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POLL: "All or Nothing" game

Topic closed. 23 replies. Last post 8 years ago by RJOh.

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Would you play this game?

Yeah, sure [ 13 ]  [41.94%]
Not sure [ 6 ]  [19.35%]
No [ 12 ]  [38.71%]
Other [ 0 ]  [0.00%]
Total Valid Votes [ 31 ]  
Discarded Votes [ 2 ]  
Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
Zeta Reticuli Star System
United States
Member #30470
January 17, 2006
10351 Posts
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Posted: August 26, 2008, 3:07 am - IP Logged

Would you play an "all or nothing" game?

It would be a Pick 5 or a Pick 6, hitting all the numbers would be a regular jackpot, hitting no numbers would be a small prize, but nothing else counts. i.e., hitting a, 2, 3, or 4 of 5, or 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 of 6 doesn't pay.

Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

Lep

There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

    DoctorEw220's avatar - alien helmet.jpg
    Yinzer Country, PA
    United States
    Member #4067
    March 18, 2004
    2741 Posts
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    Posted: August 26, 2008, 3:15 am - IP Logged

    That looks like a pretty good idea actually.

    I've redone my website.  Go to www.dr-ew.com.  I kept a lot of the old stuff, and I've added some new stuff.  Look for more new stuff in the coming weeks.

      savagegoose's avatar - ProfilePho
      adelaide sa
      Australia
      Member #37136
      April 11, 2006
      3300 Posts
      Offline
      Posted: August 26, 2008, 4:44 am - IP Logged

      yeah as long as the payout was nicely incresed,

      2014 = -1016; 2015= -1409; 2016 JAN = -106; FEB= -81; MAR= -131; APR= - 87: MAY= -91; JUN= -39; JUL=-134; AUG= -124; SEP = -123; OCT= -84  NOV=- 73 TOT= -3498

      keno historic = -2291 ; 2015= -603; 2016= JAN=-32, FEB= +12 , MAR= -86, APR = -77. MAY= -48, JUN= -29, JUL=-71; AUG = -52; SEPT= -43; OCT = +56 NOV = -33 TOT= -3297


        United States
        Member #17555
        June 22, 2005
        5582 Posts
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        Posted: August 26, 2008, 11:14 am - IP Logged

        yeah as long as the payout was nicely incresed,

        NO, it's the lower tier prizes that keep me hanging on. I wouldn't have won $720.00 a couple of weeks ago in the Fntasy Five, if that were the case.

        In some cases with some people, the lower prizes pay for the next round of purchases, so the lottery is essentially helping with the expenses until they hit the big one.

          savagegoose's avatar - ProfilePho
          adelaide sa
          Australia
          Member #37136
          April 11, 2006
          3300 Posts
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          Posted: August 26, 2008, 11:33 am - IP Logged

          our local casino had its own keno game. it had 2 odds tables and you could chose which one to play at the time of purchase. i think this woud be an ideal solution to this, for poeple who want the large  payout for taking only the highest odds, and for people who want the smaller but more regular payouts.

           

          maybe there could be a choice, go all or nothing or play regular. decide at time of purchase.

          2014 = -1016; 2015= -1409; 2016 JAN = -106; FEB= -81; MAR= -131; APR= - 87: MAY= -91; JUN= -39; JUL=-134; AUG= -124; SEP = -123; OCT= -84  NOV=- 73 TOT= -3498

          keno historic = -2291 ; 2015= -603; 2016= JAN=-32, FEB= +12 , MAR= -86, APR = -77. MAY= -48, JUN= -29, JUL=-71; AUG = -52; SEPT= -43; OCT = +56 NOV = -33 TOT= -3297

            justxploring's avatar - villiarna
            Wandering Aimlessly
            United States
            Member #25360
            November 5, 2005
            4461 Posts
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            Posted: August 26, 2008, 1:35 pm - IP Logged

            I agree with Pac on this one.  I never won as much as $720 (that was a rolldown) but I've won over $100 a few times this year playing Florida's Fantasy5.   I've also gotten 4 of 6 playing Lotto which was $78.   Even the Free Plays are nice to get (2 of 5) and I won a few of those last week.

              ThatScaryChick's avatar - x1MqPuM
              Idaho
              United States
              Member #56506
              November 21, 2007
              6537 Posts
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              Posted: August 26, 2008, 1:40 pm - IP Logged

              I also agree with Pac. I wouldn't want to play a game where the chance to win at least a little something was taken away. I know that you said that you might get something for getting no numbers, but it doesn't sound like a game I would like to play. At least with real money. Wink

              "No one remembers the person who almost climbed the mountain, only the person who eventually gets to the top."

                RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                mid-Ohio
                United States
                Member #9
                March 24, 2001
                19828 Posts
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                Posted: August 26, 2008, 1:57 pm - IP Logged

                In a 5/39 game 52% of the possible combinations will have at less one of the winning numbers. When a 5/39 game pays for a match2 or better they only have to payout on 12% of the tickets, why would they want to change it to 48%?  If they paid $1 to everyone who matched nothing and kept half of the sales for their profit, that would only leave a few dollars for the jackpot. 

                Who's going play a game that pays nothing for matching any of the winning numbers if you don't match then all and only a few dollars if you do?

                The concept sounds like the dream of someone who has never come close to even winning a minimum prize.Unhappy

                 * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                   
                             Evil Looking       

                  Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
                  Zeta Reticuli Star System
                  United States
                  Member #30470
                  January 17, 2006
                  10351 Posts
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                  Posted: August 26, 2008, 2:16 pm - IP Logged

                  It's the same principle as people being drawn to lo-ball poker - "I never get good cards, I'll play!" (but then they go into a pot with a pair of Kings or such).

                  Using the Illinois Pick 5 game (Little Lotto, 5/39) 0 hits pays nothing, 2 hits pays $1, 3 hits $20, and 4 hits $100, 5 for 5 is a progressive jackpot starting at $100,000.

                  The game had been a 5/30 game with a set top prize and para-mutuel payouts for 3 and 4 numbers. But people hitting 2 numbers wanted to get paid something for it. So whoop-tee-do, now 2 gets $1 and the game went from 30 numbers to 39.

                  I just figured as many times as people play and don't hit anything, getting paid not to hit anythuing would be a little bit of an incentive.

                  The money not being paid out to people hittiing 2, 3, or 4 numbers would be put back into the game, maybe 80% into the jacpot and 20% to the 0-for-5's.

                  Just a thought.

                  One Keno lounge in Vegas used to have red-game / green game....if you wanted your numbers to go for both drawings, it was an extra dollar or whatever you had played your ticket for. And people played it.

                  So why not offer the drawings for these games as the regular game, and all-or-nothing, player's choice? No one is pointing a gun at anybody and forcing them to play it.

                  But there would be plenty of times that people would say, "Didn't hit a number at all, should have played the all-or-nothing game."

                  Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

                  Lep

                  There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

                    justxploring's avatar - villiarna
                    Wandering Aimlessly
                    United States
                    Member #25360
                    November 5, 2005
                    4461 Posts
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                    Posted: August 26, 2008, 2:32 pm - IP Logged

                    "....hitting no numbers would be a small prize...."

                     

                    Okay - I just read this again.  Answer is "maybe."  There are many times I get no numbers at all.   How small? 

                      RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                      mid-Ohio
                      United States
                      Member #9
                      March 24, 2001
                      19828 Posts
                      Offline
                      Posted: August 26, 2008, 3:47 pm - IP Logged

                      Using the Illinois Pick 5 game (Little Lotto, 5/39) 0 hits pays nothing, 2 hits pays $1, 3 hits $20, and 4 hits $100, 5 for 5 is a progressive jackpot starting at $100,000.

                      In Ohio Cash5(5/9), 2 hits pays $1, 3 hits pays $10, 4 hits pays $300 and hitting 5 of 5 pays a progressive jackpot that starts at $100,000, so the two games are very similar. 

                      I assume any game worth playing will cost $1 per play and any payout worth paying would be at lease $1.  Since states have lotteries to raise funds for themselves and generally keep half of the sales for themselves, they wouldn't collect enough money to run the kind of lottery you suggest and still kept half the sales for themselves.

                       MATCH    ODDS                        NUMBER OF COMBOS
                        5/5     1 : 575757                  1
                        4/5     1 : 3387                    170
                        3/5     1 : 103                     5610
                        2/5     1 : 10                      59840
                        1/5     1 : 2                       231880
                        0/5     1 : 2                       278256

                       * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                         
                                   Evil Looking       

                        Avatar
                        Kentucky
                        United States
                        Member #32652
                        February 14, 2006
                        7313 Posts
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                        Posted: August 26, 2008, 3:52 pm - IP Logged

                        In a 5/39 game 52% of the possible combinations will have at less one of the winning numbers. When a 5/39 game pays for a match2 or better they only have to payout on 12% of the tickets, why would they want to change it to 48%?  If they paid $1 to everyone who matched nothing and kept half of the sales for their profit, that would only leave a few dollars for the jackpot. 

                        Who's going play a game that pays nothing for matching any of the winning numbers if you don't match then all and only a few dollars if you do?

                        The concept sounds like the dream of someone who has never come close to even winning a minimum prize.Unhappy

                        The Ohio Lottery will be running a promotion on the Ten-Oh game in September and matching zero numbers will pay $5 and the payoff for matching 10 numbers has been raised to $750,000 every Tuesday and Friday. I believe there has only been 3 tickets matching 10 numbers in the 773 drawings and it looks like matching 9 out of 10 only happens about once a week.

                        MATCH

                        WIN

                        INCREASE AMT.

                        NEW PRIZE VALUE

                        10/10

                        $500,000

                        $250,000

                        $750,000

                        9/10

                        $6,000

                        $3,000

                        $9,000

                        8/10

                        $400

                        $199

                        $599

                        7/10

                        $40

                        $20

                        $60

                        6/10

                        $5

                        $3

                        $8

                        5/10

                        $2

                        $1

                        $3

                        0/10

                        $3

                        $2

                        $5

                        Sort of strange promotion for increasing play especially since it will on the same days as Mega Millions drawings, but for players that never pick any numbers, this is their chance to win something for matching nothing.

                          RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                          mid-Ohio
                          United States
                          Member #9
                          March 24, 2001
                          19828 Posts
                          Offline
                          Posted: August 26, 2008, 4:32 pm - IP Logged

                          The Ohio Lottery will be running a promotion on the Ten-Oh game in September and matching zero numbers will pay $5 and the payoff for matching 10 numbers has been raised to $750,000 every Tuesday and Friday. I believe there has only been 3 tickets matching 10 numbers in the 773 drawings and it looks like matching 9 out of 10 only happens about once a week.

                          MATCH

                          WIN

                          INCREASE AMT.

                          NEW PRIZE VALUE

                          10/10

                          $500,000

                          $250,000

                          $750,000

                          9/10

                          $6,000

                          $3,000

                          $9,000

                          8/10

                          $400

                          $199

                          $599

                          7/10

                          $40

                          $20

                          $60

                          6/10

                          $5

                          $3

                          $8

                          5/10

                          $2

                          $1

                          $3

                          0/10

                          $3

                          $2

                          $5

                          Sort of strange promotion for increasing play especially since it will on the same days as Mega Millions drawings, but for players that never pick any numbers, this is their chance to win something for matching nothing.

                          $5 for matching nothing and odds of 1:22 of doing it is probably as good as it's going to get.  The odds of matching 1-4 are 1:3 to 1:7, so one of those are more likely to happen.

                            MATCH  COMBOS OF 10/20of80 = 1646492110120      ODDS
                            10     184756                                  1 : 8911711
                             9     10077600                                1 : 163381
                             8     222966900                               1 : 7384
                             7     2652734400                              1 : 621
                             6     18900732600                             1 : 87
                             5     84675282048                             1 : 19
                             0     75394027566                             1 : 22

                             4     242559401700                            1 : 7
                             3     440275888800                            1 : 4
                             2     486137960550                            1 : 3
                             1     295662853200                            1 : 6

                           * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                             
                                       Evil Looking       

                            Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
                            Zeta Reticuli Star System
                            United States
                            Member #30470
                            January 17, 2006
                            10351 Posts
                            Offline
                            Posted: August 26, 2008, 6:19 pm - IP Logged

                            My faux pas (typo) on the Illinois 3 for 5, it's $10, not $20.

                            RJOh, thanks for finding the odds againt not hitting anything.

                            Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

                            Lep

                            There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

                              RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                              mid-Ohio
                              United States
                              Member #9
                              March 24, 2001
                              19828 Posts
                              Offline
                              Posted: August 27, 2008, 1:58 am - IP Logged

                              The Ohio Lottery will be running a promotion on the Ten-Oh game in September and matching zero numbers will pay $5 and the payoff for matching 10 numbers has been raised to $750,000 every Tuesday and Friday. I believe there has only been 3 tickets matching 10 numbers in the 773 drawings and it looks like matching 9 out of 10 only happens about once a week.

                              MATCH

                              WIN

                              INCREASE AMT.

                              NEW PRIZE VALUE

                              10/10

                              $500,000

                              $250,000

                              $750,000

                              9/10

                              $6,000

                              $3,000

                              $9,000

                              8/10

                              $400

                              $199

                              $599

                              7/10

                              $40

                              $20

                              $60

                              6/10

                              $5

                              $3

                              $8

                              5/10

                              $2

                              $1

                              $3

                              0/10

                              $3

                              $2

                              $5

                              Sort of strange promotion for increasing play especially since it will on the same days as Mega Millions drawings, but for players that never pick any numbers, this is their chance to win something for matching nothing.

                              When I added up the winning combos and divided them by the possible combos I got:

                              181,856,005,870/1,646,492,110,120 = odds of 1:9 of winning a prize of $5 or more on a $1 bet, so I may try playing 10 lines during the promotional period and see what happens.  That's better than playing Cash5 with  overall odds of 1:8.7 of winning $1 or better on a $1 bet.   I hope my calculations are right.

                               * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                                 
                                           Evil Looking