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• Coin Toss

  

  Zeta Reticuli Star System
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  Jun 29, 2006, 2:25 pm

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  There seems to be a lot of disagreement on how odds are figured.

  I'm going to use roulette as an example (American roulette, 0 and 00).

  Considering 0 and 00 there are 38 numbers to bet on, 1- 36, and 0, 00. Betting one number straight up the odds are1 in 38, or 37 to one, written as 37:1.

  If you see the word for on a casino game layout (dice, Reno) the for includes the bet - on some layouts an 11 pays 15 to 1, on others 16 for one, it means the same thing.

  Back to roulette, the oddds against a number are 37:1. If the bet wins, the payout is 35:1. It should pay 37:1 (true odds), it pays 35:1. 

  The two units not paid are the house edge. 

  Let me make sure everyone has this and then we'll go to dice.  
• Rip Snorter

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 2:29 pm

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  Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on June 29, 2006

  There seems to be a lot of disagreement on how odds are figured.

  I'm going to use roulette as an example (American roulette, 0 and 00).

  Considering 0 and 00 there are 38 numbers to bet on, 1- 36, and 0, 00. Betting one number straight up the odds are1 in 38, or 37 to one, written as 37:1.

  If you see the word for on a casino game layout (dice, Reno) the for includes the bet - on some layouts an 11 pays 15 to 1, on others 16 for one, it means the same thing.

  Back to roulette, the oddds against a number are 37:1. If the bet wins, the payout is 35:1. It should pay 37:1 (true odds), it pays 35:1. 

  The two units not paid are the house edge. 

  Let me make sure everyone has this and then we'll go to dice.  

  Coin Toss:

  I'm beginning to really enjoy reading your posts.

  If you were a woman and if I were 20 years younger and if I lived somewhere nearer where you do I'd most likely offer to sit down at third base with you at first and play a few hands of blackjack.

  J

  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

  It's about number behavior.

  Egos don't count.

   

  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

   
• johnph77

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 4:48 pm

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  I would think it's a matter of personal preference. I prefer that odds are separated by double colons and the smaller number placed first, as in 1::36. "The odds are 1 in 36 that the specified event will occur".

  gl

  j

  Blessed Saint Leibowitz, keep 'em dreamin' down there..... 

  Next week's convention for Psychics and Prognosticators has been cancelled due to unforeseen circumstances.

   =^.^=
• Coin Toss

  

  Zeta Reticuli Star System
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  Jun 29, 2006, 7:13 pm

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  Aww shucks Rip Snorter (I'm no spring chicken! - and let's not play Hi Sailor!
  Not that there's anything wrong with that!)  lol

   

  johnph77

  Yeah, just a different way of expressing it, I guess we stick with however we learn for the most part.

  I had years of casino work and whenever odds come up  there's always expressed as odds against an even occuring - same way the layouts are written on the games.

  
  
• Rip Snorter

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 7:18 pm

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  Coin Toss:

  I'm not a hi sailor sort of guy.  Can't recall ever being thought to be before.

  Got me chuckling, however.

  Heck.  Maybe if I ever live another century or so I'll see I missed my calling.

  J

  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

  It's about number behavior.

  Egos don't count.

   

  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

   
• Rip Snorter

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 7:25 pm

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  Maybe it was that mention I made somewhere about a Portuguese man I came to like a lot in Kukuihaele.  Ray Arugio.

  Old Ray loaned me a mule.  Worst mule I've ever had the pleasure of trying to work with.  It's hard not to like a man who'll put you onto something so memorable.

  But I never liked him all THAT much.

  J

  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

  It's about number behavior.

  Egos don't count.

   

  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

   
• Rip Snorter

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 7:42 pm

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  I haven't thought about that mule in a longer while than most LP users have been alive, I suspect.  But because of your post I'm sitting here having vivid enough recollections to cause me to think I'm going to have to make a blog entry about it.

  I spent about six weeks with only that mule for company in the country where the Kohala range drifts down to the ocean.  It was a time filled with a lot of other things so's the mule sort of fell into the background of my consciousness, superceded by other matters.

  But you haven't lived until you've tried to coax a loaded mule who doesn't want to go up a 1700 foot zee trail cliff face, across 12 miles bad trail full of washboard dips filled with water and a mule trying to tippietoe across the tops because he doesn't want to get his feet wet.

  Taking unexpected notions every five minutes or so to go straight up the side, or failing that, straight down.

  I've never seen such an animal before or since.

  Yep, that's a story I'm going to have to write up for a blog.

  J

  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

  It's about number behavior.

  Egos don't count.

   

  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

   
• Coin Toss

  

  Zeta Reticuli Star System
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  Jun 29, 2006, 7:46 pm

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  I was just kiding there Rip, I'm not of that persausion either. (At least I didn;t let you think I was a chick!)

  Odds:

  OK, remember about the pair of dice ading up to 14. Let's start with the numbers 4 and 10 (4 and 10 are the same for odds calculations, so are 5 and 9, and so are 6 and 8).

  Of the 36 possible combinations,  there are three ways to make a 4 (or a ten), for the 4 it's a 2 and a 2 (hard 4, a pair), a 3 and a 1, and a 1 and a 3.

  That's three combinations - there are always six ways to make a 7 - and 7 is what the game revolves around. So 3 ways to make a 4 and six ways to make a 7 means the odds against making the 4 are 6:3, or 2:1.

  4, 5, 6, 8, 9, and 10 are "point" numbers, if the shooter rolls one of them on his first roll that becomes their point and the game is based on it repeating before a 7 is rolled. 

  Odds:

  4 or 10  2:1

  5 or 9   3:2

  6 or 8   6:5 

  Combinations determine the odds for all the numbers that can be rolled with a pair of dice.
  

   

   
• Rip Snorter

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 8:24 pm

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  Coin Toss:

  It never entered my mind you might be.

  I think my formative years gave me too much protection from that side of things to leave any holes for it to peek through in my thinking. 

  On the other hand, if I'd thought you were a chick you'd still have been safe insofar as my thinking.  Somewhere down the track I had one too many experiences with women that ought to have reminded me sooner of that mule.

  I don't think I'm going to spend any more time thinking about odds for a while.  My mind's gone fuzzy on something else I was working on trying to make some predictions for tonight.

  Thanks for the reply and the clarification, even if it didn't make any difference to either of us.  Remembering that mule was worth the price of admission for me. 

  Maybe something someone else posted here will make it worth the price of admission for you.

  Jack

   

  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

  It's about number behavior.

  Egos don't count.

   

  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

   
• Coin Toss

  

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  Jun 29, 2006, 10:17 pm

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  Oh it has, and that's daily.

   

   
• pacattack05

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  Jun 29, 2006, 11:15 pm

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  Sassafraz Sauce..........
• KY Floyd

  

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  Jun 30, 2006, 4:31 pm

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  Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on June 29, 2006

   
  I was just kiding there Rip, I'm not of that persausion either. (At least I didn;t let you think I was a chick!)

  Odds:

  OK, remember about the pair of dice ading up to 14. Let's start with the numbers 4 and 10 (4 and 10 are the same for odds calculations, so are 5 and 9, and so are 6 and 8).

  Of the 36 possible combinations,  there are three ways to make a 4 (or a ten), for the 4 it's a 2 and a 2 (hard 4, a pair), a 3 and a 1, and a 1 and a 3.

  That's three combinations - there are always six ways to make a 7 - and 7 is what the game revolves around. So 3 ways to make a 4 and six ways to make a 7 means the odds against making the 4 are 6:3, or 2:1.

  4, 5, 6, 8, 9, and 10 are "point" numbers, if the shooter rolls one of them on his first roll that becomes their point and the game is based on it repeating before a 7 is rolled. 

  Odds:

  4 or 10  2:1

  5 or 9   3:2

  6 or 8   6:5 

  Combinations determine the odds for all the numbers that can be rolled with a pair of dice.
  

   

   

  It sounds like your thinking is rooted in your casino background and perhaps confused by payouts for a winning bets. Some of the posters here may play craps or other casino games, but I think the primary discussions are about lottery games, and therefore discussions about odds should be about the probability of winning. Payouts have to differ from the odds or the house wouldn't make any money, but that's economics 101.

  If there are 3 combinations that add up to 4, and there are 36 possible combinations, then there are 33 combinations that don't add up to 4. That makes the odds against rolling a 4  33:3, or 11: 1. The odds for rolling a 4 are 1:11. 
  
• Coin Toss

  

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  Jun 30, 2006, 7:04 pm

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  That's in a game called "Barboo" where every roll of the dice is a "hop bet", but I didn't want to get into that just yet.  

  
  
• Coin Toss

  

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  KY Floyd 

  Even in your post it's stated that odds are based on combinations.
  
• KY Floyd

  

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  Jul 1, 2006, 11:57 am

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  Quote: Originally posted by Coin Toss on June 30, 2006

   
  KY Floyd 

  Even in your post it's stated that odds are based on combinations.
  

  Why not? Odds are based on probability, and probability is determined by the possible combinations or permutations. If there are 36 possible combinations and 3 of them have identical results then the odds for that result are 3 to 33 or 1 to 11.
  
  If you want to talk about what the house pays for a successful bet you shouldn't confuse the matter with discussion about combinations or probability unless you want to contribute the the confusion abouthow odds are figured.