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Co-worker suing for share of lottery prize

Topic closed. 38 replies. Last post 11 years ago by libra926.

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Posted: March 23, 2006, 1:08 pm - IP Logged

The usual tiresome co-worker squabbles. It will be nice if they say to him "You didn't pay that drawing, you admit you didn't pay, you're out, you get nothing, think about that the next time you blow your last dollar." But I guess it will depend on how many tickets the group got for that drawing with one person allegedly not included vs. what they usually get with him included. If they bought fewer for that drawing because he hadn't paid so they counted him out, then his request was either not made or rejected.  I would think think it would be okay to say "No" to his request and that would be an adequate defense.

 

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    Bethesda, Maryland
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    Posted: March 23, 2006, 2:25 pm - IP Logged

    Please review the duties of what a Notary is and isnt allowed to do. I think you'll be surprised at the fact that they are NOT allowed to give legal advise on its contents. They are to witness the signature and the authenticy of the person(s) presenting it for seal. They are not allowed to prepare legal documents but may witness the signature once prepared. They are not allowed to seal anything which bears witness against their notary oath and responsibilities as administered by their state of registry. The seal does not make it a binding document , it authenticates/ validates the existance of said document. The *verbage* of the document can still be argued in court. Take any last will and testament and see how it can still be argued in court despite a lawyers signature, two witness's,and the deceased.

    As to stating that a "simple" docuement doesnt hold up in court is different. So long as the basic provisions are adhered too , it CAN be upheld. An IOU(promissory note) is a an example.

    The Canadian laws may well be different so the issues as we know them may be mute.

    If indeed the guy can prove that his one associate (who may or may not be a member of the winning Pool)did spot him for the lottery, he may well have a case. Again, evidence is the key in this suit. Its not a frivoulous lawsuit if he does have certain canadian laws in his favor. 

    Patriot3/23/2006

    Fst...I never said that Notary Publics could offer Legal Advice.

    2nd..I never said they could prepare any Legal Documents.

    3rd....I never said they could put their seal to Documents that would violate their Notary Oath or it's responsibilities.

    4th....Contracts which have been Notarized, are binding and valid, and can be argued over in Court. They are respected in any Court of Law, but that's not to say cannot be challenged. Everything can be challenged, but the Notary Seal, because it Authenticates and Validates the Document w/the signatures on it, is respected in Court as a genuine understanding and agreement between athe parties that signed it. 

    4th...I said if the 'Office Pool' writes up an agreement among themselves, which includes the signatures of all the Parties of the Pool and has it Notarized, it is technically a 'binding contract' among it's members, which is respected in Court. This certainly is the case in the District and Maryland. However, anyone can argue against it in Court, as you can argue against any Contract. The Courts will still respect the Contract/Agreement.

      TheGameGrl's avatar - character catafly.jpg
      A long and winding road
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      Posted: March 23, 2006, 9:46 pm - IP Logged

      Libra- Thanks for sharing your thoughts! My post was to educate . Part of my career position required that I take a course in contractual law so its not as cut and dry as it appears in your above post.  I'll respect this difference of some facts and wish the gentleman from canada a fair and just hearing on his case :)

      ~~Is it true, Is it kind,Is it necessary. ~~~

      christmas holly jolly numbers: 255,303,6911, 474,477 silver:47,gold:79.

        csfb's avatar - Lottery-001.jpg

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        Posted: March 24, 2006, 12:11 am - IP Logged

        You are correct, GameGrl. The role of a notary public is only to verify that the signature/s on a document is/are those of the signatory/ies. Notarizing a document does not make it any more legal and binding than it was before it was notarized. An invalid document does not become valid just because it is notarized. A document does not have to be notarized in order to be valid or binding.

        The determination of the validity of any document does not rest upon whether the document is notarized or not.

        Simply put, the notary public acts as a public witness to the document he notarizes, and as such public witness, he has a written record of the signatures on the document.

        As to whether a document is legal and binding, if there is any question on that issue, it is the court that decides AFTER due hearing. This is what due process is all about.

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          Bethesda, Maryland
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          Posted: March 24, 2006, 3:22 pm - IP Logged

          You are correct, GameGrl. The role of a notary public is only to verify that the signature/s on a document is/are those of the signatory/ies. Notarizing a document does not make it any more legal and binding than it was before it was notarized. An invalid document does not become valid just because it is notarized. A document does not have to be notarized in order to be valid or binding.

          The determination of the validity of any document does not rest upon whether the document is notarized or not.

          Simply put, the notary public acts as a public witness to the document he notarizes, and as such public witness, he has a written record of the signatures on the document.

          As to whether a document is legal and binding, if there is any question on that issue, it is the court that decides AFTER due hearing. This is what due process is all about.

          HAPPY FRIDAY........EVERYONE..3/24

          I shared all this info because I have been a Notary Public in a previous employment position. I took the  Notary Test and passed at 100%.

          I realize, from your responses,  that you are not quite understanding the 'context' of what I am saying, but it's alright.  While all the  information, I was sharing, is in point of fact accurate, the bottom line is gambling within an 'Office Pool' is in and of itself a 'gamble'.  Sometimes it gets so complicated, one begins to wonder if it's worth it. I don't mind the 'pools' but prefer small, intimate groups of no more than 5 or 6 max.

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            Posted: March 24, 2006, 4:10 pm - IP Logged

            sirbrad  wrote:

             << If you did not put your money into the draw, you are not in that draw. It is that simple. I don't care if you put in the draw 20 years, if your money is not in for the winning draw, you are out. It is that simple. >>

            If there's a dispute nothing is ever simple. If they were a regular player why weren't they in the winning draw? Was it because they were out sick or didn't have any cash that day, or was it because when they got out of a meeting at 3:00 the ticket buyer had already left early because they had a dentist appointment? If you're in a pool you should assume that if a regular member misses a drawing that results in a substantial win they will sue, and the pool member will have to defend the suit. The best way to do that is to make sure collections happen well ahead of time so that members won't be left out unless they want to be left out. If something goes wrong anyway the best defense will be a good offense in the form of a thorough agreement that anticipates any problems that are at all likely, and you should expect an assumption that a regular member is a participant until they agree to stop participating, or until they recieve advance notice that they are being dropped against their will. IMHO the best plan would  use the same numbers each time reduce the possibiliy of disputes over ownership of a winning ticket. There would also be some sense to assigning each set of numbers to a pool member, so that a member failing to participate results in "their" numbers not being played. Even though each member would own a share of each ticket, the assignment could allow the pool to demonstrate that the pool didn't intend to buy that person's tickets for the draw. Of course the agreement should still include causes for non-participation. I don't think it's possible to guarantee that there won't be a dispute over a winner, but I'm sure the risk can be reduced dramatically from what many pools expose themselves to.

             

            libra926 wrote:  

             << Contracts which have been Notarized, are binding and valid, and can be argued over in Court. They are respected in any Court of Law, but that's not to say cannot be challenged. Everything can be challenged, but the Notary Seal, because it Authenticates and Validates the Document w/the signatures on it >>

            While a notary may be a lawyer, notaries are often secretaries or bank tellers, and their primary function is to act as an official and unbiased witness. Unless the jurisdiction allows non-lawyers to practice law a notary who isn't a lawyer has no authority to pass judgment on the validity of any legal document. As such they can hardly offer a valid opinion on whether or not an instrument is valid or binding on all parties. Even if they're a lawyer and there are no deficiencies with the instrument itself, notarizing the signature of one party does nothing to authenticate other parties. For the most part, the validity that a notarized document has is that a signature reading "John Doe" was really signed by John Doe. That should preclude an argument that John Doe isn't bound by the agreement because John Doe didn't sign it, but there are a variety of other reasons that the agreement may be invalid or not binding on all parties.

            As for challenging the notary's seal, there is nothing magical about notaries or their seals that protect the seal from theft and forgery, or notaries from mistakes, bad judgement or deliberate fraud. The seal and signature of a notary can be challenged just as can other evidence or testimony.

              csfb's avatar - Lottery-001.jpg

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              Posted: March 25, 2006, 10:47 am - IP Logged

              You are correct, GameGrl. The role of a notary public is only to verify that the signature/s on a document is/are those of the signatory/ies. Notarizing a document does not make it any more legal and binding than it was before it was notarized. An invalid document does not become valid just because it is notarized. A document does not have to be notarized in order to be valid or binding.

              The determination of the validity of any document does not rest upon whether the document is notarized or not.

              Simply put, the notary public acts as a public witness to the document he notarizes, and as such public witness, he has a written record of the signatures on the document.

              As to whether a document is legal and binding, if there is any question on that issue, it is the court that decides AFTER due hearing. This is what due process is all about.

              HAPPY FRIDAY........EVERYONE..3/24

              I shared all this info because I have been a Notary Public in a previous employment position. I took the  Notary Test and passed at 100%.

              I realize, from your responses,  that you are not quite understanding the 'context' of what I am saying, but it's alright.  While all the  information, I was sharing, is in point of fact accurate, the bottom line is gambling within an 'Office Pool' is in and of itself a 'gamble'.  Sometimes it gets so complicated, one begins to wonder if it's worth it. I don't mind the 'pools' but prefer small, intimate groups of no more than 5 or 6 max.

              I believe you, Libra. And I understand the "context" of what you are saying. Thing is, I was not directly responding to you. If I were to directly respond to any comment, I would surely quote that comment.

              I was commenting on particular issues brought up in this thread. More particularly, notary public and the court.

              I comment not for the heck of it. I comment for basic, general information and accuracy. That is why I only touch matters I am very familiar with. I don't give full dissertation of a topic either. That's for another place and time and for a fee.

              Now go out there and enjoy the sun. It's a beautiful day today. Have a good one and remember, we're in it to win that big one! Good Luck, my friend.

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                Bethesda, Maryland
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                Posted: March 25, 2006, 1:59 pm - IP Logged

                You are correct, GameGrl. The role of a notary public is only to verify that the signature/s on a document is/are those of the signatory/ies. Notarizing a document does not make it any more legal and binding than it was before it was notarized. An invalid document does not become valid just because it is notarized. A document does not have to be notarized in order to be valid or binding.

                The determination of the validity of any document does not rest upon whether the document is notarized or not.

                Simply put, the notary public acts as a public witness to the document he notarizes, and as such public witness, he has a written record of the signatures on the document.

                As to whether a document is legal and binding, if there is any question on that issue, it is the court that decides AFTER due hearing. This is what due process is all about.

                HAPPY FRIDAY........EVERYONE..3/24

                I shared all this info because I have been a Notary Public in a previous employment position. I took the  Notary Test and passed at 100%.

                I realize, from your responses,  that you are not quite understanding the 'context' of what I am saying, but it's alright.  While all the  information, I was sharing, is in point of fact accurate, the bottom line is gambling within an 'Office Pool' is in and of itself a 'gamble'.  Sometimes it gets so complicated, one begins to wonder if it's worth it. I don't mind the 'pools' but prefer small, intimate groups of no more than 5 or 6 max.

                I believe you, Libra. And I understand the "context" of what you are saying. Thing is, I was not directly responding to you. If I were to directly respond to any comment, I would surely quote that comment.

                I was commenting on particular issues brought up in this thread. More particularly, notary public and the court.

                I comment not for the heck of it. I comment for basic, general information and accuracy. That is why I only touch matters I am very familiar with. I don't give full dissertation of a topic either. That's for another place and time and for a fee.

                Now go out there and enjoy the sun. It's a beautiful day today. Have a good one and remember, we're in it to win that big one! Good Luck, my friend.

                HAPPY SATURDAY...."CSFB"....3/25/2006

                THANK YOU.....

                Now go out there and enjoy the sun. It's a beautiful day today. Have a good one and remember, we're in it to win that big one! Good Luck, my friend

                that is a very very sweet thing to say, it put a Sun Smiley on my face and I shall do as you request. And, may I reciprocate, the same to you, my friend.

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                  Bethesda, Maryland
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                  Posted: March 25, 2006, 2:07 pm - IP Logged

                  HAPPY SATURDAY "KY"...3/25/2006

                  lololololo.....no one, who still had use of reason or common sense would ever offer me a Secretarial Position....and unless I can take the 'money drawer' home at the end of the day, I wouldn't apply for a position as a Bank Teller.........

                  Wink

                    csfb's avatar - Lottery-001.jpg

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                    Posted: March 25, 2006, 4:34 pm - IP Logged

                    Thank you Libra. Just came from lunch, and the next thing I did upon arrival is go to LotteryPost. How's that for a LotteryPost junkie?

                    Had chinese for lunch and my forturne cookie said: "you can't aim a duck to death." Well, I think all LP members know that. Even Dick Cheney. (Just joking)

                    Lucky numbers are: 34 25 11 27 48 30

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                      Bethesda, Maryland
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                      Posted: March 26, 2006, 4:09 pm - IP Logged

                      Thank you Libra. Just came from lunch, and the next thing I did upon arrival is go to LotteryPost. How's that for a LotteryPost junkie?

                      Had chinese for lunch and my forturne cookie said: "you can't aim a duck to death." Well, I think all LP members know that. Even Dick Cheney. (Just joking)

                      Lucky numbers are: 34 25 11 27 48 30

                      RazzHAPPY SUNDAY......3/26/2006

                      HI "CSFB"......hope you had a great lunch...sounded pretty good, was it one of the "all you can eat "buffets?????......I like those the best.....Bamboo Restaurant, in Montgomery County is one of the best....they even have Maryland Blue Crabs on the Buffet and my friends laugh and tease me because it appears that I am one of the only customers who really knows what Maryland Hard Shell Crabs are and  can appreciate them.....I usually devour 8-10 at a sitting easily.......

                      BTW.....your numbers from the Chinese Fortune cookie look similar to the Powerball Numbers from Saturday......did you see the numbers???....20,34,37,39,45, &PB 32......they missed 11..


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                        Posted: March 26, 2006, 4:13 pm - IP Logged

                        Thank you Libra. Just came from lunch, and the next thing I did upon arrival is go to LotteryPost. How's that for a LotteryPost junkie?

                        Had chinese for lunch and my forturne cookie said: "you can't aim a duck to death." Well, I think all LP members know that. Even Dick Cheney. (Just joking)

                        Lucky numbers are: 34 25 11 27 48 30

                        RazzHAPPY SUNDAY......3/26/2006

                        HI "CSFB"......hope you had a great lunch...sounded pretty good, was it one of the "all you can eat "buffets?????......I like those the best.....Bamboo Restaurant, in Montgomery County is one of the best....they even have Maryland Blue Crabs on the Buffet and my friends laugh and tease me because it appears that I am one of the only customers who really knows what Maryland Hard Shell Crabs are and  can appreciate them.....I usually devour 8-10 at a sitting easily.......

                        BTW.....your numbers from the Chinese Fortune cookie look similar to the Powerball Numbers from Saturday......did you see the numbers???....20,34,37,39,45, &PB 32......they missed 11..

                        I like the Pizza Hut lunch buffets, but there are no Pizza Huts in Putnam County. There is a Pizza Hut in Brookfield/Danbury CT, but it doesn't have buffet. I recommend the one in Ridgefield, CT.

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                          Bethesda, Maryland
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                          Posted: March 26, 2006, 4:28 pm - IP Logged

                          Thank you Libra. Just came from lunch, and the next thing I did upon arrival is go to LotteryPost. How's that for a LotteryPost junkie?

                          Had chinese for lunch and my forturne cookie said: "you can't aim a duck to death." Well, I think all LP members know that. Even Dick Cheney. (Just joking)

                          Lucky numbers are: 34 25 11 27 48 30

                          RazzHAPPY SUNDAY......3/26/2006

                          HI "CSFB"......hope you had a great lunch...sounded pretty good, was it one of the "all you can eat "buffets?????......I like those the best.....Bamboo Restaurant, in Montgomery County is one of the best....they even have Maryland Blue Crabs on the Buffet and my friends laugh and tease me because it appears that I am one of the only customers who really knows what Maryland Hard Shell Crabs are and  can appreciate them.....I usually devour 8-10 at a sitting easily.......

                          BTW.....your numbers from the Chinese Fortune cookie look similar to the Powerball Numbers from Saturday......did you see the numbers???....20,34,37,39,45, &PB 32......they missed 11..

                          I like the Pizza Hut lunch buffets, but there are no Pizza Huts in Putnam County. There is a Pizza Hut in Brookfield/Danbury CT, but it doesn't have buffet. I recommend the one in Ridgefield, CT.

                          HAPPY SUNDAY...."CASH N'CARRY"

                          Our pizza Hut does have a Salad Buffet attached to it, but unfortunately it's not an "all you can eat".....the salad simply comes w/the Pizza as part aof the Lunch or dinner if you like it.

                          And the PB keeps rising in the east, along w/the sun.......Sun Smiley


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                            Posted: March 26, 2006, 4:39 pm - IP Logged

                            Thank you Libra. Just came from lunch, and the next thing I did upon arrival is go to LotteryPost. How's that for a LotteryPost junkie?

                            Had chinese for lunch and my forturne cookie said: "you can't aim a duck to death." Well, I think all LP members know that. Even Dick Cheney. (Just joking)

                            Lucky numbers are: 34 25 11 27 48 30

                            RazzHAPPY SUNDAY......3/26/2006

                            HI "CSFB"......hope you had a great lunch...sounded pretty good, was it one of the "all you can eat "buffets?????......I like those the best.....Bamboo Restaurant, in Montgomery County is one of the best....they even have Maryland Blue Crabs on the Buffet and my friends laugh and tease me because it appears that I am one of the only customers who really knows what Maryland Hard Shell Crabs are and  can appreciate them.....I usually devour 8-10 at a sitting easily.......

                            BTW.....your numbers from the Chinese Fortune cookie look similar to the Powerball Numbers from Saturday......did you see the numbers???....20,34,37,39,45, &PB 32......they missed 11..

                            I like the Pizza Hut lunch buffets, but there are no Pizza Huts in Putnam County. There is a Pizza Hut in Brookfield/Danbury CT, but it doesn't have buffet. I recommend the one in Ridgefield, CT.

                            HAPPY SUNDAY...."CASH N'CARRY"

                            Our pizza Hut does have a Salad Buffet attached to it, but unfortunately it's not an "all you can eat".....the salad simply comes w/the Pizza as part aof the Lunch or dinner if you like it.

                            And the PB keeps rising in the east, along w/the sun.......Sun Smiley

                            The Pizza Hut in Danbury/Brookfield is the same. I would have to think there is a Pizza Hut near you in MD or DC with lunch buffet, since you live in a highly populated area.

                            BTW I plan to drive through MD and DC in mid-October. Are you a single woman? I'm 42. Send me a PM if you want.

                              sirbrad's avatar - Lottery-062.jpg
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                              Posted: March 26, 2006, 5:12 pm - IP Logged

                              If you participate in work pools you better be prepared to pay the price, better yet be prepared to NOT GET PAID. Unless you have valid confirmation every week of the numbers you played, and someone you truly trust. Usually everyone who plays in work pools already have some greedy motives in mind, otherwise they would not be trying to get more plays for a fraction of the price.

                              Well we see just how hefty of a price that greed can accumulate sooner or later. Most of the people who play are not concerned with the group winning,they are thinking about their cut, and hopefully getting even more than that. Millions probably makes you do strange things, and loyalties that were upheld for years can be dropped in a heartbeat if it means getting out of "the dump" you are stuck working in.

                              "Spotting" is simply a cop out for a cheap skate who does not want to cough up the money because he is 99% sure it will be lost anyway, so why not pay it later? The fact remains that his money was not put in the pot, so he does not collect for this draw. Assuming all information described so far is all factual.