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an RNG series...

Topic closed. 8 replies. Last post 11 years ago by psykomo.

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Honduras
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August 29, 2005
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Posted: September 14, 2005, 11:38 pm - IP Logged

Guys, i heard that if you use a RANdom Number generator with a smaller seed, it is possible to deduct after careful revision, the numbers drawn and thus find out what series the Random number generator is in and find out what number is next...I heard however that it can only be possible on RNG that have smaller seeds...Please let me know what your opinion...I will greatly appreciate it...

michael brown

    RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
    mid-Ohio
    United States
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    Posted: September 15, 2005, 2:36 am - IP Logged

    http://www.lotterypost.com/thread/119577

    I just want to say that i am free to post my idea, and if anybody doesn't like them well that's their problem...I don't care if the whole world disagree with me or doesn't like what i write..YOu don't have to read what i write...

    michael brown

    Sounds like you're not really interested in anyone else's opinion.

     * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
       
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      NemeSys's avatar - Nemesis
      Harrogate
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      Posted: September 15, 2005, 5:59 am - IP Logged

      With the latest generation of RNGs, seed size isn't the issue it once was. I doubt lotteries employing computerised draws are using the older algorithms, such as simple linear congruence generators. One example of an LGC is:

      xn+1 = (a xn + c) mod m

      where a = 16807, c = 0, m = 231 - 1, and the seed x0 = 667790

      This is a 32-bit generator; it is quite sensitive to the value x0; and its period is small enough to be exhausted in a few seconds on modern computers (including fast PCs). Obviously you wouldn't want to use it for serious applications - and a state or national lottery can be considered as such, given the amount of money involved.

      One of the best ways to choose the seed the value is to tap into the computer's internal clock, preferably at the nanosecond level: there's no earthly way anyone can know what the seed is.

      If you're planning on predicting a lottery based on what RNG is used, don't bother. Whilst it's true that any given seed will always generate the same sequence of numbers, you can never know beforehand what that sequence will be the first time you try said seed.

      As if all that isn't bad enough, current work on hardware-based RNGs considers such sources as thermal noise and quantum-level behaviour to generate numbers!

      "God is subtle but He is not malicious." - Albert Einstein

      "In my experience there's no such thing as luck." - Alec Guinness, Star Wars Episode IV

        Tenaj's avatar - michellea
        Charlotte NC
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        Posted: September 15, 2005, 3:41 pm - IP Logged

        You guys have lost me with your theory, except the part about the seed generating the same sequence of numbers. 

        There is a pattern I have noticed since RNG came on the scene.  I keep daily records of 4 states and have been since 1994.  When RNG are used for a state's drawing, repeats started happening, (some people call them travelers) over and over.  I mean the same number will fall that night, the next night and then in another state the next day.  The same way!  I remember when 847 wouldn't stop coming.  And what made it so bad is what ever is behind the 847 came just as many times.  And whatever followed it comes as many times.  A constant loop.  Look how many times the 234 combo came.  I wasn't crazy when I talked about the 015 bringing the 156 in ill.  It just sounded crazy and you'll have to keep a certain kind of record to see the pattern.  847 showed up yesterday in one of the states and I thought - here we go again.

        So, I figure- RNG can be a good thing.  Just hit the repeats over and over.

        I was concerned about NC using computerized drawing - now I say BRING IT ON!

        takeemtothebank

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          Honduras
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          Posted: September 15, 2005, 6:01 pm - IP Logged

          Tenaj What people don't know is that RNG are less random than the krystal ball lottery machine...I will say that the RNG is more like 84% random while the krystal ball lottery machine is more like 98%...So RNG is a good thing...

          michael brown


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            Posted: September 15, 2005, 6:29 pm - IP Logged

            I always knew RNG's were'nt RANDOM

              NemeSys's avatar - Nemesis
              Harrogate
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              Posted: September 16, 2005, 1:59 am - IP Logged

              You've all hit the nail on the head. Either the lotteries in question are using a poorly-designed RNG (either a short period, or high sensitivity to seed values), or they're using seed values which give rise to sequences that fail the tests for randomness. You'd think they would have noticed by now...

              "God is subtle but He is not malicious." - Albert Einstein

              "In my experience there's no such thing as luck." - Alec Guinness, Star Wars Episode IV

                RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                mid-Ohio
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                Posted: September 16, 2005, 3:26 pm - IP Logged

                If poorly-designed RNGs repeated the same numbers more than bouncing ball, that should make it easier for players to win more causing the States to lose money and notice.  Apparently poorly designed RNGs work as good as bouncing balls as far a the States are concerned.

                 * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                   
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                  psykomo's avatar - animal shark.jpg

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                  Posted: September 16, 2005, 4:30 pm - IP Logged

                  You've all hit the nail on the head. Either the lotteries in question are using a poorly-designed RNG (either a short period, or high sensitivity to seed values), or they're using seed values which give rise to sequences that fail the tests for randomness. You'd think they would have noticed by now...

                  NemeSys.............I would think the public would have noticed by now and maby????????????

                  reduce the amount of tickets bought???????? At least when you go to VEGAS (they spend money,  lots  of  money  on  customers)

                  you don't expect to see a tent city to gamble under or maby an outdoor arena???????????

                  under the stars. Vegas spends money to get you there and provide some......

                  entertainment value at leastttttttttttttttttttttt.

                  The states say, they want to cut the xxpence of TV and all the cost of the......

                  bubble machines.......HAHA..................what a joke on the poor......players!!

                  Butttttttttttttttttt.......they want to save MONEY......to provide for moeeeee

                  education..........GUESS that is justificaion for these RNG MACHINES...........

                  To bad the states can't look at any waste in their great EDUCATION system.  

                  PSYKOMO