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How many combos to win a cash 5 game at least 50% of the time?

Topic closed. 25 replies. Last post 8 years ago by MADKAT.

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LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
Tx
United States
Member #4570
May 4, 2004
5180 Posts
Offline
Posted: February 8, 2009, 9:04 pm - IP Logged

Has anybody ever tried to see how many combos he or she can come out with to win a cash 5 jackpot game at least 50% of the time for sure.

Since cash 5 games in general pay so little (at least here on Tx), this is regardless of how much the jackpot prize pays.

The thing is, How much can you lower the number of combinations predicted and still get the winning number 50% of the time (Always).

I just wonder what is the best that people can do.

I guess that cash 5 games have from 35 to 39 balls, at least maybe most of them, here on Tx it has 37 balls.

Stew's program says that a 37 ball cash 5 game has 435,897 combinations.

A 39 ball game has 575,757 combos.

a 35 ball game has 324,632.

The jackpot prize is the only one that pays, since lower prizes don't even pay for tickets spent playing that game, even if you just buy 1 line per draw, unless you are good at predicting for that game.

This is from the Tx Lottery site:

Cash Five Winning Numbers for 02/07/2009 were:
2 - 4 - 14 - 20 - 29
Number
Correct     Prize
Amount     Winners
5 of 5     $0     0
4 of 5     $517     78
3 of 5     $9     2,952
2 of 5     $2     28,912
Total Winners:           31,942

Anything less than 4 numbers gets you next to nothing, unless you can win those lower prizes very very often and you play only 1 line per draw, more or less.

     02/07/2009     02     04     14     20     29     $0     0
     02/06/2009     04     15     16     29     30     $0     0
     02/05/2009     02     16     30     34     35     $0     0
     02/04/2009     08     13     17     31     36     $27,156     1
     02/03/2009     04     15     18     21     30     $0     0
     02/02/2009     02     03     18     28     32     $0     0
     01/31/2009     05     15     24     25     26     $0     0
     01/30/2009     11     20     21     28     29     $0     0
     01/29/2009     02     12     14     20     21     $0     0
     01/28/2009     11     16     28     30     33     $24,512     1
     01/27/2009     02     10     16     22     24     $0     0
     01/26/2009     02     08     09     23     28     $24,384     1
     01/24/2009     01     06     12     28     29     $0     0
     01/23/2009     01     13     14     27     32     $0     0
     01/22/2009     05     19     22     32     37     $0     0
     01/21/2009     02     07     10     18     30     $23,569     1
     01/20/2009     12     20     21     22     23     $23,344     1
     01/19/2009     10     18     23     30     32     $0     0
     01/17/2009     02     10     18     25     32     $26,924     1
     01/16/2009     07     09     21     22     23     $23,355     1
     01/15/2009     05     14     17     25     34     $25,085     1
     01/14/2009     23     25     28     32     35     $12,885     2
     01/13/2009     03     06     19     24     27     $0     0
     01/12/2009     06     08     21     25     35     $0     0
     01/10/2009     01     02     14     26     28     $27,228     1
     01/09/2009     04     05     08     33     36     $0     0
     01/08/2009     01     07     27     31     33     $4,128       6
     01/07/2009     04     11     18     20     37     $24,889     1
     01/06/2009     15     32     33     34     37     $12,971     2
     01/05/2009     05     14     26     31     36     $27,806     1
     01/03/2009     16     17     21     25     26     $26,783     1
     01/02/2009     09     13     19     23     28     $8,535       3
     01/01/2009     01     02     03     07     19     $19,686     1

----------

As Always, I had to fix the numbers, When will the lotteries learn that ALL jackpot games' numbers have and are made up of 2 digits?

A 1 is not 1, but a "01", ALL jackpot numbers have "Decades" (Tens) and "Centuries" (Hundreds).

--------

Anyhow, the Tx Lottery seems to pay no more than about $27,000 and about no less than $4,000 for the jackpot prize.

That is very low, seeing as the game has almost 1/2 Million combinations.

A pick 4 game has 10,000 combos and pays $5,000.

A daily pick 5 game 10x10x10x10x10 has 100,000 combinations and pays $50,000 (I think).

The payment for cash 5 games is way out of proportion in relation to the total combinations that it has.

That is also true for the payment for the lower prizes.

-----

And no, I have not tried yet myself to see how much I can reduce the combos.

    edge's avatar - waveform

    United States
    Member #68609
    December 26, 2008
    2204 Posts
    Offline
    Posted: February 8, 2009, 10:14 pm - IP Logged

    Has anybody ever tried to see how many combos he or she can come out with to win a cash 5 jackpot game at least 50% of the time for sure.

    Since cash 5 games in general pay so little (at least here on Tx), this is regardless of how much the jackpot prize pays.

    The thing is, How much can you lower the number of combinations predicted and still get the winning number 50% of the time (Always).

    I just wonder what is the best that people can do.

    I guess that cash 5 games have from 35 to 39 balls, at least maybe most of them, here on Tx it has 37 balls.

    Stew's program says that a 37 ball cash 5 game has 435,897 combinations.

    A 39 ball game has 575,757 combos.

    a 35 ball game has 324,632.

    The jackpot prize is the only one that pays, since lower prizes don't even pay for tickets spent playing that game, even if you just buy 1 line per draw, unless you are good at predicting for that game.

    This is from the Tx Lottery site:

    Cash Five Winning Numbers for 02/07/2009 were:
    2 - 4 - 14 - 20 - 29
    Number
    Correct     Prize
    Amount     Winners
    5 of 5     $0     0
    4 of 5     $517     78
    3 of 5     $9     2,952
    2 of 5     $2     28,912
    Total Winners:           31,942

    Anything less than 4 numbers gets you next to nothing, unless you can win those lower prizes very very often and you play only 1 line per draw, more or less.

         02/07/2009     02     04     14     20     29     $0     0
         02/06/2009     04     15     16     29     30     $0     0
         02/05/2009     02     16     30     34     35     $0     0
         02/04/2009     08     13     17     31     36     $27,156     1
         02/03/2009     04     15     18     21     30     $0     0
         02/02/2009     02     03     18     28     32     $0     0
         01/31/2009     05     15     24     25     26     $0     0
         01/30/2009     11     20     21     28     29     $0     0
         01/29/2009     02     12     14     20     21     $0     0
         01/28/2009     11     16     28     30     33     $24,512     1
         01/27/2009     02     10     16     22     24     $0     0
         01/26/2009     02     08     09     23     28     $24,384     1
         01/24/2009     01     06     12     28     29     $0     0
         01/23/2009     01     13     14     27     32     $0     0
         01/22/2009     05     19     22     32     37     $0     0
         01/21/2009     02     07     10     18     30     $23,569     1
         01/20/2009     12     20     21     22     23     $23,344     1
         01/19/2009     10     18     23     30     32     $0     0
         01/17/2009     02     10     18     25     32     $26,924     1
         01/16/2009     07     09     21     22     23     $23,355     1
         01/15/2009     05     14     17     25     34     $25,085     1
         01/14/2009     23     25     28     32     35     $12,885     2
         01/13/2009     03     06     19     24     27     $0     0
         01/12/2009     06     08     21     25     35     $0     0
         01/10/2009     01     02     14     26     28     $27,228     1
         01/09/2009     04     05     08     33     36     $0     0
         01/08/2009     01     07     27     31     33     $4,128       6
         01/07/2009     04     11     18     20     37     $24,889     1
         01/06/2009     15     32     33     34     37     $12,971     2
         01/05/2009     05     14     26     31     36     $27,806     1
         01/03/2009     16     17     21     25     26     $26,783     1
         01/02/2009     09     13     19     23     28     $8,535       3
         01/01/2009     01     02     03     07     19     $19,686     1

    ----------

    As Always, I had to fix the numbers, When will the lotteries learn that ALL jackpot games' numbers have and are made up of 2 digits?

    A 1 is not 1, but a "01", ALL jackpot numbers have "Decades" (Tens) and "Centuries" (Hundreds).

    --------

    Anyhow, the Tx Lottery seems to pay no more than about $27,000 and about no less than $4,000 for the jackpot prize.

    That is very low, seeing as the game has almost 1/2 Million combinations.

    A pick 4 game has 10,000 combos and pays $5,000.

    A daily pick 5 game 10x10x10x10x10 has 100,000 combinations and pays $50,000 (I think).

    The payment for cash 5 games is way out of proportion in relation to the total combinations that it has.

    That is also true for the payment for the lower prizes.

    -----

    And no, I have not tried yet myself to see how much I can reduce the combos.

    superb analysis!, thank you LANTERN

    ab actu ad posse valet illatio - from the past one can infer the future

      LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
      Tx
      United States
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      Posted: February 8, 2009, 10:41 pm - IP Logged

      superb analysis!, thank you LANTERN

      Thanks!

      I have not yet played with filter software for jackpot games, but there is a filter that if one knows which of 4 patterns will come out next that one filter should reduce the total combos to 1/10 or fewer, I have not tried it yet, I have been thinking about that filter and many others, one of this days I will play with some filters software for jackpot games and see for real what can be done, one problem that I have always seen is that filters software for jackpot games don't seem to have many right filters, only very very few if any at all, without the right tools only so much reduction can be done.

      Is has more patterns than the 4 ones, but it seems as if very often those 4 patterns are the ones that come out.

      I should try anyway with what is there, little as it might be to see what can be done.

      ----------

      I can't much talk about filters for jackpot games including that one, because of the competition for those prizes, even if I don't play those games, because I might one day.

        LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
        Tx
        United States
        Member #4570
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        Posted: February 8, 2009, 11:09 pm - IP Logged

        Thanks!

        I have not yet played with filter software for jackpot games, but there is a filter that if one knows which of 4 patterns will come out next that one filter should reduce the total combos to 1/10 or fewer, I have not tried it yet, I have been thinking about that filter and many others, one of this days I will play with some filters software for jackpot games and see for real what can be done, one problem that I have always seen is that filters software for jackpot games don't seem to have many right filters, only very very few if any at all, without the right tools only so much reduction can be done.

        Is has more patterns than the 4 ones, but it seems as if very often those 4 patterns are the ones that come out.

        I should try anyway with what is there, little as it might be to see what can be done.

        ----------

        I can't much talk about filters for jackpot games including that one, because of the competition for those prizes, even if I don't play those games, because I might one day.

        Scratch off the last post, for Tx is mostly wrong, there are more fail safe ways of filtering if there was software that had those filters, but jackpot games software I guess, at least the very few that I have seen, have almost no filters.

        Developers seem to know very little about filtration.

          edge's avatar - waveform

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          2204 Posts
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          Posted: February 8, 2009, 11:19 pm - IP Logged

          agree on filter being the key. in fact without it, one might as well abandon whole statistical approach and go with quick picks instead. one definitely need to reduce number of possible outcomes. i tend to (recently) reject previous draw results, and previous pairs (up to given n-day count), work is still on-going , in general though I would (personally) go with short-time span filter and not to dwell on large historical data, but i could be very wrong of course, and of course much deeper filtering mechanisms exists some very sophistcated, and propably hidden from public view although I came across on this website on some pick-3 ideas that went beyond the norm. and of course with the jackpot games filter need to be only successful once!

          ab actu ad posse valet illatio - from the past one can infer the future

            edge's avatar - waveform

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            Member #68609
            December 26, 2008
            2204 Posts
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            Posted: February 8, 2009, 11:25 pm - IP Logged

            agree on filter being the key. in fact without it, one might as well abandon whole statistical approach and go with quick picks instead. one definitely need to reduce number of possible outcomes. i tend to (recently) reject previous draw results, and previous pairs (up to given n-day count), work is still on-going , in general though I would (personally) go with short-time span filter and not to dwell on large historical data, but i could be very wrong of course, and of course much deeper filtering mechanisms exists some very sophistcated, and propably hidden from public view although I came across on this website on some pick-3 ideas that went beyond the norm. and of course with the jackpot games filter need to be only successful once!

            I refered to http://www.lotterypost.com/thread/187687/1205174   (grouping technique in pick 3) its very fascinating, and I admit it is currently beyond me (getting semantics and symbolism right) if i understand it correctly its a "kind of filter", i understand why you focus efforts on P3/P4 s such a deep analysis would be formidable for P5 and beyond.

            ab actu ad posse valet illatio - from the past one can infer the future

              time*treat's avatar - radar

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              Posted: February 8, 2009, 11:30 pm - IP Logged

              I'd be hoppin' mad to finally hit 5/5 only to be paid ...
                   01/08/2009     01     07     27     31     33     $4,128       6Cussing FaceLOL

              In neo-conned Amerika, bank robs you.
              Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms should be the name of a convenience store, not a govnoment agency.

                RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                mid-Ohio
                United States
                Member #9
                March 24, 2001
                19900 Posts
                Online
                Posted: February 8, 2009, 11:33 pm - IP Logged

                "Has anybody ever tried to see how many combos he or she can come out with to win a cash 5 jackpot game at least 50% of the time for sure."

                If you want to win the jackpot 50% of the time, you have to increase your odds of winning to 50%.  For Ohio that would mean playing 287,879 combinations each time.

                Ohio Cash5 is a 5/39 game
                 possible combos of 5 with 39 numbers are 575757
                 MATCH    ODDS                        WINNING COMBOS       PRIZE AMOUNTS
                  5/5     1 : 575757                  1                    JACKPOT $100K+
                  4/5     1 : 3387                    170                     $300
                  3/5     1 : 103                     5610                     $10
                  2/5     1 : 10                      59840                     $1
                 overall odds are 1 : 8.7         expect .1 prizes with 1 chance
                 winning combos 65621 = 11.39 % of possible combos

                Unless you have a strategy to increase your odds of winning by some other way than playing more lines, you would end up spending 5+ times what you would win.

                 * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                   
                             Evil Looking       

                  rcbbuckeye's avatar - Lottery-043.jpg
                  Texas
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                  October 23, 2007
                  5759 Posts
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                  Posted: February 9, 2009, 5:15 pm - IP Logged

                  I only play $1 each day on Cash 5. I usually win about 33% of what I play. You're right about the payout, it's not too good. That's why I only play a buck. It just doesn't pay out enough to play more than that, especially if you do win with someone else and end up splitting the jackpot.As recently as 2005 jackpots were $30,000 and more.

                  I really would like to see Tx start a game like Pa's Quinto. The payout is $50,000 at 100,000 to 1 odds. I would quit Cash 5 in a second for a Pick 5 game. The one benefit Cash 5 has over a game like Quinto is that you will win a few bucks for hitting 2,3, or 4 numbers, where in Quinto you win nothing if all your numbers don't hit.

                    Avatar
                    NASHVILLE, TENN
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                    Posted: February 9, 2009, 8:58 pm - IP Logged

                        It would seem to me that any filter that had a 50 - 50 ratio, such as odd or even sum, would do the trick.  Here in Tennessee "repeat numbers" have a 47% success rate.  47% of the time there will be a repeat number.  Which means that 53% of the time numbers will not repeat.

                         Still far too many combinations to play even should one posses the financial power.  Just filling out 287,000+ slips would be exhausting if not impossible.

                      LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
                      Tx
                      United States
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                      Posted: February 9, 2009, 9:12 pm - IP Logged

                      agree on filter being the key. in fact without it, one might as well abandon whole statistical approach and go with quick picks instead. one definitely need to reduce number of possible outcomes. i tend to (recently) reject previous draw results, and previous pairs (up to given n-day count), work is still on-going , in general though I would (personally) go with short-time span filter and not to dwell on large historical data, but i could be very wrong of course, and of course much deeper filtering mechanisms exists some very sophistcated, and propably hidden from public view although I came across on this website on some pick-3 ideas that went beyond the norm. and of course with the jackpot games filter need to be only successful once!

                      Perhaps you might benefit from some of my old pick 3 filters posts, most of which are on the Lottery Systems forum, use the search feature to find them with, they go back years so use all history when looking for them.

                      Yes, even after so very many filters posts-tutorials there is still some stuff hidden from the public, but not to worry, there on my past posts there is more than enough stuff that can be used.

                      I thought that I should keep just a few things to myself, but every once in a while I reveal some more of them.

                      Filters there are quite a few, the trick is How to best use them? Even myself I don't know many ways of using them, but so far in the past I didn't do too bad, maybe not too good either, but not too bad, I did do better than many others, but not better than all of them.

                      The lenght of the history to use depends on what filters and in which way you want to use them, in some way some can use a short history and in som eother way need a long history, for example pairs, some stuff can only be seen with a very long history like from about 1500 to 3000 past draws, in the past I have used up to a minimum of just 1 past draw for the pick 3, but often I used to use from 1 to 10 past draws, but at first you need to review from 30 to 60 draws, once you get familiar with the past draws for that game then 4 to 10 past draws are enough, but it all depends on how accurate you want to be and in how much you want to reduce.

                      For maximum reduction you need the 3000 past draws and the best possible stats given by a program or programs and then good filter software(s).

                      For quick predictions and not too much reduction 10  to 30 past draws are enough and no stats software, but you still need good filter software.

                      As to jackpot game filtering, well I am not yet very familiar with it, but do have some untested ideas.

                        LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
                        Tx
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                        Posted: February 9, 2009, 9:17 pm - IP Logged

                        I refered to http://www.lotterypost.com/thread/187687/1205174   (grouping technique in pick 3) its very fascinating, and I admit it is currently beyond me (getting semantics and symbolism right) if i understand it correctly its a "kind of filter", i understand why you focus efforts on P3/P4 s such a deep analysis would be formidable for P5 and beyond.

                        Maybe you would understand better if you read my old filters posts.

                        But I tell you, most of sysp34's posts are beyond me, as I don't understand very many of them and or only part of some of them.

                          LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
                          Tx
                          United States
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                          May 4, 2004
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                          Posted: February 9, 2009, 9:22 pm - IP Logged

                          I'd be hoppin' mad to finally hit 5/5 only to be paid ...
                               01/08/2009     01     07     27     31     33     $4,128       6Cussing FaceLOL

                          La Loteria de Tejas esta loca to pay people so little for getting 5 out of 5 almost 1/2 million total combos.

                            LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
                            Tx
                            United States
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                            Posted: February 9, 2009, 9:35 pm - IP Logged

                            "Has anybody ever tried to see how many combos he or she can come out with to win a cash 5 jackpot game at least 50% of the time for sure."

                            If you want to win the jackpot 50% of the time, you have to increase your odds of winning to 50%.  For Ohio that would mean playing 287,879 combinations each time.

                            Ohio Cash5 is a 5/39 game
                             possible combos of 5 with 39 numbers are 575757
                             MATCH    ODDS                        WINNING COMBOS       PRIZE AMOUNTS
                              5/5     1 : 575757                  1                    JACKPOT $100K+
                              4/5     1 : 3387                    170                     $300
                              3/5     1 : 103                     5610                     $10
                              2/5     1 : 10                      59840                     $1
                             overall odds are 1 : 8.7         expect .1 prizes with 1 chance
                             winning combos 65621 = 11.39 % of possible combos

                            Unless you have a strategy to increase your odds of winning by some other way than playing more lines, you would end up spending 5+ times what you would win.

                            That is the SURE way, of course, stats and filters practice don't always make for perfect technique, one might need good insights, one needs to know how to best use stats and filters, one needs to know what prediction is all about and then one needs a lot of practice and yet more insights.

                            On pick 3 often before I was able to overcome the odds, even when playing boxed as I did most often, you are still playing straight, as the game is a straight game no matter how you play it.

                            You can only overcome the odds if you know the game, the stats and the filters.

                            Otherwise win by luck or buy all the possible combos.

                              LANTERN's avatar - kilroy 28_173_reasonably_small.jpg
                              Tx
                              United States
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                              May 4, 2004
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                              Posted: February 9, 2009, 9:45 pm - IP Logged

                              That is the SURE way, of course, stats and filters practice don't always make for perfect technique, one might need good insights, one needs to know how to best use stats and filters, one needs to know what prediction is all about and then one needs a lot of practice and yet more insights.

                              On pick 3 often before I was able to overcome the odds, even when playing boxed as I did most often, you are still playing straight, as the game is a straight game no matter how you play it.

                              You can only overcome the odds if you know the game, the stats and the filters.

                              Otherwise win by luck or buy all the possible combos.

                              As seen on the MM thread at the systems forum, 20 lines are no better than 1 line or a 100 or a 1000, one must use as many lines as needed in accord with the prediction technique used, if your prediction technique produces 12 000 lines then use them, if it produces 1000 then use them if only 100 then use that, whatever comes out in accord with whatever technique is used, if you technique does not produce 4 of 5 or 5 of 5 why bother with it?

                              Unless you win $2 or $9 or whatever often enough and you play 1 or 2 lines per draw only.

                              So long as you don't lose too much, it is O.K. I guess, but at $20 per each draw, that might be a little too much, for me anyway.

                              It all depends if you are making a profit or not or at least not losing too much.