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Are Lotteries Rigged

Topic closed. 169 replies. Last post 12 years ago by CASH Only.

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Do you honestly believe Lotteries are Rigged

Absolutely [ 34 ]  [19.21%]
Yes [ 27 ]  [15.25%]
Maybe [ 40 ]  [22.60%]
no [ 38 ]  [21.47%]
Absolutely not, otherwise I wouldn't play [ 31 ]  [17.51%]
Who cares I play for fun [ 7 ]  [3.95%]
Total Valid Votes [ 177 ]  
Discarded Votes [ 26 ]  

United States
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June 5, 2002
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Posted: December 27, 2003, 10:41 am - IP Logged

I still think the biggest lottery "riggers" are when players are forced to receive annuity payments in lieu of a lump sum.


    United States
    Member #3004
    December 11, 2003
    248 Posts
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    Posted: December 27, 2003, 10:51 pm - IP Logged

    as for the person on an earlier page of this thread mentioned/that they would have to identify exconvicts in order to manipulate the drawing away from them winning it, is idiotic in two ways. they dont have to manipulate the winning away from anyone, if they are simply "not letting anyone" win it.!

    the people who claim to have won milions of dollars . are "front people" usually 35-60 years of age who have signed a statement swearing to not reveal the truth. in texas the first people to win the lotto were employees of ibm??????????????and almost all others are big chain managers or small business owners. the c-store i worked at had its patrons of small business owners and such. i thought it was strange that those were the only people that showed up with large amount winning tickets. i worked there more than 5 years so this was more than enough time for me to come to a conclusion that / it had to be rigged and a few handshakes beneath the table. after all, where does the largest portion of the proceeds go to? law enforcement? so, do you believe for one minute that law enforcement is going to allow an investigation into this? you are retarded if you believe this. like it would have been retarded for me as an employee to tell the customers that the "good" stacks of tickets went out the side door. i would no longer have a job, would i? thank you!!!!!


      United States
      Member #3004
      December 11, 2003
      248 Posts
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      Posted: December 27, 2003, 11:34 pm - IP Logged

      "online" means exactly whats it says............online. if it wasnt online, more people would win cause the machine wouldnt know who bought what numbers where...would it? think about it. it would only know what numbers were sold at its own store.

      when you link all the lotto machines together, your in a fight you cant win. all the machines know the same thing at the same time.

      and as far as a software program goes. .............why do the state lotto people "need" a software???????????????????? they should only keep track of how much money each store owes them for tickets purchased, right? simply calculators do this job. so why the software????????? think again my friendsz

        visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
        light on my feet
        United States
        Member #356
        May 20, 2002
        2744 Posts
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        Posted: December 28, 2003, 5:51 pm - IP Logged
        Quote: Originally posted by interceptor on December 28, 2003



        the c-store i worked at had its patrons of small business owners and such. i thought it was strange that those were the only people that showed up with large amount winning tickets.







        wait a new york minute.

        i thought that you said in another post that the asst. store managers that worked at your store were the ones cashing in?

        here in this statement you contradict yourself.

        your conspiracy stories are felonius and are designed at stirring up trouble and doubt at LP.

        seems like i am the only one that is saying something about it.

        anybody else out there on to this guy?

        vision

         

         

                    "i am .........."meant to"       

        P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                 until further notice,  it's  france everyday


          United States
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          December 11, 2003
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          Posted: December 28, 2003, 6:10 pm - IP Logged

          the owners fixed it and their

            emilyg's avatar - cat anm.gif

            United States
            Member #14
            November 9, 2001
            31342 Posts
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            Posted: December 28, 2003, 6:23 pm - IP Logged
            Quote: Originally posted by visiondude on December 28, 2003

            Quote: Originally posted by interceptor on December 28, 2003

            the c-store i worked at had its patrons of small business owners and such. i thought it was strange that those were the only people that showed up with large amount winning tickets.




            wait a new york minute.

            i thought that you said in another post that the asst. store managers that worked at your store were the ones cashing in?

            here in this statement you contradict yourself.

            your conspiracy stories are felonius and are designed at stirring up trouble and doubt at LP.

            seems like i am the only one that is saying something about it.

            anybody else out there on to this guy?

            <FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=red size=6>vision

             

             






            vision dude - i agree with you. makes me wonder what he's doing here anyway. if he thinks lottery is rigged - why is he on a lottery site.

            love to nibble those micey feet.

             

                                         

              visiondude's avatar - eye3logo
              light on my feet
              United States
              Member #356
              May 20, 2002
              2744 Posts
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              Posted: December 28, 2003, 6:54 pm - IP Logged

               he is blowing smoke either for attention or some other alterior motive.  if you ask me, he is akin to a troll looking to cause trouble and confusion, only he is coming in the side door.  his hypothesis are over some peoples heads and that is how he is able to pass some of it off.  but he can't keep his "stories" straight.

               he might be working up to something or he is playing intellectual/emotional ping-pong.

               it's all very simple emily.  if this guy really observed this activity, don't you think for a new york minute that he wouldn't have become a whistleblower so that these people would have been prosecuted?  not only tattling on those people,  but the lottery commission as well? usually you will find the truth in the smallest of details.  *plus the guy still plays the lottery while claiming it's fixed.*

               the guy goes on the fruitloop radar and the boloney meter all in one day.

               interceptor....as you can see.......my "VISION" is just fine (and as it were, i also have a "voice" that works in concert with my "VISION")

               do try the www.jfk-2ndgumenonthegrassyknolllotteryforums.com  you will be much better off in there if you are trolling for gulliable fish.

               20/20

               

               

                          "i am .........."meant to"       

              P.S.,  that RJoH  is a stand up guy.  thanks,  vision

                       until further notice,  it's  france everyday


                United States
                Member #3004
                December 11, 2003
                248 Posts
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                Posted: December 28, 2003, 9:45 pm - IP Logged

                your right mr vision dude

                  konane's avatar - wallace
                  Atlanta, GA
                  United States
                  Member #1265
                  March 13, 2003
                  3333 Posts
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                  Posted: December 28, 2003, 9:54 pm - IP Logged

                  Jim695 "  I'm no genius, but I know that if something is computerized, it uses a PROM chip or an EPROM chip, which means that it can be programmed. Consider this: If the Hoosier Lottery has their little "computerized electronic random number generator" tied into their "central computer," which tracks players' selections and wager amounts, they can easily minimize payouts on their daily games and, at the same time, build their Lotto jackpot at will (bigger jackpots = more ticket sales), and who would know?"

                  Thank you for confirming my suspicions about computerized drawings!  Have had that feeling a very long time and will not play those games.

                  However, old copies of "Lotto World" magazine had articles about how lotteries rotated ballsets, how the ballsets were selected prior to draws, that most lotteries have pre-test and post-draw tests to continually keep tabs on randomness of ballsets being used.  Therefore I have always felt that ball drawings are very random regardless of the machine they are using, and the only way the drawings could be manipulated to any real degree is by putting an exorbitant number of ballsets into play per game. 

                  I kept track of ballsets being used in GA, and know for a fact that Rebecca ratcheted up the number of ballsets which were in play for a given game way above average even for a multi-state game like PowerBall at the time I was keeping track of things.

                  Pre and post draw tests are generally available to the public at most lotteries.  Texas used to send the information out upon request.  However, the GA lottery came into existence after TX and it did not, nor did it post that information online which I always considered to be not in keeping with full disclosure.  However GA always said the information was available if one chose to go to their main office to get it.   

                  Good luck to everyone!

                    konane's avatar - wallace
                    Atlanta, GA
                    United States
                    Member #1265
                    March 13, 2003
                    3333 Posts
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                    Posted: December 28, 2003, 10:05 pm - IP Logged
                    Quote: Originally posted by CASH Only on December 27, 2003


                    I still think the biggest lottery "riggers" are when players are forced to receive annuity payments in lieu of a lump sum.



                    Yep, yep, agree with you totally on that.  What are the annuity holders going to do in 20 years or so when the company writing the annuity is out of business and the paper is worth nothing??  Better yet, the winner dies an untimely death, heirs have to pay inheritance tax based upon remaining years of the annutiy which may or may not materialize in the future.

                    Cash the only way for me! 

                    Good luck to everyone!

                      four4me's avatar - gate1
                      MD
                      United States
                      Member #1701
                      June 18, 2003
                      8360 Posts
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                      Posted: December 29, 2003, 1:43 am - IP Logged

                      It is very possible that electronic games are fixed not rigged in that they pay out a percentage of what they take in. say as with keno. I have seen repeating sets within so many minutes go away as soon as they were bet/played. I have watched the keno screens for days on end looking for random sets of numbers to appear. When the owner of the establishment says to me that the lottery is going down tonight for service. About two days later I notice the numbers have a different look to them the pattern that was in place is now changed somewhat. I was told some time later by an employee of the lottery firm that the chipsets were changed on a regular basis to keep people from developing a system to win repeatedly based on the chipset they had in place. And I noticed that keno pays out more when it's raining or when establishment are crowded and many people are playing at the same time. Which led me to believe that the keno games are fixed? Paying out a percentage of what they take in during any given draw or over a period of time.


                        China
                        Member #3032
                        December 16, 2003
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                        Posted: December 29, 2003, 4:23 am - IP Logged

                        keno are drawn by the computer.So its pure gambling play.Money wont be placed at the right places.never!

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                          Columbia City, Indiana
                          United States
                          Member #2978
                          December 9, 2003
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                          Posted: December 29, 2003, 8:47 am - IP Logged

                          To Konane:

                          Thanks for your support.

                          I've long considered your point concerning multiple ballsets. Illinois uses twenty ballsets and twelve machines for their daily games. The ballset and machines are chosen at random before each drawing, and these machines are then tested several times before the drawing takes place. Michigan has a similar policy. Initially, it seems that you actually have to choose your numbers from a pool of 200 (twenty ballsets x ten balls each), but this really isn't the case. The only reason these states (among others) do this is to guarantee a high degree of randomness. Ping-pong balls used in lottery drawings are manufactured to very close weight tolerances, usually micro grams. This is done to overcome bias which, in lottery games, is a measured difference in the behavior of each ball as it enters or exits the airstream in the hopper. However, since lottery balls are painted by machines, differences in the amount of paint applied to any ball, the thickness of that paint or even the shape of the number can influence the bias on that ball. These amounts are small but, as you know, any identifiable differences can be exploited to the player's advantage. The lotteries don't want us doing that, so they use multiple ballsets to try to throw off the serious systems player.

                          Any good lottery system, for example, exploits the law of averages in order to enable its user to make accurate predictions more often than inaccurate ones. Most of these systems don't directly deal with bias, but I have seen a few that require the player to study the bias of each digit in a game (remember Professor Jones???). These systems are more complex than Chinese calculus(apologies to my Asian friends), are very expensive to buy and are even more expensive to play. In the end, however, I don't believe they are any more effective than other systems that don't require physics equations.

                          Patience. I'm getting there.

                          Most lottery players, I think, miss a very important element in their playing strategy, and that element is time. Think about it: when we buy or develop a new system, the first thing we do is chart the past results of the game. For a daily Pick-4 game, for example, I'll chart the results for the past 300 draws before I buy a ticket. This takes a while, but it gives me insights into the overall behavior of every digit in the game. I can then break that information down relative to position, frequency and type (no-match, doubles, triples and quads). Even after I have this information, though, I still might not buy a ticket, because I know I can't win everyday. So I wait. I wait until I can spot a trend that has repeated over and over again, and then I wheel my numbers and buy my tickets. I might not get a hit that night but, by waiting for an opportunity to improve my odds, I've saved the money I would have spent when no trends were apparent. Time favors the player. The state lottery must draw the numbers at pre-designated times, but we don't have to buy a ticket. We can afford to wait, which brings me, finally, to the multiple ballsets.

                          In my opinion, it doesn't matter how many ballsets they use. Over time, twenty ballsets will exhibit the same behavior, relative to bias, as two or three. All twenty ballsets will be used dventually, and the miniscule differences in the bias of each of the two hundred balls will be absorbed by the Law of Averages. In other words, as you chart your past results, those results will already reflect the present degrees of bias and randomness inherent in the combined ballsets. Each ballset contains ten digits, 0 through 9. Using twenty ballsets, we have twenty zeroes, twenty ones, twenty twos, and so on. Each of the twenty twos, for example, will behave slightly differently in the airstream than its nineteen counterparts, due to minute differences in its weight and bias characteristics. The same is true for all of the other digits. But bias can, and does change over time. As the air slams the balls around inside the machine, they lose paint and material, which falls to the bottom of the hopper. This changes their weight and overall degree of bias until that ballset wears out and must be replaced. I don't know if they change all twenty ballsets when one wears out, or if they only replace the worn set, but it shouldn't matter. Since the game doesn't know which ballset is being used on any given day, the Law of Averages should prevail. The game only knows that it has to produce one ball from each machine. So in a Pick-4 game, it will see only 4 zeroes, 4 ones, 4 twos, etc. The remaining sixteen ballsets are not a factor in this drawing. The Law of Averages states that, over time, each digit should appear as often as every other digit. Look at almost any state's daily game results and you can see that this is, for the most part, true. Isn't that how we pick our winners, by combing through our charts, looking for numbers that are overdue, hot, cold, etc.? 

                          If your state's game has recently introduced additional ballsets, wait them out. Don't play for six months or so, and give them a chance to rotate their ballsets completely at least once, preferably twice. This will enable you to chart the overall characteristics of past drawings utilizing the additional ballsets, and should give you a pretty good idea of how the extra ballsets are affecting the game. If the change has been relatively recent, you should be able to pinpoint when they switch them out. If you can discover an interval, you'll have a decided edge over the lottery, as well as the other players in your state. Let's say you're charting your daily game results everyday, but you're not actually buying tickets. If you can identify when they change ballsets or machines, you can narrow your odds dramatically on those days, because you'll know what happened the last time they used it. For their daily Pick-3 and Pick-4 games, for example, Michigan uses the same machines for six weeks, then switches them out for backup machines. This is valuable information since, once I can identfy the beginning of a six-week cycle, I can also identify its end. Then, I adjust my selections accordingly, or I wait until I see something I can exploit, such as a trend or an overdue double.

                          I'm sure there are people here who will disagree with me, and I'm looking forward to reading their arguments. We all have our methods, superstitions and strategies, and those presented here are the ones that have worked for me. Since I no longer play in Indiana (except Powerball), I've found these observations to be extremely valuable in games using ping-pong balls. For games using computerized electronic random number generators, good luck to you, but you're on your own.

                          Thus ends today's presentation. I wish you all a happy holiday season and a very profitable 2004.           

                            konane's avatar - wallace
                            Atlanta, GA
                            United States
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                            Posted: December 29, 2003, 9:16 am - IP Logged

                            jim695  "I don't know if they change all twenty ballsets when one wears out, or if they only replace the worn set, but it shouldn't matter."

                            In GA for Fantasy 5 and other larger games they replaced one ballset every 6 months, or at least that is what I was told.  I have no data about the machines, but am aware they can manipulate machine angle and timing to insure randomness of the draw.

                            "If you can identify when they change ballsets or machines, you can narrow your odds dramatically on those days, because you'll know what happened the last time they used it. For their daily Pick-3 and Pick-4 games, for example, Michigan uses the same machines for six weeks, then switches them out for backup machines. This is valuable information since, once I can identfy the beginning of a six-week cycle, I can also identify its end. Then, I adjust my selections accordingly, or I wait until I see something I can exploit, such as a trend or an overdue double."

                            When I was following numbers closely and trends seemed to completely fall apart, crazy numbers came out of nowhere, was when a ballset would be replaced in GA.

                            Also another factor which lotteries can not fully control is number affinities (certain numbers which have a greater predisposition to being drawn with others) which was pointed out in the "Lotto World" articles.   

                            I maintain that no matter what system one uses, gut instinct/intuition/hunches to play or not to play certain numbers is the only element which cuts through both time and space and circumvents all methods lotteries use through to keep draws "random."  Human intuition is one aspect that lotteries can not control no matter how many ballsets they use, no matter how they tweak the machines.   

                            Good luck to everyone!

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                              tn
                              United States
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                              December 7, 2003
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                              Posted: December 30, 2003, 12:36 am - IP Logged

                              i dont think that the lottery is rigged. it would take too much time and effort for them to do that. but i know stories where people(like us) have rigged it,did you see  the movie "lucky numbers" i think is the name of it with john travolta,that was a good story and a true story. i dont think the lottery companies/states/government rig it. but it can be rigged.

                                 
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