners.

There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.
Artist77

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Jun 28, 2013, 5:53 pm

The infiltration was by gang members....I lost my source for winning numbers since Hernandez is going to prison.
d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 28, 2013, 5:53 pm

Quote: Originally posted by RJOh on Jun 28, 2013
Money laundering in the lotteries? Who do you think is buying the winning tickets of players who want to avoid paying taxes on their winnings?

I guess in your opinion only Apple and the other big guys can afford a good tax accountant. I venture to say that the other side can too.
RJOh

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Jun 29, 2013, 11:24 am

Quote: Originally posted by d1nnl2 on Jun 28, 2013
I guess in your opinion only Apple and the other big guys can afford a good tax accountant. I venture to say that the other side can too.

A good tax accountant can't help someone who is getting public assistance and doesn't wish to stop getting it.

* you don't need to buy every combination, just the winning ones *
Jon D

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Jun 29, 2013, 11:41 am

Quote: Originally posted by d1nnl2 on Jun 28, 2013
Its amazing to see anyone playing $1K on small games every week, paying in bundles of small bills. In a year thats at least $52K. So my guess is these guys are net positive on their plays. And if they are, then the $52k must yield wins in multiples of 1000x or more.

I have read about money laundering in casinos, but money laundering in lotteries ? Is it possible ? But how ? Let the consipracists ran wild !

Which "small games" do you see people dropping $1000/week on? Pick 3, Pick 4?

Either way, that is a horrible way to launder money, throwing away 50% just so you can claim the remaining 50% doesn't make any sense. The illegal numbers game or Casino numbers at 60-80% or 90% payout might be a little better, but the lottery at 50% payout is just a waste of perfectly good stolen money. It doesn't work the same as Casino gambling with no cash in/out opportunity.

Or if done from the gaming side, it would be embezzlement not laundering since they are not running the operation.
d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 29, 2013, 5:19 pm

Quote: Originally posted by Jon D on Jun 29, 2013
Which "small games" do you see people dropping $1000/week on? Pick 3, Pick 4?

Either way, that is a horrible way to launder money, throwing away 50% just so you can claim the remaining 50% doesn't make any sense. The illegal numbers game or Casino numbers at 60-80% or 90% payout might be a little better, but the lottery at 50% payout is just a waste of perfectly good stolen money. It doesn't work the same as Casino gambling with no cash in/out opportunity.

Or if done from the gaming side, it would be embezzlement not laundering since they are not running the operation.

I guess they just have money to burn. If they have that much money to burn, I know of a million other ways to burn it besides the small games, Pick4. In NJ Pick4, last year, I estimate the total payout to be $5M, if you won on each of the 727 draws with a $1 str8/box. So, a $52k investment can yield in my estimate at least $20M, if you play at least 4 or 5 times on a winning number a draw.

So these guys must be very good pickers, or the lottery truly has been broken and they have the keys.
d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 29, 2013, 6:15 pm

Watching the "Magic Revealed" on cable, 2 episodes seems relevant here.

1. On this one, a magician has a glass of water on a table, engages someone from the public and somehow the participant manages to turn clear water into something dark. As revealed, the water has been laced with a chemical that on a fixed time will cause a chemical reaction to turn the water into a darker color.

2. On another, a magician drops a bowling ball into a maze of tubes and miraculously escapes. It turns out, the last tube is magnetized at the right moment, slowing the ball laced with chemicals that gives it a specific charge that reacts to the magnetic field.

NJ is a chemical giant. My guess is some bright mind has figured out a way to cause a chemical reaction during the draw such that the random becomes predictable. Witness the trial draws. Could it be that the balls needs some form of agitation for the chemical reaction to occur ? Its published that the balls used are carefully weighed so as to provide an equal chance of being drawn. The font and size of fonts, even the paint are carefully chosen so that each ball holds the same amount of paint for each number. But I have yet to read of a chemical analysis performed on the balls before and after the draws.

The same thing with the cylinder, can something that appears clear plastic be immune to any form of magnetism ? As the magicians have shown time and again, we cannot trust our eyes.
Coin Toss

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Jun 29, 2013, 8:00 pm

This is a very brief, basic example of how money laundering is done in a casino.

People with 'dirty' money show up and buy in on a game for a lot of money, all in hundreds. Those hundreds (dirty) go into the drop box on the game.

Despite the large buy in they make a couple of bets - consider them 'sacrifice bunts' - and then go to the cage with their 'chips' from the game and cash out, thus geting 'clean' money.

Anyone who does this brings a lot of suspicion on themselves.

I still think this would be very hard to do via the lottery.

Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any. So many systems, so many theories, so few jackpot winners.

There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.
d1nnl2

CHERRY HILL, NJ
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Jun 30, 2013, 8:15 am

Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on Jun 29, 2013
This is a very brief, basic example of how money laundering is done in a casino.

People with 'dirty' money show up and buy in on a game for a lot of money, all in hundreds. Those hundreds (dirty) go into the drop box on the game.

Despite the large buy in they make a couple of bets - consider them 'sacrifice bunts' - and then go to the cage with their 'chips' from the game and cash out, thus geting 'clean' money.

Anyone who does this brings a lot of suspicion on themselves.

I still think this would be very hard to do via the lottery.

In any business, cash flow is vital. The problem with an all cash business is its difficult to move physical cash around. But as in any business, they are run by smart people who do not bet on a single horse or have all their eggs on a single basket.

The Lottery is a perfect target. How can you question their integrity ? You can see the daily drawings on TV. Can you not trust your own eyes ? The magicians have shown us that we cannot.

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