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Random Number Generators

Topic closed. 17 replies. Last post 13 years ago by Rick G.

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Which of these produces truly Random Numbers?

Lottery Balls/Machines [ 7 ]  [30.43%]
Computer and Software [ 5 ]  [21.74%]
Atmospheric Radio Noise [ 5 ]  [21.74%]
Human Brain [ 2 ]  [8.70%]
None of the Above [ 4 ]  [17.39%]
Total Valid Votes [ 23 ]  
Discarded Votes [ 4 ]  
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Florida
United States
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October 25, 2001
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Posted: March 9, 2004, 6:24 am - IP Logged

ran dom (rndm)



  1. Having no specific pattern, purpose, or objective.
  2. Mathematics & Statistics Of or relating to a type of circumstance or dvent that is described by a probability distribution.
  3. Of or relating to an dvent in which all outcomes are equally likely, as in the testing of a blood sample for the presence of a substance.

We tend to argue Randomness as the primary definition (#1 above).  But in the case of a lottery, it actually falls under #2 and #3, but NOT #1.  A true RNG source must fall under the primary definition.

*Andrew*

WINHunter - Freeware Lottery Number Predicting software for the 21st century. NOT FOR THE FAINT OF HEART.

www.sourceforge.net/projects/winhunter

    Rick G's avatar - avatar 1766.jpg
    FEMA Region V Camp #21
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    Posted: March 9, 2004, 6:44 am - IP Logged

    My vote is atmospheric radio noise.  For a good random number generator using this method go to random.org

    Posted 4/6:  IL Pick 3 midday and evening until they hit:  555, 347 (str8).


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      United States
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      October 7, 2003
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      Posted: March 9, 2004, 8:55 am - IP Logged

      My question would be. Is anything in creation random?

      Was the universe designed to be random?

      My answer would be, pre-creation was random or chaos, same thing.

      The only thing that I can think of as being anything close to random at all in the universe is a non charged sub-atomic particle colliding or hitting another non charged subatomic particle.

      But as to how anybody can make use of this to produce random numbers is beyond me.



      EXCALIBUR is no more that "Handle" is dead, gone.
      Maybe sometime in the future I might come back as LANTERN again, but maybe not, if I don't come back as LANTERN in the future then I won't come back at all, but as I said there is no more EXCALIBUR.

        Rick G's avatar - avatar 1766.jpg
        FEMA Region V Camp #21
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        Posted: March 9, 2004, 12:25 pm - IP Logged

        Excalibur,

        That's the beauty of RNG's based on atmospheric noise.  What could be more timely and random than today's atmospheric noise?  I'm a big believer that "universal consciousness" affects everything that happens.  Example: exactly one year after the 9/11 attack, 911 came in NY Evening draw.  The number was definitely on a lot of people's minds that day.  Unless they rigged the drawing, I'd say it was a good indication of us having a "say-so" in randomness.

        Just a thought, but I like the concept.

        Posted 4/6:  IL Pick 3 midday and evening until they hit:  555, 347 (str8).


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          Posted: March 9, 2004, 3:24 pm - IP Logged

          Rick

          You do have the right idea.

          Reality is sort of a two way street so to speak.

          It makes you and you make it.

          It is two way and self sustaining.

          "Before anything comes to be (Becomes) it first has to be seen by the mind (Mind's eye}" Edgar Cayce used to say.

          "The mind is the maker" He also used to say.

          Reality is (Something) of the mind (Only).

          Without it (The mind} there is nothing.

          Because, after all, reality (The universe=Creation} was created by "The Mind" (God}.



          I guess that "Random" turned into "Metaphysics".

          But enough of this for now.

          Bye.

          EXCALIBUR is no more that "Handle" is dead, gone.
          Maybe sometime in the future I might come back as LANTERN again, but maybe not, if I don't come back as LANTERN in the future then I won't come back at all, but as I said there is no more EXCALIBUR.

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            Posted: March 9, 2004, 3:29 pm - IP Logged

            But, I almost forgot, getting back to the topic and the question, there probably isn't anything as random as the (Not the human brain) human mind.

            EXCALIBUR is no more that "Handle" is dead, gone.
            Maybe sometime in the future I might come back as LANTERN again, but maybe not, if I don't come back as LANTERN in the future then I won't come back at all, but as I said there is no more EXCALIBUR.

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              Wisconsin
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              Posted: March 9, 2004, 3:56 pm - IP Logged

              Give me the numbered lottery b

              ... the lottery never fails to surprise!
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                Poway CA (San Diego County)
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                Posted: March 9, 2004, 4:35 pm - IP Logged

                This is a hot topic with cryptographers and math lovers.  It is a question (what is truly random?) that may never be answered.  The best source (and agreed upon by most, if not all) has to do with the radio active decay of something (I forget what). 

                If you are interested, and would like to download some random numbers, use this URL:

                http://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/

                I wrote a program for encryption a few years ago that uses these random numbers.  There are a number of tests that can be done to determine if the numbers are truly random, but it takes about a trillion digits to do a good test!

                By the way, any random numbers based on noise is not random.  That has been proven many times.  The main reason is that noise is biased by all the 60 hz noise caused by power lines. 

                CalifDude

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                  Posted: March 9, 2004, 7:38 pm - IP Logged

                  Was it the radioactive decay of cesium?

                  EXCALIBUR is no more that "Handle" is dead, gone.
                  Maybe sometime in the future I might come back as LANTERN again, but maybe not, if I don't come back as LANTERN in the future then I won't come back at all, but as I said there is no more EXCALIBUR.


                    China
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                    December 16, 2003
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                    Posted: March 10, 2004, 6:53 am - IP Logged

                    Theres no true randomness.All are false randomness.

                      konane's avatar - wallace
                      Atlanta, GA
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                      Posted: March 10, 2004, 9:33 am - IP Logged

                      "you creat opportunities..I develop the capibities for moving toward opporyunities.I must turn crisis into creative opportunities and defeats into success and frustration into fullfillment.with what?with your great invisible weapons:your good feelings about yourself,your determination to live the best life you can,and your feeling that only you can give yoursel-that you are a worthwhile,deserving person.You must fight for your right to fullfill."


                      Seems what you're saying is that a positive mental outlook, focused on a goal, believing that you have already achieved that goal can influence any given outcome.  I'ts called creative visualization and it, YES, does work to include lottery numbers whether those numbers are the ones you select through a system or ones which are chosen as a quick pick. 

                      Good luck to everyone!


                        China
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                        Posted: March 10, 2004, 10:22 am - IP Logged

                        thx!

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                          Poway CA (San Diego County)
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                          Posted: March 10, 2004, 4:17 pm - IP Logged
                          Quote: Originally posted by EXCALIBUR on March 09, 2004


                          Was it the radioactive decay of cesium?




                          I just looked it up at: http://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/hardware.html

                          He is using Krypton-85 but says that Cesium-137 would be a better choice because of the half-life being 3 times that of Krypton-85.

                          CalifDude


                           

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                            Florida
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                            Posted: March 11, 2004, 6:33 am - IP Logged

                            Wow!  Just looking at the votes it becomes real obvious as to why we all have such differing views on why or why not we can attempt to predict the lottery.  We can't even agree on a true source of random numbers.  One must consider if a true source of randomness really exists or not.

                            *Andrew*

                            WINHunter - Freeware Lottery Number Predicting software for the 21st century. NOT FOR THE FAINT OF HEART.

                            www.sourceforge.net/projects/winhunter

                              hypersoniq's avatar - 8ball
                              Pennsylvania
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                              Posted: March 11, 2004, 10:02 pm - IP Logged

                              funny stuff, on one hand Cesium 137 is considered a good source of entropy while Cesium 137 runs atomic clocks because of it's resonant stability...

                              atoms (and molecules) have resonances; each chemical element and compound absorbs and emits electromagnetic radiation at its own characteristic frequencies. These resonances are inherently stable over time and space.

                              read more about atomic clocks here... http://www.howstuffworks.com/question40.htm

                              and an interesting article about the beta decay of Cesium 137 (the one from the atomic clocks) as a source of entropy... http://www.eps.org/aps/meet/APR00/baps/abs/S5800011.html

                              Playing more than one ticket per game is betting against yourself.