Welcome Guest
Log In | Register )
You last visited December 4, 2016, 3:06 am
All times shown are
Eastern Time (GMT-5:00)

Mass. Lottery dispute takes bizarre turn

Topic closed. 39 replies. Last post 11 years ago by LisaD1091.

Page 3 of 3
PrintE-mailLink
Avatar
NY
United States
Member #23835
October 16, 2005
3474 Posts
Offline
Posted: February 7, 2006, 6:38 pm - IP Logged

konane wrote:

<< How does the law view precedents set through the "law of custom" in which convenience store owners had allowed St. John to rummage through garbage >>

Allowing St John to go through the trash and take things only means that the store has no claim on the ticket. The store has absolutely no power to give up anybody else's rights.

<< I fully understand Donovan's son is a legal heir to Donovan's estate, but I still question whether Donovan gave up actual ownership of the winning scratch off by carelessly discarding it >>

Donovan's intent is the matter the courts will need to decide, assuming it goes that far. If the court decides that he intended to abandon his property then St. John is now the lawful owner. If he had only thrown one ticket in the trash it would almost certainly be a slam dunk for St John, but since he threw many tickets away the legal issue is whether he intended to throw way the winning ticket or if it was lost accidentally. If it was lost accidentally it doesn't matter whether it was lost in a trash can, the parking lot, or a bus on his way home. Any accidental loss of property means ownership and recovery are governed by the applicable law. 

    konane's avatar - wallace
    Atlanta, GA
    United States
    Member #1265
    March 13, 2003
    3333 Posts
    Offline
    Posted: February 7, 2006, 6:52 pm - IP Logged

    konane wrote:

    << How does the law view precedents set through the "law of custom" in which convenience store owners had allowed St. John to rummage through garbage >>

    Allowing St John to go through the trash and take things only means that the store has no claim on the ticket. The store has absolutely no power to give up anybody else's rights.

    << I fully understand Donovan's son is a legal heir to Donovan's estate, but I still question whether Donovan gave up actual ownership of the winning scratch off by carelessly discarding it >>

    Donovan's intent is the matter the courts will need to decide, assuming it goes that far. If the court decides that he intended to abandon his property then St. John is now the lawful owner. If he had only thrown one ticket in the trash it would almost certainly be a slam dunk for St John, but since he threw many tickets away the legal issue is whether he intended to throw way the winning ticket or if it was lost accidentally. If it was lost accidentally it doesn't matter whether it was lost in a trash can, the parking lot, or a bus on his way home. Any accidental loss of property means ownership and recovery are governed by the applicable law. 

    Thank you for your answers.

    Seems from the first article that it became "lost" only after it was learned that it was a large dollar winner ...  if someone wants to split hairs about timing to claim as a loss rather than part of a discard batch. 

    However, that's for the courts to decide and will be interesting as to the outcome.  Thanks again!! Sun Smiley

    Good luck to everyone!

      Tenaj's avatar - michellea
      Charlotte NC
      United States
      Member #17406
      June 18, 2005
      4053 Posts
      Offline
      Posted: February 7, 2006, 6:59 pm - IP Logged

      LOLPossession is 9/10 of the law.LOL

      takeemtothebank

        mken32's avatar - Lottery-062.jpg
        I dont know where
        United States
        Member #1702
        June 18, 2003
        103 Posts
        Offline
        Posted: February 7, 2006, 9:19 pm - IP Logged

        What I learn here never discard your tickets in a public place til you double and triple verify and then throw them away in your own trash.

         

         

          Tenaj's avatar - michellea
          Charlotte NC
          United States
          Member #17406
          June 18, 2005
          4053 Posts
          Offline
          Posted: February 7, 2006, 9:24 pm - IP Logged

          What I learn here never discard your tickets in a public place til you double and triple verify and then throw them away in your own trash.

           

           

          This guy was only scratching off codes and not the entire ticket.

          takeemtothebank

            Avatar
            Sparta, NJ
            United States
            Member #18331
            July 9, 2005
            1977 Posts
            Offline
            Posted: February 7, 2006, 9:29 pm - IP Logged

            Isn't there some kind of ruling that allows the law to go through your garbage, after you put it out for pickup, because it is now public property - which is how the police prosecuted some people without a search warrent?  I recall a law, in my former state, where garbage on the corner is public property and you can take it, but cannot open a dumpster to get at garbage.  As long as you don't make a mess or a public health hazard.  Didn't a group of magazine publishers go through the garbage of celebrities a while back and win a law suit that said they could do that.

            Why wouldn't that concept apply to thrown away lottery tickets?  One mans garbage is another mans treasure.

            Cheers

            |||::> *'`*:-.,_,.-:*''*:--->>> Chewie  <<<---.*''*:-.,_,.-:*''* <:::|||

            I only trust myself - and that's a questionable choice

              mylollipop's avatar - Trek STLOGO6.png

              United States
              Member #24380
              October 21, 2005
              623 Posts
              Offline
              Posted: February 13, 2006, 9:24 am - IP Logged

              My question remains. Boxing Did anyone see Donovan throw away the ticket(s)?  Was it on a surveillance camera?  Anyone can make that claim.  I hope that his son will let this matter rest-in-peace with his daddy. White Bounce

                BaristaExpress's avatar - BaristaExpressMX zpsfb0d8b5d.png
                Magnolia, Delaware
                United States
                Member #18795
                July 20, 2005
                789 Posts
                Offline
                Posted: February 13, 2006, 10:11 pm - IP Logged

                The law disagrees with your view on both points. The one fact about the circumstances of this case that is undisputed is that St John found the ticket, and the laws about found property are clear. St John only becomes the lawful owner of anything he finds if the person who lost it intended to abandon it or doesn't come forward in the period specified by law.

                BS That's what that is above.

                ANY lottery ticket is a BEARER Instrument and that's a fact! That's all that should be recognized here! The Mass lottery even admits that's what their lottery tickets are, so why put up with all the petty BS from the dummy who lost the ticket in the first place? The lottery in Mass is one I wouldn't play (even if I could) because they don't follow their own rules as to what their lottery tickets are! There is no claim by any other person to be made on a Bearer Instrument! Unless said Bearer Instrument is obtained through fraud, some how, some way and that isn't the case here! So, I say pay the person who presented the ticket for payment, "It's A Bearer Instrument" END OF STORY!


                 

                Keep dreaming the impossible dream, it just may come true! Thumbs Up

                  Avatar
                  New Member
                  Blackstone
                  United States
                  Member #34017
                  February 26, 2006
                  2 Posts
                  Offline
                  Posted: February 26, 2006, 9:20 pm - IP Logged

                  Well I`m not really going to voice my opinion on this matter, being that I am Kevin's daughter, I'm sure you all know what I am going to say. I just want to say that I do believe this matter is between the courts, St. John, My family, and the lottery. I'm not trying to stop anyone from voicing your opinions and I'm not trying to offend anyone, but I figured I would just thank everyone who sent their condolences. And for you all who are calling my father a "dummy" or whatever, please, he's dead, have some respect. St. John had no right to go inside a store and go through their trash by the way. The man is not smart, well at least I don't find rummaging through the trash smart, and he's an extremely rude individual. His comments on my father's death were unnecessary. Again, as I said I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone over this issue, including St. John, but please have respect.

                    Avatar
                    New Member
                    Blackstone
                    United States
                    Member #34017
                    February 26, 2006
                    2 Posts
                    Offline
                    Posted: February 26, 2006, 9:22 pm - IP Logged

                    Oh.. P.S My father buying the tickets and throwing them away are on surveillance, and the clerk was willing to testify on his behalf, mylollipop.