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Pa. lawmaker wants to give lottery winners right to remain anonymous

Topic closed. 77 replies. Last post 3 years ago by Kejana48.

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Jon D's avatar - calotterylogo
Los Angeles, California
United States
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January 5, 2011
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Posted: December 10, 2013, 4:24 pm - IP Logged

Ummm, ok...one state. Others?

Yo, bro...you're the one that made the (false) claim, I just refuted it. Wink

You are more than welcome to check all the remaining states, I did my part.

It's actually not uncommon in many non-anonymous states for Trusts to claim large prizes to keep a winner's identity hidden. Only a few states specifically disallow LLCs and Trusts from claiming prizes.

So OK, here's one last one for you:

http://www.louisianalottery.com/index.cfm?md=newsroom&tmp=detail&articleID=1050

Consider a Trust for your JP, and let the bloodsucking lawyer do the press conference for you.

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    United States
    Member #135804
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    Posted: December 10, 2013, 5:31 pm - IP Logged

    Edit: I just called the Lousiana lottery and asked them. When you claim the prize, even if it is a trust, they get all names tied to the trust. The woman said if someone requests, they would release the name.

      Arrowhead's avatar - underground
      Ohio
      United States
      Member #120754
      December 27, 2011
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      Posted: December 10, 2013, 5:54 pm - IP Logged

      Right, so the trust really does little or no good in terms of anonymity. Which is the point.

       

      and, per Illinois---http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-04-22/lottery-winners-anonymous-mega-millions/54441676/1

       

      "Mike Lang, an  Illinois Lottery spokesman, agrees and says winners in his state must come forward publicly "unless there is a compelling reason not to."

        Jon D's avatar - calotterylogo
        Los Angeles, California
        United States
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        Posted: December 10, 2013, 6:42 pm - IP Logged

        Right, so the trust really does little or no good in terms of anonymity. Which is the point.

         

        and, per Illinois---http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-04-22/lottery-winners-anonymous-mega-millions/54441676/1

         

        "Mike Lang, an  Illinois Lottery spokesman, agrees and says winners in his state must come forward publicly "unless there is a compelling reason not to."

        I think it's a play on words. The operable word is "winner."

        The lotteries want winners to come forward and pose with the ginormous check for sales and marketing purposes. They don't want to advertise that there are ways you can get out of it, like claiming as trusts. When you form a trust to claim the lottery prize, you're transferring ownership of the ticket to the trust, and the trust becomes the winner.

        Remember what Kelly Cripe of TX Lotto said in that Trust claim: that the winner doesn't have to be an individual, it can be a trust. And did you catch my other link for IL Lotto where the winner claimed as a trust? Maybe the big MM winners the Butlers didn't know they could claim as a trust in IL and came forward too soon. Whoops.

        All these lottery spokesmen like Mike Lang keep saying, the winners must come forward, and that the winner cannot be anonymous. True. But what they're NOT saying is that the winner can be the trust, and that the winner who comes forward in person and does the press conference is the lawyer who is the trustee of the trust.

        Very sneaky.

          Arrowhead's avatar - underground
          Ohio
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          December 27, 2011
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          Posted: December 10, 2013, 7:33 pm - IP Logged

          I think it's a play on words. The operable word is "winner."

          The lotteries want winners to come forward and pose with the ginormous check for sales and marketing purposes. They don't want to advertise that there are ways you can get out of it, like claiming as trusts. When you form a trust to claim the lottery prize, you're transferring ownership of the ticket to the trust, and the trust becomes the winner.

          Remember what Kelly Cripe of TX Lotto said in that Trust claim: that the winner doesn't have to be an individual, it can be a trust. And did you catch my other link for IL Lotto where the winner claimed as a trust? Maybe the big MM winners the Butlers didn't know they could claim as a trust in IL and came forward too soon. Whoops.

          All these lottery spokesmen like Mike Lang keep saying, the winners must come forward, and that the winner cannot be anonymous. True. But what they're NOT saying is that the winner can be the trust, and that the winner who comes forward in person and does the press conference is the lawyer who is the trustee of the trust.

          Very sneaky.

          Well, 'bro', since you evidently live in California, consider this information useful after you win the MM later tonight. LOL

           

          From the California Lottery 'Winners Handbook'---

          "According to public disclosure laws, your name
          is public record. The name and location of the
          retailer who sold the winning ticket, the date you
          won, whether your numbers were a Quick Pick®
          or your own numbers and the amount of your
          winnings are also matters of public record and are
          subject to disclosure.

          You can form a trust prior to claiming your
          prize, but understand that your name is still
          public and reportable."

            Jon D's avatar - calotterylogo
            Los Angeles, California
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            Posted: December 10, 2013, 7:45 pm - IP Logged

            Well, 'bro', since you evidently live in California, consider this information useful after you win the MM later tonight. LOL

             

            From the California Lottery 'Winners Handbook'---

            "According to public disclosure laws, your name
            is public record. The name and location of the
            retailer who sold the winning ticket, the date you
            won, whether your numbers were a Quick Pick®
            or your own numbers and the amount of your
            winnings are also matters of public record and are
            subject to disclosure.

            You can form a trust prior to claiming your
            prize, but understand that your name is still
            public and reportable."

            Don't talk to me, talk to my lawyer, who is the trustee of my trust, the real winner!

            Green laugh

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              New Member
              Oakland, CA
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              December 8, 2013
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              Posted: December 11, 2013, 4:35 am - IP Logged

              I'm beginning to think I don't want to win the lottery, after all. Like if I win the $400+ million jackpot that's up now, it'd basically destroy my life. What good is money if you're constantly fearful for your safety or you can't get a moments rest from people looking for a hand out? I'd rather win the second prize, where you get a couple million, because those people don't generally have to do press conferences. Sure, they're put on the web site, but I doubt people are really seeking out a $1 million or $2 million second prize winner to ask for money, because it doesn't take a CPA to realize that you can go through $1-2MM pretty quickly no matter who you are.

                rdgrnr's avatar - walt
                Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
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                Posted: December 11, 2013, 5:48 am - IP Logged

                I'm beginning to think I don't want to win the lottery, after all. Like if I win the $400+ million jackpot that's up now, it'd basically destroy my life. What good is money if you're constantly fearful for your safety or you can't get a moments rest from people looking for a hand out? I'd rather win the second prize, where you get a couple million, because those people don't generally have to do press conferences. Sure, they're put on the web site, but I doubt people are really seeking out a $1 million or $2 million second prize winner to ask for money, because it doesn't take a CPA to realize that you can go through $1-2MM pretty quickly no matter who you are.

                MegaSuperPower,

                Just give me the JP ticket and I'll do the press conference for ya and I'll still give you half of the winnings.

                How about it?

                  TheGameGrl's avatar - character catafly.jpg
                  A long and winding road
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                  Posted: December 13, 2013, 8:20 pm - IP Logged

                  As a resident of PA and having my ears to the Media Hype on this tom-foolery....why not allow this to be a voters choice bill? Allow us voters to decide, we have seen far to long that our voices are NOT heard thru General Assembly or via any senate/congress means. this will only get passed if it suits the upcoming sell off of the Lottery Division that has been trying to get placed. 

                  And if perchance anyone wins the 400mill, Dont ya think Smith and Wesson make good body guards? Seriously if Donald Trump, Warren Buffet  and Bill Gates can make it thru life ...then so can a person of wealth thru the lottery. Its a matter of sensibility.....

                  ~~wonderment

                    Bondi Junction
                    Australia
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                    December 24, 2007
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                    Posted: December 13, 2013, 9:26 pm - IP Logged

                    Protecting Winners

                    • The identity of all winners is kept confidential, unless they request otherwise.
                    • Always ensure the details of your Players Club membership are up-to-date.
                    • View NSW Lotteries Privacy Policy online at NSW Lotteries website

                    We all get a lot out of lotteries!

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                      NY
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                      Posted: December 14, 2013, 10:33 am - IP Logged

                      Don't talk to me, talk to my lawyer, who is the trustee of my trust, the real winner!

                      Green laugh

                      How can your trust win a lottery before your trust even exists? Only a legal entity that owns a lottery ticket at the time of the drawing can be a winner. Any entity that acquires a winning lottery ticket after it becomes a winning ticket is merely an owner.

                      Even if you could remain anonymous by creating a trust, how much do you suppose a lawyer will charge to have their name and face substituted for yours? I wouldn't take the chance of having my business phone inundated with worthless calls, or the chance of  having my time to earn income jeopardized without charging as much as I might potentially lose.

                      OTOH, somewhere in some really large city maybe there's a lawyer named John Smith or Bill Johnson who's almost ready to retire but wishes they had just another million bucks in their retirement account.

                        Jon D's avatar - calotterylogo
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                        Posted: December 14, 2013, 10:43 am - IP Logged

                        How can your trust win a lottery before your trust even exists? Only a legal entity that owns a lottery ticket at the time of the drawing can be a winner. Any entity that acquires a winning lottery ticket after it becomes a winning ticket is merely an owner.

                        Even if you could remain anonymous by creating a trust, how much do you suppose a lawyer will charge to have their name and face substituted for yours? I wouldn't take the chance of having my business phone inundated with worthless calls, or the chance of  having my time to earn income jeopardized without charging as much as I might potentially lose.

                        OTOH, somewhere in some really large city maybe there's a lawyer named John Smith or Bill Johnson who's almost ready to retire but wishes they had just another million bucks in their retirement account.

                        Well...you can move the slider and say, at what exact point do you win? The night of the draw? Or when your claim is validated?

                        You win a game when it is determined that you followed all the rules of the game as required, and then they decide to award you. So when is that? The draw night or claim day?

                        They need to check if that ticket is valid, that the buyer is authorized to play, etc. THEN you are a winner. The numbers matching is just the first part. That's one interpretation.

                        Are they legally bound to pay you based on simply bearing a matching ticket at draw night? (or ever) Not so fast.

                          Avatar
                          Portland, OR
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                          Posted: December 14, 2013, 11:22 am - IP Logged

                          Let a corp lawyer register a corporation for you (Nevada is nice).  There is no chance of your name being released unless the state requires your real name.  Instruct your lawyer to pick up your winnings.  Lawyer doesn't mind to be in the news.  Lawyers love to be on the news.  It's good for publicity.   I'm sure they will charge their regular fees for that.

                          "Understand... people are more complicated than the masks they wear in society... everyone is playing to win, and some people will use moral justifications to advance their side"

                                                                                                                                                                                    Robert Greene

                            Avatar
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                            Posted: December 14, 2013, 4:18 pm - IP Logged

                            Well...you can move the slider and say, at what exact point do you win? The night of the draw? Or when your claim is validated?

                            You win a game when it is determined that you followed all the rules of the game as required, and then they decide to award you. So when is that? The draw night or claim day?

                            They need to check if that ticket is valid, that the buyer is authorized to play, etc. THEN you are a winner. The numbers matching is just the first part. That's one interpretation.

                            Are they legally bound to pay you based on simply bearing a matching ticket at draw night? (or ever) Not so fast.

                            When did Dee Dee Moore become Abraham Shakespeare? It took an arrest and a trail before they could  punsih her, but would you seriously argue that she didn't become his killer as soon as he was dead?

                            That the ticket needs to be validated  is irrelevant. It may result in a determination that somebody isn't a winner, but I don't see a valid argument that  you despite bneing the lawful owner of the winning ticket you don't become a winner until the validation process is started, let alone finished. The validation, assuming it's successful, establishes that the ticket was valid at the time it was issued, and it becomes a winning ticket when the numbers are drawn.

                              Jon D's avatar - calotterylogo
                              Los Angeles, California
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                              Posted: December 14, 2013, 4:35 pm - IP Logged

                              When did Dee Dee Moore become Abraham Shakespeare? It took an arrest and a trail before they could  punsih her, but would you seriously argue that she didn't become his killer as soon as he was dead?

                              That the ticket needs to be validated  is irrelevant. It may result in a determination that somebody isn't a winner, but I don't see a valid argument that  you despite bneing the lawful owner of the winning ticket you don't become a winner until the validation process is started, let alone finished. The validation, assuming it's successful, establishes that the ticket was valid at the time it was issued, and it becomes a winning ticket when the numbers are drawn.

                              Well, if it's a bearer instrument, then it can move from one person to another.

                              We see many people saying they are scared to win this much money. Well, let's say we have some scaredy cat who bought a ticket and it wins, but he's too scared of the money and gives it to his friend after the draw, lawfully, and with witnesses. His friend goes to claim the ticket and winnings.

                              So who's the winner? The first guy, or his friend? They don't call the friend the winner? What do they all him in the press release?

                              That the ticket needs to be validated  is irrelevant.

                              I strongly disagree. The ticket isn't a winning ticket UNTIL it is validated. You aren't a winner until YOU are validated as the lawful owner of the ticket.