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Pick-3 Positional Frequency

Topic closed. 22 replies. Last post 9 years ago by Lkydeb*594.

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Dump Water Florida
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Posted: July 29, 2007, 3:14 am - IP Logged

I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

    LosingJeff's avatar - flower
    Greenfield
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    Posted: July 29, 2007, 4:20 am - IP Logged

    I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

    For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

    In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

    Hi Bob,

        Try your test on Indiana. It should be easier to figure out seeing how they paid 3 straight winners on Pic 3 yesterday (0 midday/3 evening)  With the Lotto being as high as it is you would think that there should have been 500 straight winners.

    " FUN IS BAD " ----causes Bankruptcy

      RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
      mid-Ohio
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      Posted: July 29, 2007, 7:15 am - IP Logged

      I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

      For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

      In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

      Sounds like you tried that positional frequency on a pick5 game using a  5x5x5 matrix.  In my lottery program, when ever I check combinations within a file or with another file, all the winning numbers are high lighted and added up.  At the end of each search the total hits per file and position are shown.  Since the numbers in the file are sorted the information is useless because number one is always in the first position and the highest number is in the last position.  It might work in a game like pick3 or pick4 since numbers are stored in the order they were picked.

      I did put a feature in my RNG that I use to pick my combinations to reject combinations with numbers in positions they don't normally appear in most of the time and my rejection file had more winners than the accepted file that I played.

       * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
         
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        JAP69's avatar - alas
        South Carolina
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        Posted: July 29, 2007, 9:10 am - IP Logged

        I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

        For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

        In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

        I use positional frequency and positional due for exact order wheeling.
        I try to cut my plays to a minimum so I loose out often.

        I look in a lot of areas to find digits for reapeat or due by position.

        One example is one that I just posted in my blog on finding digits in the front pair. It was the 2 ball that I felt was ready to drop either in position 1 or 2 in S.C.. It fell in both positions yesterday. So putting the digit 2 in position 1 and 2 for the wheel was a good to go for me.

        I search a lot of areas to find digits by position which would be to much to explain in this thread.

        A short example of one of my search areas is in my signature. Digits in a group.
        Pick 1 or 2 groups by position for your next draw for wheeling and eliminate a digit or more from the group by position if desired.

        Oo'Ka

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          Kentucky
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          Posted: July 29, 2007, 7:30 pm - IP Logged

          I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

          For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

          In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

          "The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s)."

          It probably shows that the top 5 digits in each position had about 60% of hits and shows the smaller percentage even/odd and low/high bias too. It might even show had you played the most frequent digits in all positions, you may have broke even but the majority of the hits were combinations of high and low frequency digits.

          There might be a spot-play by playing the low/high - even/odd bias.

           

          9

          21
          659
          166
          584
          072

           

          As an example, the first position has a high/odd bias, the second high/even, and the third low/even. The spot-play would be 562, 564, 582, 584, 962, 964, 982, and 984. You could check how many times that happened when all three digits hit in the high frequency range and playing for 8 bucks is easier on the wallet than playing for $125.

          (edited to try to put the "9" back into the first column)

            BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
            Dump Water Florida
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            Posted: July 29, 2007, 9:51 pm - IP Logged

            Sounds like you tried that positional frequency on a pick5 game using a  5x5x5 matrix.  In my lottery program, when ever I check combinations within a file or with another file, all the winning numbers are high lighted and added up.  At the end of each search the total hits per file and position are shown.  Since the numbers in the file are sorted the information is useless because number one is always in the first position and the highest number is in the last position.  It might work in a game like pick3 or pick4 since numbers are stored in the order they were picked.

            I did put a feature in my RNG that I use to pick my combinations to reject combinations with numbers in positions they don't normally appear in most of the time and my rejection file had more winners than the accepted file that I played.

            RJoh: Say you are selecting Pick-3 digits by position and you like three digits in the first position, two in the second and two in the third.  Your playing matrix would be 3x2x2 = 12 numbers. 

            A-B-C = ABC ABF AEC AEF
            D-E-F = DEF DEC DBC DBF 
            G      = GBC GBF GEC GEF

            If you like five digits in the first position, five in the second position and five in the third position the playing matrix would be 5x5x5 = 125 numbers.

            In a Pick-5 game the full matrix would be AAxBBxCCxEExFF.

            BobP
             

             

             

              BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
              Dump Water Florida
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              Posted: July 29, 2007, 9:59 pm - IP Logged

              "The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s)."

              It probably shows that the top 5 digits in each position had about 60% of hits and shows the smaller percentage even/odd and low/high bias too. It might even show had you played the most frequent digits in all positions, you may have broke even but the majority of the hits were combinations of high and low frequency digits.

              There might be a spot-play by playing the low/high - even/odd bias.

               

              9

              21
              659
              166
              584
              072

               

              As an example, the first position has a high/odd bias, the second high/even, and the third low/even. The spot-play would be 562, 564, 582, 584, 962, 964, 982, and 984. You could check how many times that happened when all three digits hit in the high frequency range and playing for 8 bucks is easier on the wallet than playing for $125.

              (edited to try to put the "9" back into the first column)

              Yes there is always at least one winning ball missing out of the columns of five.  The old theory about the numbers rising to the top like cream must have gone out when the state homogenized the drawings.  BobP



                BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
                Dump Water Florida
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                Posted: July 30, 2007, 4:39 am - IP Logged

                RJoh: Say you are selecting Pick-3 digits by position and you like three digits in the first position, two in the second and two in the third.  Your playing matrix would be 3x2x2 = 12 numbers. 

                A-B-C = ABC ABF AEC AEF
                D-E-F = DEF DEC DBC DBF 
                G      = GBC GBF GEC GEF

                If you like five digits in the first position, five in the second position and five in the third position the playing matrix would be 5x5x5 = 125 numbers.

                In a Pick-5 game the full matrix would be AAxBBxCCxEExFF.

                BobP
                 

                 

                 

                I didn't do that right for Pick-5. To determine the number of combinations necessary for a full wheel matrix you would treat the wheel as a mini-lotto game, determine the odds for that game to learn the number of combinations necessary.

                Say you want to know the number of combinations needed to make a Pick-5 full wheel matrix for 12 numbers.

                12x11x10x09x08 = 95,040

                The game is Pick-5 so 5x4x3x2x1 = 120

                Dividing 120 into 95,040 = 792 combinations or tickets needed to make a full wheel for 12 number.  BobP

                  BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
                  Dump Water Florida
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                  Posted: July 30, 2007, 4:47 am - IP Logged

                  "The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s)."

                  It probably shows that the top 5 digits in each position had about 60% of hits and shows the smaller percentage even/odd and low/high bias too. It might even show had you played the most frequent digits in all positions, you may have broke even but the majority of the hits were combinations of high and low frequency digits.

                  There might be a spot-play by playing the low/high - even/odd bias.

                   

                  9

                  21
                  659
                  166
                  584
                  072

                   

                  As an example, the first position has a high/odd bias, the second high/even, and the third low/even. The spot-play would be 562, 564, 582, 584, 962, 964, 982, and 984. You could check how many times that happened when all three digits hit in the high frequency range and playing for 8 bucks is easier on the wallet than playing for $125.

                  (edited to try to put the "9" back into the first column)

                  I found a sweet spot for the month of July in Florida using 22 past draws with a fair number of straight wins with 125 numbers using the top five digits in each position, but it has now been 8 days since the last hit on paper.  Have to do more research to see it this would have been profitable enough to carry over dry spells over a longer time period.  Funny how it could go from winning nothing with 50, 60, 100 past draws and start winning at 22, guess I was trying too hard.  btw: You don't have to work out the 125 numbers to chech for wins, you can just check the columns, if all three winning digits are in the top five by position the wheel will have a straight win.  BobP


                    RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                    mid-Ohio
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                    Posted: July 30, 2007, 6:10 am - IP Logged

                    I didn't do that right for Pick-5. To determine the number of combinations necessary for a full wheel matrix you would treat the wheel as a mini-lotto game, determine the odds for that game to learn the number of combinations necessary.

                    Say you want to know the number of combinations needed to make a Pick-5 full wheel matrix for 12 numbers.

                    12x11x10x09x08 = 95,040

                    The game is Pick-5 so 5x4x3x2x1 = 120

                    Dividing 120 into 95,040 = 792 combinations or tickets needed to make a full wheel for 12 number.  BobP

                    True but the odds of all 5 winning numbers being among those 12 numbers in a 5/39 games are  1:727.

                     * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                       
                                 Evil Looking       

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                      Constitutional Money Is Real Money
                      Brick City
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                      Posted: July 30, 2007, 9:09 am - IP Logged

                      I conducted a short test of Positional Frequency for Florida and got nothing.  I was wondering if anyone is using Positional Frequency for Pick-3 with any success anywhere and if so, where and how many past draws are you working with.

                      For those who don't know. Positional Frequency counts how often each digit has hit in each position over a range of draws. The digits that hit the most often in each position (or tied for most) is the first play(s).  For example, working with the top 5 digits in each position would result in 5x5x5 = 125 straight plays.

                      In Florida even risking 125 plays per draw nothing was happening. Of course system authors always claim it's working somewhere else.  Any ideas?  BobP

                      I use positional frequency, but I "weight" each position. Position 1 gets a weight of 5 points, position 2 gets a weight of 3 points and position 1 gets a weight of 1 point. I do this to give credit for digits that pop first or second since the odds are a little higher against them. I usually look back 14 days and I mix midday and evening draws together. Good luck!

                      Whatever you fear most has no power - it is your fear that has the power.
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                      Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
                      (attributed to) Albert Einstein

                      I have failed many times, and that's why I am a success.
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                      My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals
                      himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.

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                        Posted: July 30, 2007, 9:47 am - IP Logged

                        BobP

                        using only top 5 (sort order) would be useless because there are others 125 top 5 combinations

                        i mean if we use combin(10,5) we got 252 unique combination and there are 126 combination for "top 5"

                        so far the 3 number groups 4-3-3 with combination 2389 - 014 - 567

                        to play straight we have 6 positional  123, 132, 213, 231, 312, 321 unfortunately there are expectation limits in 1000 draws because of the groupped numbers

                         

                        220 boxed number for 3 number groups with combination 1: 2389 ~ 2: 014 ~ 3: 567
                        GroupExp.Tickethitskip6-Way
                        12321.6%36204205 206 207 215 216 217 245 246 247 305 306 307 315 316 317 345 346 347 805 806 807 815 816 817 845 846 847 905 906 907 915 916 917 945 946 947
                        11214.4%30145230 231 234 280 281 284 290 291 294 380 381 384 390 391 394 890 891 894  3way: 220 221 224 330 331 334 880 881 884 990 991 994
                        11314.4%301813235 236 237 285 286 287 295 296 297 385 386 387 395 396 397 895 896 897  3way: 225 226 227 335 336 337 885 886 887 995 996 997
                        12210.8%2470201 204 214 301 304 314 801 804 814 901 904 914  3way: 200 211 244 300 311 344 800 811 844 900 911 944
                        13310.8%24116256 257 267 356 357 367 856 857 867 956 957 967    3way: 255 266 277 355 366 377 855 866 877 955 966 977
                        2238.1%18111015 016 017 045 046 047 145 146 147  3way: 005 006 007 115 116 117 445 446 447
                        2338.1%18514056 057 067 156 157 167 456 457 467  3way: 055 066 077 155 166 177 455 466 477
                        1116.4%2093238 239 289 389  3way: 223 228 229 233 288 299 338 339 388 399 889 899 222 333 888 999
                        2222.7%10431014  3way: 001 004 011 044 114 144 000 111 444
                        3332.7%10139567  3way: 556 557 566 577 667 677 555 666 777

                         

                         

                        2389 - 014 - 567  Hit Summary with 10 interval

                        3 groups01020304050607080910total
                        123243212600020
                        112212111203114
                        113031323041118
                        12210110011117
                        133110122102111
                        223202020021211
                        23301101000025
                        11120001102219
                        22200010101014
                        33300010000001

                        from above stats it seem 113 good to play in next 10 draws

                        2389 - 2389 - 567

                        6way:
                        230 231 234 280 281 284 290 291 294
                        380 381 384 390 391 394 890 891 894 

                        3way:
                        220 221 224 330 331 334 880 881 884 990 991 994

                         

                        i've been tested 2389 - 014 - 567 combinations for all state in early years since carbob purchased the premium membership which is able to put 36 numbers

                        205 206 207 215 216 217 245 246 247
                        305 306 307 315 316 317 345 346 347
                        805 806 807 815 816 817 845 846 847
                        905 906 907 915 916 917 945 946 947

                        but only 20% we have break even point in Online prizes but for any state lottery i can guarantee we will "donate" our money to state lottery :-)

                        tweaking 6 positional combination still tricky. after all next draw remains unknown.

                        Et erunt signa in sole.......Et luna et stellis.......Et presura gentium
                        Prae confusione sonitus maris.


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                          Posted: July 30, 2007, 5:33 pm - IP Logged

                          Yes there is always at least one winning ball missing out of the columns of five.  The old theory about the numbers rising to the top like cream must have gone out when the state homogenized the drawings.  BobP



                          Many years ago when I was using the Scientific Number Selector, every Sunday I tracked positional frequency for the past 5 weeks (30 draws). And unless a digit hit two or more times the previous week, there was hardly any movement. If a digit in the bottom 5 hit twice the previous week it was still possible that it would remain in the bottom 5 the next week if its last hit was more than 5 weeks ago.

                          I never tracked how many times the top 5 digits created wins but the results were probably about the same as yours. I have chart that places the digits in the order they hit and the top 5 digits only hit together 21 times in 200 draws. This chart shows the digits dropping not rising and I haven't found any useful way to apply it. 

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                            Posted: July 30, 2007, 5:51 pm - IP Logged

                            I found a sweet spot for the month of July in Florida using 22 past draws with a fair number of straight wins with 125 numbers using the top five digits in each position, but it has now been 8 days since the last hit on paper.  Have to do more research to see it this would have been profitable enough to carry over dry spells over a longer time period.  Funny how it could go from winning nothing with 50, 60, 100 past draws and start winning at 22, guess I was trying too hard.  btw: You don't have to work out the 125 numbers to chech for wins, you can just check the columns, if all three winning digits are in the top five by position the wheel will have a straight win.  BobP


                            A smaller range of draws probably is better because the top 5 will change faster. Even with a 30 draw range, the top 5 might remain the same for two or three straight weeks.

                            How many draws did you use the past 22 draws?

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                              Dump Water Florida
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                              Posted: July 30, 2007, 10:35 pm - IP Logged

                              A smaller range of draws probably is better because the top 5 will change faster. Even with a 30 draw range, the top 5 might remain the same for two or three straight weeks.

                              How many draws did you use the past 22 draws?

                              Draws in July. Drop a draw add a draw to the 22 for each draw's positional workout.  I need to test this deeper.  BobP