Honduras Member #20982 August 29, 2005 4715 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 12:20 am - IP Logged

If you all didn't know who Alexis Lemaire is, he is the French guy that broke the world record by correctly calculating the 13th square root of a 200 DIGIT NUMBER all in his mind without paper and pencil or a calculator...Now if you are aware of it, 1 Trillion has like 14 zeros while the number they assigned to him has 200 digits or should we say 200 zeros...

Now is my hopothesis that with a mind like that you could use it to decipher the state and how many cycles (so i read) the seed of a RNG goes through...

Also is my hopethesis that with a mind like that you could try to decipher any encryption..I've read on the internet that encryption utilizes RNG technology and if you seen the movie "Swordfish" like me you may believe it does...So hypothetically you could be the most dangerous hacker by brute force (that's if you knew lots of words or the dictionary)...And not to mention the damage you could do on a casino.....

LIke how i said before, Encryption nor RNG seeds calculation don't even cruise around the 200 digit calculation altitude...

If you think it was a small feat what he did you should know that the correct answer is among 393 million possible answers...

so my question to you is...If you had the mind of Alexis Lemaire will you use to to:

A. Crack the lotteries RNGs (like TN and Arizona ones) with your mental calculations and try to deduce the state of the seed...

B. Try and become the most dangerous hacker in human history...

C. Sort of speak, Clean out the Casinos....

D. Continue to do exhibition work, displaying your mental powers...

MD United States Member #1701 June 18, 2003 8362 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 1:14 am - IP Logged

I would say to you that even if you had access to the rng that the lottery uses that you couldn't crack any code. If rng's are supposedly random which we are led to believe... then how could Alex or anyone else computer or not predict the outcome of a drawing which is supposedly a random event.

Lotteries that use rng use different computers for every draw meaning that they draw a number for which computer will be used for that particular draw. How could Alex or any supercomputer know this information. Even if you did then you would have to run two separate scenarios.

With millions of possible combinations asking a computer or person to figure this out is beyond the scope of reality. How many lottery winners have announced that they derived the winning combination by using a computer to figure out the outcome. How many people have won saying they had a system other than picking birthday numbers ages and the numbers like phone, births, tag numbers and so on. Versus all the people who won with quick picks.

While i applaud you for coming up with all these different ideas. The fact is if you just took a look at the numbers and created a picture of what you intend to do to try and win yourself and apply yourself then you just might possibly come up with a winning combination.

Honduras Member #20982 August 29, 2005 4715 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 2:00 am - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by four4me on December 18, 2007

I would say to you that even if you had access to the rng that the lottery uses that you couldn't crack any code. If rng's are supposedly random which we are led to believe... then how could Alex or anyone else computer or not predict the outcome of a drawing which is supposedly a random event.

Lotteries that use rng use different computers for every draw meaning that they draw a number for which computer will be used for that particular draw. How could Alex or any supercomputer know this information. Even if you did then you would have to run two separate scenarios.

With millions of possible combinations asking a computer or person to figure this out is beyond the scope of reality. How many lottery winners have announced that they derived the winning combination by using a computer to figure out the outcome. How many people have won saying they had a system other than picking birthday numbers ages and the numbers like phone, births, tag numbers and so on. Versus all the people who won with quick picks.

While i applaud you for coming up with all these different ideas. The fact is if you just took a look at the numbers and created a picture of what you intend to do to try and win yourself and apply yourself then you just might possibly come up with a winning combination.

They can use all the computer they like the question is do they use the same RNG...

A RNG in its core uses sort of speak like a very complex mathematical expression (not just one several) to help it decide which number to choose (So far that's what've read about RNGs) and it goes through a series of cycles before it does it...Now i am not a RNGologist..Again i could be wrong...

And i know this because every device conceived by man who wants to generate random numbers or a number sequence has to have sort of speak a mathematical expression code, like a formula in it....

Honduras Member #20982 August 29, 2005 4715 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 3:18 am - IP Logged

And even if they use different computers let's assume they use 5 different computers, he could calculate the possible events for all of them for remember the result should be 1 combination and 1 combination only, not a couple of them...And each time the calculation will get bigger but it will be in the increments of less than 100,000 because they use different computers (even if they use different RNGs) and remember you have a limit of a number with 200 zeros so you have like 30 years to run out of calculations...And once you nailed it ONCE, you can start deducing for future draws having as a variable the time...Even with the time variable calculation that adds up another 100K calculations, so he would have enough time...Actually 100K is an exaggeration is more like 30K...What is favorable in his side is that all that calculation should yield 1 combination and 1 combination only...

"More important than winning all of the states' lotteries is the movie "Red Planet"...."

MD United States Member #1701 June 18, 2003 8362 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 11:45 am - IP Logged

Alex is just one of a hand full of people on the planet with this skill. Stands to reason if it could be applied to the lottery one or more of them would have accomplished this. I say it's not possible to predict with certainty any outcome of a jackpot lottery using applied mathematics. Just because lottery's uses numbers doesn't mean there are mathematical calculations that could or would predict the outcome of a random event. Unless one played all the combinations or have one dynamite wheel.

The problem with this idea is the mega ball, powerball or extra ball. Which is needed to win the jackpot. Any mathematical calculations would have to include the extra ball and a calculation doesn't exist that would know or pre determine which extra ball will be drawn.

There are software programs on the market that are good enough for a learned player to toy with and given the dollar amount of a wheel that is cost effective one might possibly input the right numbers and come up with a winning combination for 5 balls. And luck would have to play a factor in the extra ball.

On lottery post we have been predicting numbers for many pick 5 and 6 games years have passed and thousands of combinations have been played. As of this day there are no jackpot winners for mega millions and powerball on lottery posts prediction board. And the few people whom have won on the prediction board for other pick 5 games have done so by using dollar bills (geos*5666! ) for their number selections, and tntea whom by all accounts never said how she came up with the numbers for her jackpot win.

Lets put this another way if there were a cost effective mathematical way to produce the winning numbers by now don't you think it would have been done already.

mid-Ohio United States Member #9 March 24, 2001 19830 Posts Online

Posted: December 18, 2007, 12:26 pm - IP Logged

"Lets put this another way if there were a cost effective mathematical way to produce the winning numbers by now don't you think it would have been done already." by four4me

What amount would you consider a cost effective mathematical way to pick the winning numbers of a lottery? $100, $1,000, $10,000 or more? That syndicate that won the Virgina lottery a few years back was willing to spend millions of dollars buying all the possible combinations when the jackpot was large enough.

Today, I doubt if a single group or individual could buy that many tickets.

* you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket *

MD United States Member #1701 June 18, 2003 8362 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 12:53 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by RJOh on December 18, 2007

"Lets put this another way if there were a cost effective mathematical way to produce the winning numbers by now don't you think it would have been done already." by four4me

What amount would you consider a cost effective mathematical way to pick the winning numbers of a lottery? $100, $1,000, $10,000 or more? That syndicate that won the Virgina lottery a few years back was willing to spend millions of dollars buying all the possible combinations when the jackpot was large enough.

Today, I doubt if a single group or individual could buy that many tickets.

providing and that's a big if. You had a decent 150.00 wheel you might get lucky and get all 5 white balls.

When i wrote that sentence. It's intended purpose is for the average lottery player who uses wheels or programs to produce their picks. Using a minimal out of pocket dollar amount. Not a group or syndicate who have unlimited funds.

Pumpi seems to think that some mathematical permutation can achieve some success in predicting numbers for jackpot games. I still insist there are no mathematical formulas that can be applied to formulate the winning jackpot numbers. Outside of playing all the combinations.

If there were such a formula for applying math to produce the winning combination for jackpot game someone would have done it by now.

BigJohn says. You don't hit the number. The number hits you!!!!

I'm not Big John, I'm Four4me, Big John's a friend.

NY United States Member #23835 October 16, 2005 3474 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 3:25 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by Todd on December 18, 2007

<Moved to Mathematics forum>

Please post in the appropriate forum ... thank you.

I appreciate your efforts to keep the forums organized and running smoothly, but math is only incidental to this thread. There's really not much that makes it any different than any other discussion of RNG's, or ideas for "cracking" the lottery.

In fact, I'd say it's really not about math at all. That some people have amazing abilities to solve complex math problems doesn't necessarily mean they're actually doing the math in any traditional sense. Most of us have a decent ability to watch a ball and figure out where to be to catch it, return it with a baseball bat, or whatever.The math to determine the trajectory is complex, but we figure out where the ball will be through experience and intuition. For savants, solving complex math problems is an intuitive process. Simply being a "human calculator" wouldn't give him any advantage over anyone with an electronic calculator in figuring out any secrets to the lottery. Computers and calculators are great at fast and accurate calculating, but the inability to think is a major obstacle for more complex issues. A natural ability to intuitively recognize extremely complex patterns, OTOH, would be extremely useful if there was a pattern to be found. Combine (artificial) intelligence with the ability to do complex calculations and you canl go far beyond solving mere math problems.

mid-Ohio United States Member #9 March 24, 2001 19830 Posts Online

Posted: December 18, 2007, 3:56 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by four4me on December 18, 2007

providing and that's a big if. You had a decent 150.00 wheel you might get lucky and get all 5 white balls.

When i wrote that sentence. It's intended purpose is for the average lottery player who uses wheels or programs to produce their picks. Using a minimal out of pocket dollar amount. Not a group or syndicate who have unlimited funds.

Pumpi seems to think that some mathematical permutation can achieve some success in predicting numbers for jackpot games. I still insist there are no mathematical formulas that can be applied to formulate the winning jackpot numbers. Outside of playing all the combinations.

If there were such a formula for applying math to produce the winning combination for jackpot game someone would have done it by now.

The reason I asked the questions was there was a story on sixty minutes a few years ago about a small town in Texas that played a lottery as a group, got lucky and won. The jackpot was big enough that everyone who participated got a least a million dollars. A woman who clerked in the local gas station that sold lottery tickets came up with a plan and talked most of the local people into pooling their money for a one shot deal and most went along with her.

I was thinking more along the line of a pool of players who might buy more than 20 tickets on their own rather than a syndicate. For a group of such players spending a $1,000 or more as a group might be considered cost effective.

* you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket *

MD United States Member #1701 June 18, 2003 8362 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 7:12 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by RJOh on December 18, 2007

The reason I asked the questions was there was a story on sixty minutes a few years ago about a small town in Texas that played a lottery as a group, got lucky and won. The jackpot was big enough that everyone who participated got a least a million dollars. A woman who clerked in the local gas station that sold lottery tickets came up with a plan and talked most of the local people into pooling their money for a one shot deal and most went along with her.

I was thinking more along the line of a pool of players who might buy more than 20 tickets on their own rather than a syndicate. For a group of such players spending a $1,000 or more as a group might be considered cost effective.

Yes that is a sound idea. I have often tried to do that when we get jackpots around 300 million (been a long time) 10 people put up 20 bucks each and we create a balanced wheel with everybody's selections. The most people i could get was 5 people.

Many people don't even know what a wheel is.

Lots of people were interested in playing quick picks which i consider a waste of money since as a group of 10 people we hardly won anything in all the times we played quick picks. This was mainly due to the fact that the computer spit out quick picks with many tickets containing the same like numbers.

MD United States Member #1701 June 18, 2003 8362 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 7:16 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by pumpi76 on December 18, 2007

when i wrote what i wrote i was thinking in cracking pick3 or pick4, not pick5 or powerball...

There are lots of pick 3 and 4 systems to produce numbers but as it has been said many times what works for one drawing might not work for the next drawing. Nobody on record has developed a system for accurately predicting the pick 3 and 4 games on a daily basis. Be it ball drawings or rng.

BigJohn says. You don't hit the number. The number hits you!!!!

I'm not Big John, I'm Four4me, Big John's a friend.

Wandering Aimlessly United States Member #25360 November 5, 2005 4461 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 7:17 pm - IP Logged

In answer to the thread's subject

Pumpi, I already am a human calculator. I have 10 fingers and 10 toes, so that means I'm a digital calculator, although I don't have a period any more.

Wandering Aimlessly United States Member #25360 November 5, 2005 4461 Posts Offline

Posted: December 18, 2007, 7:39 pm - IP Logged

Quote: Originally posted by justxploring on December 18, 2007

In answer to the thread's subject

Pumpi, I already am a human calculator. I have 10 fingers and 10 toes, so that means I'm a digital calculator, although I don't have a period any more.

Too much information??

On another note: I doubt if most people who win the lottery can even balance a checkbook. When I lived up north I worked with a woman who hit a small jackpot. One day I told her that I went to the market and asked for a quarter of a pound of fish (or turkey or whatever) and got .37 and, although I'm not fussy about getting a little more, this was expensive and about 45% over what I asked for. She said to me "but Nancy, you got less than you asked for. You asked for 1/4 pound right?" I said "yes, that's right." She answered "well then .37 is less, since that would be .4" True story.