Legislator wants to shut down Texas Lottery if they don't comply
By Kate Northrop
A Texas State Senator threatened to shut down the Texas Lottery if they were not to enforce a Senate bill prohibiting lottery couriers in the state.
Senator Bob Hall has made it clear that he would choose to defund the Texas Lottery should they violate a potential state law banning lottery courier companies.
Hall has consistently delivered scathing criticisms of the Texas Lottery since a purchasing group based in New Jersey "bought" a $95 million Lotto Texas jackpot in April 2023 with the help of lottery courier companies, with one of his most provocative claims being the supposed existence of a "crime syndicate inside the Texas Lottery."
During the Senate Committee on State Affairs meeting this week, the Senate passed SB28 by a vote of 31-0, which would make it a criminal offense to play the lottery or facilitate playing the lottery by phone or through the Internet.
SB28 outlines several scenarios that would effectively become illegal: purchasing lottery tickets through a mobile or Internet application, accepting a ticket order or selling tickets over the Internet, or arranging to purchase a ticket on behalf of a person playing the lottery. These limitations were largely created with banning lottery couriers in mind.
The Texas Lottery Commission has already declared its stance against lottery couriers, since it announced a new policy banning courier services on Monday, but this bill would go a step beyond Lottery Commission policy by making couriers illegal under state law.
In other words, violating the Lottery's policy in its current state could merely mean a retailer jeopardizing their license. However, the bill criminalizes the behavior, something that the Lottery does not have the authority to do. Those who do break the law would face legal repercussions of fines and possible prison time for up to one year.
The Texas Lottery would be required to enforce the law if it passes. If it doesn't, Hall warned, it should be shut down.
"In Section 1 of your bill, the Lottery Commission is mandated... to adopt rules to enforce the prohibitions against facilitating the play of the lottery through courier apps," Senator Angela Paxton addressed Hall. "Would you please speak to what would happen if the Lottery Commission does not adopt such rules?"
"We would just zero out their budget," Hall responded. "It's real easy for them. If all they did was just revert back to the law as it was passed, they [lottery couriers] would go away."
"Zeroing" out the Lottery's budget would basically mean an operational shutdown, a death sentence for a state lottery in Texas. There would be no funding to support the Lottery's operations, including prize payouts, facilities, staff, marketing, and its main product — lottery tickets. The state could potentially lose out on approximately $2 billion annually, a majority of which goes to the Foundation School Fund.
Hall also argued in his opening remarks that the Multi-State Lottery Association, which oversees the Powerball multi-state draw game, had adopted rules under previous leadership that made it easier for Texas to become more lenient toward lottery couriers over time. It was, he reasoned, a valid reason to consider ending Powerball in Texas.
"The Texas Legislature voted to join the Multi-State Lottery Association to sell games like Powerball, but our state's participation in membership should be reconsidered," Hall said.
However, Lottery Executive Director Ryan Mindell made it clear that the Lottery Commission has no intention of veering from the path Legislature lays out for it, and that the agency would adjust its policies to abide by the current law.
"I plan to bring to the board next Tuesday rulemaking that will make it clear that any retailer that works with a lottery ticket courier — we will take action against your license," Mindell affirmed.
Hall had previously attempted to ban lottery couriers in the past. His Senate Bill 1820 for the 2023-2024 Texas Legislative Session passed unanimously in the Senate but later died in the House.
With the latest version of the bill unanimously succeeding in the Senate once more, SB28 now faces the House as its predecessor did before.
It's heating up, geesh what abt these other states wonder will this prompt all states to have online system to prevent couriers
These courier services have lent support to complex businesses to defeat the dollar and a dream themes for most everyday lottery players and this is simply not good to the everyday player as the playing field is no longer equal and this is what the law makers are trying to curb.
Exactly they hv the funds to do
excited to see if they can manage the $5 MM ticket
Still more questions than answers.
Like how is it possible that an investment group in NJ able to purchase 99% of all combinations using an online service or app?
And how did they zero in on using Lottery.com's terminals in Austin and Waco? How did they know these people had the necessary equipment and supplies to accomplish the job?
And don't expect me to believe someone in NJ typed in each of those combinations on a phone or computer.
Peter Sullivan offered half the answer that these groups are watching/ targeting the lotteries where the payout is grater than the permutations, but that doesn't explain how they accomplish the buyout.
It appears that these services have preprinted playslips or use computer printed playslips because those people in NJ can't and aren't filling out and shipping 25 million playslips to Texas in time to have them sent through a terminal in time for the drawing. That's where Senator hall is getting his "crime syndicate" association.
I hope he's wrong, but he is right on ending these third party couriers which allow and encourage these organized groups to operate behind the scenes.
He's right that once you shut these activities down they will move on. Texas will no longer be a target.
Once third party couriers are shut down these people have to physically come into the state, bring their 25 million playslips and find enough terminals willing and capable of printing all of them in two/three days
And when the owners of those terminals which sell, pick a number, 10000 tickets a week start printing 10000 an hour, you got red flags that something is amiss.
When those terminal owners request supplies to print 1000000 and need them yesterday, you got a red flag.
When you see multiple terminal owners requesting this amount of supplies another red flag.
But these safeguards are defeated with third party couriers.
As I said last night if the decision is no lottery or no third party couriers, bye third party couriers. You don't add anything to the lottery and you compromise the safeguards.
G
I subscribed... please post the updates
According to Google, the Texas lottery generates $2.1billion for the Texas public school system each year. That’s 2.3% of their total budget. With 380,000 total teachers in Texas public schools, a 2.3% cut would be 11,400 layoffs. I don’t see that happening… unless Senator Bob Hall never wants to get reelected.
All that said, I’m not a fan of lottery couriers as I’ve seen them win jackpots in both Oregon and Colorado when I’ve lived there. I always get excited when I see a lottery jackpot that was won in my state, but then I see it was actually won by someone elsewhere, it sucks. When I lived in Oregon, we had a jackpot won by someone in the middle east (Iraq, I think).
"It appears that these services have preprinted playslips or use computer printed playslips because those people in NJ can't and aren't filling out and shipping 25 million playslips to Texas in time to have them sent through a terminal in time for the drawing. That's where Senator hall is getting his "crime syndicate" association."
"And when the owners of those terminals which sell, pick a number, 10000 tickets a week start printing 10000 an hour, you got red flags that something is amiss.
When those terminal owners request supplies to print 1000000 and need them yesterday, you got a red flag.
When you see multiple terminal owners requesting this amount of supplies another red flag."
Great points garyo!
It's an important issue to me. I've spent quite a bit over the years playing the games of Texas. And without referring to a spreadsheet, like almost everyone else, I know I'm in the red.
I'm irritated about the whole situation. I'm irritated that the laws/regulations were in place to prevent it and the lottery commission (Gary Grief) ignored those. I'm irritated these people making headlines know far more than what they are saying, yet the continue to talk about them as if everybody already knows.
They allude to the fact that the law expressedly started the lottery as a game of chance, never saying the lottery is a game if chance. It was never meant to be a commodity for sale to the highest bidder or an entity looking to profit from a buyout.
Why not say it? Why not point out that Texas has no state tax and the party that bought out the 95 million dollar lottery prize more than doubled their money ($59 million). And the 83.5 million dollar payout would mean a $52 million, more than twice the $25 million necessary to buy it.
Say The Texas lottery has become a consumer product for profit, not the game of chance that was intended.
And the Texas lottery commission under Gary Grief let it become what it is by ignoring the laws designed to prevent that from happening. He possibly encouraged that process by wooing Lottery.com to relocate into the state so they could sell tickets from terminals physically located in the state as the law requires.
His misguided view of growing the lottery may not have been with criminal intent but somewhere along the way the line between what was legal and what was in the best interest of the lottery became blurred by ticket sales.
Say The lottery has been so slack in adhering to the law/regulations in place we're now faced with forced extremes in the other direction, an overcorrection, to bring balance back to what was envisioned to be a game.
I could go on and on and on but I prefer not too. I bought Powerball tickets tonight. Not the usual Powerball and Texas Lotto.
I'm irritated that the people put in place to prevent any of this were willing participants.
Then the legislation group had to do something to make it safer than that!
They kept the same slips from last time
they must have a way to ask each of the 30 machines to print so many tickets or they are hiring some people to sit there and put tickets in the machine for 3 days in shifts
Yea would love to know if u got 30 machines and each prints out 1million each
they had to send the $$ to ATX thru an account
"When those terminal owners request supplies to print 1000000 and need them yesterday, you got a red flag."
With 25 million possible outcomes logistics are a nightmare at best. Back in the day when some lotto games had less than 10 million possible outcomes, it was purposed that a terminal be programed to print an "all ways" ticket. Horse and dog races have trifecta and superfecta "all" tickets using "1 all", "2 all", etc.
If the Texas Lottery is keeping 50% of every dollar wagered, selling out any game can only add to the profits. The logic of not allowing it is similar to the Mass Lottery's Cash Winfall game. While it actually added to the lottery profit, they decided it was unfair to average lottery players.
Stack this stuff is so deep and complicated we're still getting new information
We learned from Lottery.com's lawyer, Greg Potts, that Lottery.com is already under investigation by the US Dept of Justice involving actions of it's prior board of directors
Greg Potts also told the lawmakers that Lottery.com asked if this were legal and were assured by the lottery commission they had no problem with it.
iGT testified that Winners Circle was in possession of 47 terminals, not the 30 the Lt Governor thought.
The buyout was facilitated using QR codes to rapidly scan the combinations directly into the machines. And extra workers were hired for the task
The lawmakers outlined 13 different provisions of state law believed/alleged to have been circumvented including sales to minors and lottery officials plus the restriction on influencing the outcome.
They noted that courier services account for about $173 million of the billions that is spent annually on the lottery in Texas. Basically a small portion is derived from courier services. Over the last five years it was estimated third party couriers contributed $550 million total. Still a small amount.
There are 18 states that license courier services. Only three actually license third party couriers.
Answers a slowly coming out. There was even talk of instituting a regulatory commission in Texas.
Once all the "Don't Mess with Texas" was done and they got some answers it was pretty clear that nobody, and that includes me, wants to "Death to the Texas Lottery."
G
I lived there in the 90's and this was unheard of . I played the lottery and never heard of these far fetched accusations. Politicians in NM tried to shut the lottery down but we're ignored.
Hall needs to sit his azz down somewhere.
These hypocrites are fine with allowing sports betting but not playing the lottery online.
Did that group in NJ cheat? Or are people just mad that that money is not going to a texas resident. To that I so what that someone from another state won the Texas lottery. Congrats to them
The first draw in Texas was November, 1992. Without searching, I'm guessing third party couriers didn't come along until much later.
But the whole mess is a bit on the farfetched side.
Consider Draft Kings owns Jackpocket. Jackpocket owns Lottery.com.
Jackpocket operates out of Winner's Circle. Since Texas law requires lottery retailers to offer a product other than lottery tickets somebody, somewhere decided Winners Circle would offer scratch-offs to get around that requirement. And the Texas Lottery approved it.
Is it getting crazy enough for you?
Gregg Potts, Lottery com's lawyer testified that they asked if there would be a problem fulfilling the order from NJ. They were given the okay.
He testified they expected the request to be declined. And only proceeded when they were given the okay.
So it was okay in April 2023 to sell every combination.
Fast forward to December 2024 When the same NJ group attempted a second buyout. Executive Director of the Texas Lottery, Ryan Mindell, testifies that the new safeguards in place stopped that attempt.
But If it were okay in 2023 what caused the reversal and new safeguards put in place that prevented it from being okay in 2024?
Yeah, it only became not okay after the successful buyout came to light and the lottery commission found itself in the fire. In other words, as long as nobody knew the buyout occurred it was okay, but when it became public knowledge, it became not okay. Right?
When asked the average number of terminals a retailer possesses the lawmakers were told one. And yet IGT installed 47 in Winners Circle no questions asked.
IGT also testified that all additional terminals have be removed. A new max limit has been set at 5.
And there is a limit on the number of tickets a terminal/retailer can print/sell in a day. No number was given about that limit.
Lt Governor Dan Patrick says the investigations will continue in this farfetched matter.
And it probably should given all the missteps that have occurred, the alleged violations of law, and the apparent lack of accountability by Gary Grief and the Texas Lottery Commission.
G
They are not going to shut down such a huge source of income for the state just to replace it with nothing.
"In Section 1 of your bill, the Lottery Commission is mandated... to adopt rules to enforce the prohibitions against facilitating the play of the lottery through courier apps," Senator Angela Paxton addressed Hall.
They still have not said what's so wrong about playing the lottery online.
Why adopt rules to enforce the prohibitions against facilitating the play of the lottery through courier apps in the first place?
Why not prohibit online sports betting or even investing online? What's the difference?
"And there is a limit on the number of tickets a terminal/retailer can print/sell in a day. No number was given about that limit."
Why limit the number of tickets a terminal/retailer can print/sell in a day?
This is an attack on people who predict and win the lottery regularly. Don't be fooled by these greedy azz politicians and state lotteries who want you to lose so they can keep making money from the players that suck at predicting.
People should be allowed to become professional lottery players if they want to and buy ticket from anywhere. We still have to develop a winning strategy, which will not happen with 90% of players.
Players who win more than they lose want to be able to play online. If you give a d@mn about lottery players then vote to allow us to play online wherever the hail we want. What are they so afraid of when most people lose more than they win anyway?
Some of us actually come to lotterypost to learn and practice creating winning strategies and when we do create a winning strategy they want to limit us. That's some BS! We should be rewarded for our hard work, not fined or thrown in jail for playing a strategy.
"Say The Texas lottery has become a consumer product for profit, not the game of chance that was intended"
Do you feel people who develop winning strategies should be allowed to become professional lottery players if they choose to?
Are you in Texas?
Have you been following anything Todd or Kate have written?
Are you aware that Pete Sullivan, from Draft Kings testified that groups watch and target lotteries once the payout is larger than the permutations of the game? And that additional steps limiting the number of terminals and the number of tickets sold by any terminal has been instituted?
Did you know that Texas lottery Commission prohibited third party couriers service as of last Monday?
Are you aware that the Lt Governor's office, the State Attorney General, and the Texas Rangers all have started investigations on the breakdowns that occurred and possible criminal charges to come?
What do you know about the class action lawsuit claiming fraud against the state, the Lottery Commission, Gary Grief, and IGT?
What is a professional lottery player anyway? Do you consider yourself a professional lottery player?
Wouldn't you agree there are many other games with better odds?
I can answer that. Anyone can call them self a "professional lottery player". And develop winning strategies. But buying 25 million + tickets containing all the possible combinations by conglomerates are not "professional lottery players". They are simply gaming the system and cheating all the other players.
While I watched the jackpot reach 80 million, I was wondering if and when someone would pull the same trick as last time in 2023.
If that continues, people aren't going to play when they realize they don't have a chance to win when the jackpot gets to a certain point.
Personally, I'm not a high roller. I spend $1 -$3 on the game, skipping Mondays, play $1 on Wednesday, and $3 on Saturday, as the jackpot is highest on Saturday until it's won. It rolled 101 times, I as well as a other players feel cheated that again someone bought the jackpot.
There are legislators in Austin that see this as an opportunity to shut down the lottery. I as well as most, or all, other lottery players don't want to see that.
Exactly buying all the combinations is not a system. It's a means of cheating everyone else.
G
Are you in Texas?
Why does that matter to you?
Have you been following anything Todd or Kate have written?
They write a lot. Be specific.
Are you aware that Pete Sullivan, from Draft Kings testified that groups watch and target lotteries once the payout is larger than the permutations of the game?
So it's ok to be penalized for playing smart?
And that additional steps limiting the number of terminals and the number of tickets sold by any terminal has been instituted?
Did you know that Texas lottery Commission prohibited third party couriers service as of last Monday?
The question is why? Why prohibit third party couriers and the number of tickets?
Are you aware that the Lt Governor's office, the State Attorney General, and the Texas Rangers all have started investigations on the breakdowns that occurred and possible criminal charges to come?
What do you know about the class action lawsuit claiming fraud against the state, the Lottery Commission, Gary Grief, and IGT?
What is a professional lottery player anyway?
People who are able to pay their bills on a regular using a lottery strategies they they took years to master.
Do you consider yourself a professional lottery player?
Why does that matter to you?
Wouldn't you agree there are many other games with better odds?
The Pick 3 game has the best odds. What affects one lottery game affects all lottery games.
It seems that the only people whining about players who win are the lottery commissions and the players that lose more than they win.
I can answer that. Anyone can call them self a "professional lottery player". And develop winning strategies.
Not true. A significant majority of players lose more than they win because they have not developed a winning strategy.
But buying 25 million + tickets containing all the possible combinations by conglomerates are not "professional lottery players". They are simply gaming the system and cheating all the other players.
Buying the Jackpot ok I get it. However, my biggest issue is that the regulators need to be specific about which games they prohibit from buying tickets online.
Making it illegal for people to buy pick 3 online through 3rd party couriers is ridiculous.
I only play the pick 3 game. That's all I care about. No one can profit from buying all 1,000 pick 3 combinations. If they're mad at big lottery game players like the Tx lottery, Mega Millions, and the Power ball then penalize just those games.
What do the big games have to do with the little games. They are no where near the same.
Pick 3 players actually have to create a winning strategy and the "jackpot" never changes.
This should not be a blanket law that applies to the small lottery games is all I'm saying. Some of us do just fine only playing the Pick 3/4/5 games. I like to win so I don't even waste my money on the big games because the odds suck.
If you don't live in Texas it's none of your concern how Texans run their lotteries. It doesn't affect you in the least.
And with 100s of other games that you can play by third party couriers, you have nothing to complain about.
Now, the only whiners I see are YOU!
You fancy yourself a professional who has developed a system to win at lottery and here you are whining that ONE game out of 100s won't let you play the way you want.
Well, newsflash games have rules. You don't always get to make those rules but you are expected to follow them.
Why not go win all the other games that have rules you like and leave Texans to write rules that ensure everyone a fair shot?
Or whine some more. It won't change anything but at least you'll get it out and get over yourself.
I'm not here to here to disrespect anyone. I'm grown AF. I can talk about whatever I want to talk about anywhere in the universe.
The law affects all Texas lottery games like the pick 3 does it not?
Making it illegal to buy pick 3 tickets online through third party couriers is ridiculous because there is no point in buying all possible combinations and the amount you win never increases.
I apologize if you felt disrespected, but you came in ranting about the measures taken without clarifying you were upset over Pick 3.
Unless you make it clear how are we supposed know you weren't referring to the larger games?
As has been said the lawmakers are taking measures to overcorrect the slack policies that have plagued the Texas Lottery Commission.
I posted the numbers ($173 million) that third party couriers services contribute to the state lottery which is less than one tenth what the state lottery contributes to the school fund($2.1 billion).
The loss of third party couriers services is acceptable given the possibility of the billions the state would lose to groups targeting the jackpot.
Remember the last two jackpots totaled $180 million. That's more than the services contribute in one year. And to be fair, Pete Sullivan of Jackpocket assured lawmakers the $83.5 million jackpot was won by a Texan.
While Pick 3 is not involved in the buyout or potential buyouts it's victim to being part of the blanket policy Texas put in place.
It's unfortunate but making exceptions to law, policy, and procedures is what caused this calamity.
It is what it is.
No worries.
While Pick 3 is not involved in the buyout or potential buyouts it's victim to being part of the blanket policy Texas put in place.
It's unfortunate but making exceptions to law, policy, and procedures is what caused this calamity.
It is what it is.
There should be exceptions to laws, policies, and procedures if the pick 3 has nothing to do with buying jackpots. This affects all of us who want to predict full-time and yes become professional pick 3 players because we love what we do and we're great at it just like professional poker players. If this is what we choose to do these regulators need to leave pick 3 players out of it. We catching strays. We're getting punished for doing something we can even do in the small games we play. If one bad kid gets in trouble we all get a whoopin'. That's not right. Whoop that one kid and leave the rest of us alone Senator Hall!
It is truly what it is. Stupid Texas regulators messing with our ability to generate a regular source of income for our families doing what we love. The people who make the laws are the problem.
You aren't sounding adult about anything. Just whiny.
Nothing Texas has done should keep you from paying your bills. Your creditors aren't going to buy the excuse, "Texas stopped third party couriers services so I can't pay." Not in a million years will they listen so why should we?
And With the numerous other pick 3 games you don't have a legit point. In short Texas is not stopping you from playing pick 3 or generating a revenue stream. If you are a professional and your system works you just move on to the next game. That's what adults do.
Given the amount third party couriers contribute to the Texas lottery not as many as you claim are affected.
Now if Texas were the only pick 3 in the country you might have a point. But it's not and you don't.
Again, I'm not here to disrespect you.
At this point I'm talking to the Texas pick 3 players.
"While Pick 3 is not involved in the buyout or potential buyouts it's victim to being part of the blanket policy Texas put in place."
"the Senate passed SB28 by a vote of 31-0, which would make it a criminal offense to play the lottery or facilitate playing the lottery by phone or through the Internet."
Texas made it a criminal offense to play the pick 3 game on the internet because of something that has nothing to do with the pick 3 game. The results show that the state of Texas wants to have a monopoly on the lottery which is some BS!!
You should care if about this if you've spent years on lotterypost practicing to master this game and make a regular income from it. The main people that don't care are the stupid law makers, the people that blindly support them, and players who lose more than they win. For the regular winners, we absolutely must get this law changed in our favor.
There is nothing wrong with playing the pick 3 game onlineonline. There is nothing wrong with you being able to pay your bills because of your talent/skill/ability to predict the pick 3 game. Only a hater would be mad at us and make it illegal for us to do what we do. These hypocrites don't make it illegal for sports bettors, poker players, and investors to do what they do online, so why pick 3 players!!!
We shouldn't have to be limited to going to a store, and not being able to buy as many tickets that we need at one time, along with paying high azz prices for combos.
I don't expect you know or care what I'm talking about if you don't have a winning strategy.
The average player loses more than they win. I speak for the above average players who know d@mn well what I'm talking about.
We must get our money together, organize, and make results happen in our favor. We must educate these law makers and come to an mutually beneficial agreement.
azzWe know they want more money and winners take away their money by winning. They want us to be losers but that's not in our DNA. The reality is 95% of the players will never have a profitable strategy because it requires creativity and what's seen as extreme discipline an hard azz work for years so there are always going to be more than enough losers to donate money to TLC because the couriers ultimately still have to buy tickets from TLC.
There's more than enough money in this game for everyone. The couriers make money from the players, and TLC makes money from the couriers, and the government makes money from taxes. It's a win win for every one involved.
This is like someone (TLC and the state of Texas) making 10X and have the nerve to complain about winners making 1x. There are still enough loses out there to profit from. Yall I'm can get mad all you want I'm just being real.