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Atheist converts after mock prayer to win $1M lottery is answered

Topic closed. 1632 replies. Last post 5 years ago by Todd.

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visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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Posted: June 11, 2011, 4:12 pm - IP Logged

you guys do realize my eventual goal is to demonstrate God is real,  and that He loves you, He is not "against you".

that He has a plan for your life that far exceeds the places,  avenues and "accomplishments" your intelligence could ever take you.

sometimes in the course of having to defend against the "destroyers of faith",  my goal doesn't get it's marquee face time it deserves.

it just did...

...vision

            "i am .........."meant to"       

P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

         until further notice,  it's  france everyday

    visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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    Posted: June 11, 2011, 8:11 pm - IP Logged

    i assistant coach a baseball team,  and no,  we dont pray before the game,  i have very rarely ever mentioned "God" while coaching,  nor do we have a poster size picture of Jesus in the dugout, but...

    ....today while we were up to bat,  one of our players struck out,  and on his way back to the dugout,  he mutters something indecipherable (from a distance),  and the kid on deck blurts out...

     "man,  that sounded like he said something in french".

    looks like God is kinda making sure joker doesn't have the luxury of writing it off as a "koinkadink"

    but,  joker will come back in this thread,  and claim i made that kid do it jeff dunham dummy style, or some other lame excuse.

    i wouldn't dare make fun of a "seeker",  they don't derserve it.

    but someone who mocks God,  whose intent is not to weigh things out,  but to excuse things away for sport,  that person 'deserves' their intent to be highlighted

    you can write off that it's a coincidence,  you can even claim i am lying about it happening everyday,  but the truth is....

    .....it has. 

    everyday      ------>  for nearly 3 years.

    shoot,  i even documented an event so you can see for yourselves,  on todays AJC.com

                "i am .........."meant to"       

    P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

             until further notice,  it's  france everyday


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      Posted: June 11, 2011, 10:56 pm - IP Logged

      "Joker, when you say: "I'm not an Atheist, I'm Agnositc, you might as well call yourself atheist..."

      Todd,

      Your comment speaks vloumes....there are atheist who would actually agree with you and they want the word "Atheist" to be defined as:

      Anyone who doesn't believe that God exist....and not just people who believe that God doesn't esist....

      Sounds like a mind twister but there is a very teeny tiny difference between

      Not believing that God exist (agnostic)

      And

      Believing that God doesn't exist (atheist)

      Not believing that God exist means that you don't believe in God but you also don't claim to know for sure that He doesn't exist....therefore you don't know either way.

      Believing that God doesn't exist means that you absolutely believe God does not exist.

      Atheist (some of them anyway) are saying what you are saying Todd, in that there should only be one category.

      Now regarding the word "agnostic".....I asked Joker what kind of agnostic he was claiming to be because there are two kinds:

      The "Can't" Know.....and...The "Don't" Know

      Can't Know Agnosticism says: "I don't know if God exist and no one can possible know it either!"

      **The problem with this is that a person would have to have absolute, total and complete knowledge to make that claim and the only ONE who has that kind of power is....GOD!

      Don't Know Agnosticism says: "I personally don't know if God exist".

      **The problem with this is anyone can find out who God is but they would have to humble themselves and open their heart and be willing to allow God to reveal Himself to them......Some of the accusations on this thread about God and the words spoken against Him are so crazy.... no wonder its difficult for those struggling to believe.

      What's even more interesting about the word "agnostic" is

      It is of Greek origin; however, its Latin counterpart is the word.....(wait for it)...........

      IGNORAMUS

      So basically, anyone who boast about being an "agnostic" is calling themselves an ignorant, know-nothing, uneducated person.....OUCH!....(I can see why some atheist want to downplay the usage of the word altogether).

      "God won't see the distinction when the day comes"

      Right you are again....and here is the scripture to back it up:

      Psalm 10:4 (for the agnostic)

      The willful, through pride of his countenance will not seek after God.  God is not in his thoughts.

      Psalm 14:1 (for the atheist)

      The fool says in his heart there is no God

      (Sounds like they would be in the same category to me too.....)

      And you have the scripture to back it up. Yup, another brainwashed human. I believe in Thor, and I have the scripture to prove it. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

      What a dumbass!

      It was written in the Bible, THEREFORE, it must be true.....You and Vision would make a great tag team....Crazy  Crazy


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        Posted: June 11, 2011, 11:05 pm - IP Logged

        i assistant coach a baseball team,  and no,  we dont pray before the game,  i have very rarely ever mentioned "God" while coaching,  nor do we have a poster size picture of Jesus in the dugout, but...

        ....today while we were up to bat,  one of our players struck out,  and on his way back to the dugout,  he mutters something indecipherable (from a distance),  and the kid on deck blurts out...

         "man,  that sounded like he said something in french".

        looks like God is kinda making sure joker doesn't have the luxury of writing it off as a "koinkadink"

        but,  joker will come back in this thread,  and claim i made that kid do it jeff dunham dummy style, or some other lame excuse.

        i wouldn't dare make fun of a "seeker",  they don't derserve it.

        but someone who mocks God,  whose intent is not to weigh things out,  but to excuse things away for sport,  that person 'deserves' their intent to be highlighted

        you can write off that it's a coincidence,  you can even claim i am lying about it happening everyday,  but the truth is....

        .....it has. 

        everyday      ------>  for nearly 3 years.

        shoot,  i even documented an event so you can see for yourselves,  on todays AJC.com

        You really need serious help. The only thing I ask you is when you go see the doctor, please don't tell him you see or hear things that are related to France on a daily basis. He will kick you out of his office, or let you stay but charge you much more money.

        You know Vision, you used to annoy me, but with this whole French thing lateley, it's somewhat entertaining. Thanx for the laughs.

        BTW, today is the 2nd day in a row I saw the word "Pumpernickle". I think God is trying to tell me something. Maybe I should move to Germany.....Eek

        Green laugh

          visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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          Posted: June 11, 2011, 11:51 pm - IP Logged

          Ummmmm, someone is knocking back quite a few tonight, so I hereby rescind my offer  to pay the bet in beer.

          I don't want to end up being an accessory to your crime.

          Anyway, I am in the arden fair mall, and awhile ago I walked by a rosetta stone booth.

          You guessed it..."france".

          However,  that doesn't count, because the occurances cannot repeat, they must me unique and a once only occurance to count.

          Doubling up is cheating on this validation scale.

          Now you see its even MORE difficult for it TO occur.

          Glad you have 2 days in a row, but you can't even go a week

          are you still.writing it all off to a "coincidence" ?

          you STILL wussed out of asking Todd to validate that PM, so you can't accuse me of lying fabrication.

          you being afraid of just that reveals the kind of man you really are

                      "i am .........."meant to"       

          P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                   until further notice,  it's  france everyday


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            Posted: June 12, 2011, 12:33 am - IP Logged

            Ummmmm, someone is knocking back quite a few tonight, so I hereby rescind my offer  to pay the bet in beer.

            I don't want to end up being an accessory to your crime.

            Anyway, I am in the arden fair mall, and awhile ago I walked by a rosetta stone booth.

            You guessed it..."france".

            However,  that doesn't count, because the occurances cannot repeat, they must me unique and a once only occurance to count.

            Doubling up is cheating on this validation scale.

            Now you see its even MORE difficult for it TO occur.

            Glad you have 2 days in a row, but you can't even go a week

            are you still.writing it all off to a "coincidence" ?

            you STILL wussed out of asking Todd to validate that PM, so you can't accuse me of lying fabrication.

            you being afraid of just that reveals the kind of man you really are

            Believe me, I think there's something to what you're saying. I'm starting a journal as of now. I will keep you updated and hope that tomorrow I'll see the word "pumpernickle" one more time, and hopefully the next day and so on.

              visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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              Posted: June 12, 2011, 1:26 am - IP Logged

              Believe me, I think there's something to what you're saying. I'm starting a journal as of now. I will keep you updated and hope that tomorrow I'll see the word "pumpernickle" one more time, and hopefully the next day and so on.

              most excellant

              may i help you to make this even easier on you,  to stack the odds farther in your favor to give yourself the most optimum chance of an occurance streak?

              'france' is far more common than "pumperknickel",  and pumperknickel has a much lower probability factor attached to it far as it's ability to occur.

              i would much rather see you pick a word that is more common,  and yet obscure just enough that you can't expect to see it in the course of everyday life.

              do as you wish,  but i would rather help you  toward the 'success' of this,  because all that will do is solidify my claim,  that it's origin of orchaestration comes from God,  and not pure chance / coincidence,  containing a zero probability factor of occuring conguently everyday for 3 years straight.

              i must however defend my positional strength that you no longer have the ability to accuse me of just delusional granduer.

              i provided proof of a timeline reaching as far back as july 28th 2009

              i offered the ability for you to observe my chronological written documents dating backwards to my original claim of the events oroginating back as far as aug 2008

              i provided varifiable proof that it happened today ....via the ajc.com  website

              so,  you can only accuse someone of something that never happened.

              the only thing you have left after the varifiable prroofs i have offered,  is to call me a liar, in regards to my claim it's happened everyday since aug 2008

              are you willing to pubilically call me a liar ?

              don't be afraid,  i am not the sensitive type when it comes to this arena of life

              in order to live within a position of strength in life,  you can't go around and call an adversary names that don't apply to the facts of what you are debating, just because you don't like the subject matter,  or the "opponent"

              your only "exit" out of this is to prove i am lying

                          "i am .........."meant to"       

              P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                       until further notice,  it's  france everyday

                mayhem's avatar - 142g5yd
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                Posted: June 12, 2011, 2:22 am - IP Logged

                There is no belief without non-belief. There is no good without evil. Evil must thank Good for its existence and vice verssa. 

                 

                Athiesm was always part of the plan. Just as a spirituality has been part of mans history from the beginning. The fact that the "stories" in the Bible are predated means nothing and is a needless distraction. 

                 

                Evolution of the church and our belief systems was even mentioned in the bible. Nothing is static in nature and niether should our beleifs be. Ever wonder why there are very few (2?) descriptions of Jesus in the bible? That was purposeful so he could be adapted to different cultures. 

                 

                The best evidence for his existence is our existence. Only more nothing comes from nothing. Why/how is anything here? Take the code the governs us. Is this really the result of a random spark of chance that is still perfecting and perpetuating itslef? Where there is code, there is always a programmer.

                How you do anything is how you do everything.


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                  Posted: June 12, 2011, 2:51 am - IP Logged

                  Could we call a TIME-OUT here?

                  It's really frustrating to watch decent people sniping away at each other because they happen to have different ideas about the concept of God.  Ironically, the human beings upon whose teachings [at least] two of the major religions were founded had a lot in common and would be saddened by such discourse.  Surely you've heard the critiques of Islam and Christianity that basically claim the followers of Jesus and Muhammad who finalized the Bible and the Quran diverged significantly from the actual teachings and examples set by the men themselves when they lived.  Whether you are inclined to believe that or not...

                  ...do you think you could take a few minutes to read the Editorial Reviews at Amazon of a book that compares and contrasts Jesus and Buddha?

                  (At least read the first one!)

                  The title is Going Home: Jesus and Buddha as Brothers.

                  http://www.amazon.com/Going-Home-Jesus-Buddha-Brothers/dp/1573228303

                  Here is a short bio of the author, Thich Nhat Hanh.

                  http://www.amazon.com/Thich-Nhat-Hanh/e/B000AP5YRY/ref=ntt_dp_epwbk_0

                  I hope that reading this helps to calm people down a little here, and see that they really may not disagree as much as they think they do...

                  --Jimmy4164

                  P.S.  There's even a reference to something visiondude is currently interested in, and it starts with the letter "F!"


                    visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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                    Posted: June 12, 2011, 3:55 am - IP Logged

                    There is no belief without non-belief. There is no good without evil. Evil must thank Good for its existence and vice verssa. 

                     

                    Athiesm was always part of the plan. Just as a spirituality has been part of mans history from the beginning. The fact that the "stories" in the Bible are predated means nothing and is a needless distraction. 

                     

                    Evolution of the church and our belief systems was even mentioned in the bible. Nothing is static in nature and niether should our beleifs be. Ever wonder why there are very few (2?) descriptions of Jesus in the bible? That was purposeful so he could be adapted to different cultures. 

                     

                    The best evidence for his existence is our existence. Only more nothing comes from nothing. Why/how is anything here? Take the code the governs us. Is this really the result of a random spark of chance that is still perfecting and perpetuating itslef? Where there is code, there is always a programmer.

                    "The fact that the "stories" in the Bible are predated means nothing and is a needless distraction". 

                    the predation of the bible means everything.

                    the bible throughout it's historical run has always distanced itself from being assigned as 'just another chronicle' of history.

                    the internal flow of the bible seeks to fulfill the claim that it was inspired by God,  thru the recordations of mans experiences.

                    the only way the bible could ever make the internal claim it does, and valiDATE it,  is by it's predated prophetic flow.

                    otherwise,  it's just a book of the history of mens lives / experience,  no different than any other book in history.

                    someone with a better knowledge of fulfilled scripture evidently made the claim Jesus Christ fulfilled somewhere around 300 prophecies just Himself.

                    that feat can only occur if the "fulfillment"  was  pre dated

                    aside from Christ,  the self fulfilling documents have included the recordation of dates,  followed by the fulfillment thereof.

                    israel becoming a nation comes to mind,  as the bible predicted that hundreds of years prior

                    future tense,  predation "predicted" the future of technology before it was invented,  a feat impossible to claim unless dates where attached to it.

                    like i have been "debating" with joker,  "fulfillment" is merely subjective,  until it is collective and congruent,  a feat observable within the text itself,   sans "biased" observance.

                    it was a long winded explanation as that was,  pre dating is everything with these kinds of stakes attached

                                "i am .........."meant to"       

                    P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                             until further notice,  it's  france everyday

                      visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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                      Posted: June 12, 2011, 4:24 am - IP Logged

                      in keeping with my "comittment" to joker,  so he can't fabricate the "origin" .........of my origin, 

                      i was watching a show i had recorded on the dvr about the new NY ink show tonight.

                      started watching it and a few minutes into it,  2 guys working in the shop are discussing the shops largesse, etc,  and one of them comented on the floor tiles, that they were expensive and imported.

                      the other guy says "they are from france"

                      don't believe me?   check it out yourself.    it's the new NY ink show on TLC.  the shows air date 6/02/11

                      when he said that,  i looked at the clock.   it was 12:02am.

                      semi ho hum significant,  in that when i measure a "day" during the observation process,  a "day" constitutes 12am to 12am.

                      it has to occur at least once within that frametime to count,  in order for it to be validated as happening congruently everyday.

                      it has to be a one off first time non repeatable event.  (no going to the refrigerator and grabbing a bottle of french's mustard and claiming an "ah hah"). 

                      one a day at minimum,  original,  or it doesn't count.

                      when are one of you guys that handle math proficiently ever going to remind joker of the odds of that occuring everyday for nearly 3 years ?

                      i would love to see that decimate the decimal system up close and personal.

                      any takers?

                      anyway,  at 12:02 starters gun,  i am off and running already on sunday,  having already been witness to the first apperance thereof.

                      2 minutes into the day,   so any other "occurances" just make me laugh.

                      2 minutes into the day.  ummm.  nice, God,  nice that i can cruise the rest of the day.

                      lets face it,  God sometimes likes to deal out the cards "last minute".....just so we will trust Him to do what He says He will on time.

                      been on the receiving end of last minute "concerns" a bazillion times (slight exaggeration),   but never once have i ever witnessed God not doing what He said he would do,  before He told me He would.

                      this france thing isn't my first rodeo,  but it's certainly the most prolific.

                      i have a suspicion as to what it means,  but not unlike God,  and how He chooses to mete out His plans, He hasn't fully filled in the blanks on the "france thing".

                      trust.   trust is a key component to intimacy with God.         (in any relationship worth anything really)

                      wherever He leads with this...i trust Him, and i will follow AND adjust to whatever He decides.

                                  "i am .........."meant to"       

                      P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                               until further notice,  it's  france everyday

                        visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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                        Posted: June 12, 2011, 5:03 am - IP Logged

                        Could we call a TIME-OUT here?

                        It's really frustrating to watch decent people sniping away at each other because they happen to have different ideas about the concept of God.  Ironically, the human beings upon whose teachings [at least] two of the major religions were founded had a lot in common and would be saddened by such discourse.  Surely you've heard the critiques of Islam and Christianity that basically claim the followers of Jesus and Muhammad who finalized the Bible and the Quran diverged significantly from the actual teachings and examples set by the men themselves when they lived.  Whether you are inclined to believe that or not...

                        ...do you think you could take a few minutes to read the Editorial Reviews at Amazon of a book that compares and contrasts Jesus and Buddha?

                        (At least read the first one!)

                        The title is Going Home: Jesus and Buddha as Brothers.

                        http://www.amazon.com/Going-Home-Jesus-Buddha-Brothers/dp/1573228303

                        Here is a short bio of the author, Thich Nhat Hanh.

                        http://www.amazon.com/Thich-Nhat-Hanh/e/B000AP5YRY/ref=ntt_dp_epwbk_0

                        I hope that reading this helps to calm people down a little here, and see that they really may not disagree as much as they think they do...

                        --Jimmy4164

                        P.S.  There's even a reference to something visiondude is currently interested in, and it starts with the letter "F!"


                        haha, the letter "F",  the bonus plan i guess in this instance.

                        i read where the guy said the author hanh stated he considers it a waste of time to discuss "whether God is a person or not a person"....

                        i bet he does.

                        Historical Christianity,  it's teaching,  it's history,   it's core values,  all center around a person, it contains zero desire to be relegated into being just another "way of life",  seeking to co-exist shoulder to shoulder with other "ways of life" based on an "everythings equal" playground.

                        Christianity seeks to exclude itself from the pack,  by being personal,  with a personal God

                        without the designation of God being a living breathing personal entity,  there is no "Christianity".

                        by hahn steering the discussion in directions like those,  He accomplishes his goal of stripping away the authority of God over His creation by an impersonal hands off approach,  and Christianity is 180 degree's opposite from that.

                        i can see the "can't we all just get along" vibe being viable,  but only to a point.

                        at some point,  any Christian who understands historical Christianity,  knows it's impossible to relegate Christianity as just another means of "good living".

                        when that begins to happen,  a line gets drawn in the sand.

                        it is my goal as a Christian to get along with every human being,  irregardless of beliefs.   that is what i am commanded to do.

                        but i am also commanded to obey God over man,  especially during the attempted dilution process of turning a personal God down to just a "way of life"

                        at some point,  i could not become an accessory to that crime,  just for the sake of "understanding"

                        at some point,  a Christian will have to pick the absolutes of God being personal and authoratative over His creation,  far before they can have an "understanding" between others that includes ditching the "personal" out of the equation.

                        Christianity was never "a good way to live",  nor will it ever evolve into that.

                        it's a byproduct that becomes that,  but only as an addendum to living circumspectly before a God who is personal first

                        anyone that can accomplish that feat (making God "impersonal")   gets to be their own rule maker,  because then it becomes wildly chaotic,  and subjective from person to person,  removing the "authoratative" aspect.

                        Jesus Christ claimed to be THE way,  not "a way".     

                        when He solidified that claim,  it effectively eliminated my responsibility to agree with hanh on that level.

                        initually for the sake of respect, yes.

                        but the eventuality of it all,  not a chance

                                    "i am .........."meant to"       

                        P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                                 until further notice,  it's  france everyday

                          Perfecttiming2's avatar - redcross

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                          Posted: June 12, 2011, 1:18 pm - IP Logged

                          And you have the scripture to back it up. Yup, another brainwashed human. I believe in Thor, and I have the scripture to prove it. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

                          What a dumbass!

                          It was written in the Bible, THEREFORE, it must be true.....You and Vision would make a great tag team....Crazy  Crazy

                          Hi Joker17,

                          Hope you have a great day and a great a week.

                          Take care and God Bless.

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                            Posted: June 12, 2011, 9:18 pm - IP Logged

                            You really need serious help. The only thing I ask you is when you go see the doctor, please don't tell him you see or hear things that are related to France on a daily basis. He will kick you out of his office, or let you stay but charge you much more money.

                            You know Vision, you used to annoy me, but with this whole French thing lateley, it's somewhat entertaining. Thanx for the laughs.

                            BTW, today is the 2nd day in a row I saw the word "Pumpernickle". I think God is trying to tell me something. Maybe I should move to Germany.....Eek

                            Green laugh

                            According to Dan Brown, Mary Magdalene took hers and Jesus' kids to France so it's possible there is some significants. Or we could ask the nice people in the Mystical forum which pick-3 and pick-4 dream numbers to play for France.

                              visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
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                              Posted: June 12, 2011, 9:31 pm - IP Logged

                              well,  you can tell that's an historical lie,  of historical proportions.

                              inflated fiction writers,  and their inflammatory "facts"  for profit. 

                              Jesus never had children,  because He was never married.

                              and despite the just for immediate fun and games of our society,  Jesus never had sex.

                              He would have obeyed the edicts of Gods word about sex.        none outside of marriage

                              not exactly hollywood "friendly" on either the book or movie level

                              one things for sure,  dan brown is snot a "historian"

                                          "i am .........."meant to"       

                              P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                                       until further notice,  it's  france everyday

                                 
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