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Litigation Proofing your lottery pool

Topic closed. 30 replies. Last post 4 years ago by wwnerd.

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April 17, 2013
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Posted: April 17, 2013, 4:42 pm - IP Logged

I have read several postings related to naysayers in regards to large lottery pools

With help from the past stories I have read on this great website, I think I have refined a "litigation proof" system I have been using for more than 3 years with a lottery pool that varies currently between 42 and 46 co-workers.

Scan all tickets and email them to participants "before" the first drawing. Include yourself in the group mailing and create a          folder and archive all, to show proof that these were sent out to each individual. The key here is to also include an email to the individual(s) who may not have participated in the "current" drawing, but have previously. Just create a "distribution" list for all.

Each participants name is also typed at the bottom of each scanned sheet (I keep a template) with copies of the tickets. Everyone on the list knows who "is" or "is not" in the current drawing. The subject of the sent email reads "check your names". You can do a "read receipt" for the true paranoids. If their has been a mistake, you should hear back from the individual. For individuals who never miss a "buy in" there is not a problem, but I have archived emails that historically show their are 4 turdheads that can't manage to remember 90% of the people at their employment is in a lottery pool. I am seriously considering implementing 3 strikes rule. Miss 3 times and you're out for 6 months.

Keep a printed list of all players to carry with you when you collect your money. When you start your pool, make it clear you will not accept their money unless you have the list with you and they see you check their name off (this originally started with a pre-printed 2 inch receipt that simply read "Lotto june 6 to July 12, $20 buy in" and I would simply initial the paper and exchange for their $20). It's not always a matter of trust but possible human error (mine).

At the top of each name list/lottery scan template it reads "Next buy in date is June *%th". I will also send out a distribution friendly email reminder the Saturday before. This is not necessary but it pretty much eliminates the "I forgot".

The winnings become tricky (especially because of the 4 turdheads). I have to drive out of state for my lotto so I do not feel guilty keeping some gas money. If we win $91 dollars, I will buy $60 in a "winnings buy". At the bottom of my template sheet it will read, "we won $91 bucks, here is 60 more tickets. 67 cents each for gas/lunch" ($31/46 people). I account for every penny and clearly notify all. I always keep less than $1 a person for gas/lunch. The object here is not necessarily to get gas money because I am going anyway but to smash the turdheads in court when they ask "how do I know my share of the $31 wasn't used to buy the future winning ticket".

I only buy "winnings tickets once". If we win off previous winnings ticket, I kill it with the gas/luch scenario. I do not carry over more than once. I have to think of the 4 turdheads crying because they will be in once skip once, in once skip once (arrrrgh) and we may hit. If it ever becomes a notable win over $80 (winings from winnings blah blah), I'll hand everyone their $2. Never happened yet in 3 years.

I also scan all payout receipts that print out when cashier scans tickets and send to players. Serial numbers match with tickets.

When I buy personal tickets, I always buy in increments "not" divisible by 20. Not that it should matter because everyone has copies of their tickets before the first drawing.

Does this seem like a hassle, maybe, but "only" because of the 4 turdheads. Templates are already made and I have a distribution email list. It's just a matter of deleting/adding one or more of the 4 names and scanning tickets every month.

Is it worth it "yes" because I don't have $900 a month to increase my chances of winning by 10 fold and I'm not greedy.

I would be happy(er) with a private island but living debt free and/or retiring early sounds good too.

But dreaming of myself and my 42 friends (sometimes 46) giving a simultaneous "finger to the man" makes it all worth it.

    Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

    Bahamas
    Member #133462
    September 30, 2012
    5946 Posts
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    Posted: April 17, 2013, 4:53 pm - IP Logged

    "Litigation proof" ?

     

    As a treat, I should fax a copy of this post to every law office in New York as Joke of the Day of course. They will shoot back with 100 different ways from Sunday that they'll earn their 33% or maybe surprise you if and when your pool ever wins.

     

    As for purchasing a greater number of tickets to increase your chances, sometimes LESS is more.

    "Everything works  ONCE!"


      United States
      Member #130815
      July 25, 2012
      1636 Posts
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      Posted: April 17, 2013, 6:05 pm - IP Logged

      Explain again how on the day you bought the tickets the one you bought for youself was not paid for by the pool money...I think a judge may err on the side of caution and make you split it

        Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

        Bahamas
        Member #133462
        September 30, 2012
        5946 Posts
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        Posted: April 17, 2013, 6:12 pm - IP Logged

        If the annuity value was around 100m when the pool won, divide that into 42 after state and federal taxes and what's left? Enough for a 30 day European vacation? Maybe new tires for the pick up truck on top of that? I think if the dollars are stretched the pool can go out for a celebratory dinner.

         

        If that's life-changing then go for broke! Crazy

        "Everything works  ONCE!"

          savagegoose's avatar - ProfilePho
          adelaide sa
          Australia
          Member #37136
          April 11, 2006
          3316 Posts
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          Posted: April 17, 2013, 6:31 pm - IP Logged

          sounds ok, but i have 2 questions. " Is this on company time? " and  " why bother going solo sounds easier? "

          2014 = -1016; 2015= -1409; 2016  = -1171; 2017 = ?  TOT =  -3596

          keno historic = -2291 ; 2015= -603; 2016= -424; 2017 = ? TOT = - 3318

            noise-gate's avatar - images q=tbn:ANd9GcR91HDs4UJhjxO7cmeMQWZ5lB_FOcMLOGicau4V74R45tDgPWrr
            Bay Area - California
            United States
            Member #136477
            December 12, 2012
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            Posted: April 17, 2013, 6:33 pm - IP Logged

            I have read several postings related to naysayers in regards to large lottery pools

            With help from the past stories I have read on this great website, I think I have refined a "litigation proof" system I have been using for more than 3 years with a lottery pool that varies currently between 42 and 46 co-workers.

            Scan all tickets and email them to participants "before" the first drawing. Include yourself in the group mailing and create a          folder and archive all, to show proof that these were sent out to each individual. The key here is to also include an email to the individual(s) who may not have participated in the "current" drawing, but have previously. Just create a "distribution" list for all.

            Each participants name is also typed at the bottom of each scanned sheet (I keep a template) with copies of the tickets. Everyone on the list knows who "is" or "is not" in the current drawing. The subject of the sent email reads "check your names". You can do a "read receipt" for the true paranoids. If their has been a mistake, you should hear back from the individual. For individuals who never miss a "buy in" there is not a problem, but I have archived emails that historically show their are 4 turdheads that can't manage to remember 90% of the people at their employment is in a lottery pool. I am seriously considering implementing 3 strikes rule. Miss 3 times and you're out for 6 months.

            Keep a printed list of all players to carry with you when you collect your money. When you start your pool, make it clear you will not accept their money unless you have the list with you and they see you check their name off (this originally started with a pre-printed 2 inch receipt that simply read "Lotto june 6 to July 12, $20 buy in" and I would simply initial the paper and exchange for their $20). It's not always a matter of trust but possible human error (mine).

            At the top of each name list/lottery scan template it reads "Next buy in date is June *%th". I will also send out a distribution friendly email reminder the Saturday before. This is not necessary but it pretty much eliminates the "I forgot".

            The winnings become tricky (especially because of the 4 turdheads). I have to drive out of state for my lotto so I do not feel guilty keeping some gas money. If we win $91 dollars, I will buy $60 in a "winnings buy". At the bottom of my template sheet it will read, "we won $91 bucks, here is 60 more tickets. 67 cents each for gas/lunch" ($31/46 people). I account for every penny and clearly notify all. I always keep less than $1 a person for gas/lunch. The object here is not necessarily to get gas money because I am going anyway but to smash the turdheads in court when they ask "how do I know my share of the $31 wasn't used to buy the future winning ticket".

            I only buy "winnings tickets once". If we win off previous winnings ticket, I kill it with the gas/luch scenario. I do not carry over more than once. I have to think of the 4 turdheads crying because they will be in once skip once, in once skip once (arrrrgh) and we may hit. If it ever becomes a notable win over $80 (winings from winnings blah blah), I'll hand everyone their $2. Never happened yet in 3 years.

            I also scan all payout receipts that print out when cashier scans tickets and send to players. Serial numbers match with tickets.

            When I buy personal tickets, I always buy in increments "not" divisible by 20. Not that it should matter because everyone has copies of their tickets before the first drawing.

            Does this seem like a hassle, maybe, but "only" because of the 4 turdheads. Templates are already made and I have a distribution email list. It's just a matter of deleting/adding one or more of the 4 names and scanning tickets every month.

            Is it worth it "yes" because I don't have $900 a month to increase my chances of winning by 10 fold and I'm not greedy.

            I would be happy(er) with a private island but living debt free and/or retiring early sounds good too.

            But dreaming of myself and my 42 friends (sometimes 46) giving a simultaneous "finger to the man" makes it all worth it.

            I call that a thorough CYA & DAMA protection program.
            DAMA: Don't Ask Me Anything.
            Dance

            ** People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.
            George Bernard Shaw.

              helpmewin's avatar - dandy
              u$a
              United States
              Member #106665
              February 22, 2011
              19964 Posts
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              Posted: April 17, 2013, 6:38 pm - IP Logged

              Wow i clearing didn't read all of that Eek

              but i guess you must have everything under controlGroup Hug

              Let it Snow Snowman

                rdgrnr's avatar - walt
                Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
                United States
                Member #73904
                April 28, 2009
                14903 Posts
                Offline
                Posted: April 17, 2013, 7:56 pm - IP Logged

                I have read several postings related to naysayers in regards to large lottery pools

                With help from the past stories I have read on this great website, I think I have refined a "litigation proof" system I have been using for more than 3 years with a lottery pool that varies currently between 42 and 46 co-workers.

                Scan all tickets and email them to participants "before" the first drawing. Include yourself in the group mailing and create a          folder and archive all, to show proof that these were sent out to each individual. The key here is to also include an email to the individual(s) who may not have participated in the "current" drawing, but have previously. Just create a "distribution" list for all.

                Each participants name is also typed at the bottom of each scanned sheet (I keep a template) with copies of the tickets. Everyone on the list knows who "is" or "is not" in the current drawing. The subject of the sent email reads "check your names". You can do a "read receipt" for the true paranoids. If their has been a mistake, you should hear back from the individual. For individuals who never miss a "buy in" there is not a problem, but I have archived emails that historically show their are 4 turdheads that can't manage to remember 90% of the people at their employment is in a lottery pool. I am seriously considering implementing 3 strikes rule. Miss 3 times and you're out for 6 months.

                Keep a printed list of all players to carry with you when you collect your money. When you start your pool, make it clear you will not accept their money unless you have the list with you and they see you check their name off (this originally started with a pre-printed 2 inch receipt that simply read "Lotto june 6 to July 12, $20 buy in" and I would simply initial the paper and exchange for their $20). It's not always a matter of trust but possible human error (mine).

                At the top of each name list/lottery scan template it reads "Next buy in date is June *%th". I will also send out a distribution friendly email reminder the Saturday before. This is not necessary but it pretty much eliminates the "I forgot".

                The winnings become tricky (especially because of the 4 turdheads). I have to drive out of state for my lotto so I do not feel guilty keeping some gas money. If we win $91 dollars, I will buy $60 in a "winnings buy". At the bottom of my template sheet it will read, "we won $91 bucks, here is 60 more tickets. 67 cents each for gas/lunch" ($31/46 people). I account for every penny and clearly notify all. I always keep less than $1 a person for gas/lunch. The object here is not necessarily to get gas money because I am going anyway but to smash the turdheads in court when they ask "how do I know my share of the $31 wasn't used to buy the future winning ticket".

                I only buy "winnings tickets once". If we win off previous winnings ticket, I kill it with the gas/luch scenario. I do not carry over more than once. I have to think of the 4 turdheads crying because they will be in once skip once, in once skip once (arrrrgh) and we may hit. If it ever becomes a notable win over $80 (winings from winnings blah blah), I'll hand everyone their $2. Never happened yet in 3 years.

                I also scan all payout receipts that print out when cashier scans tickets and send to players. Serial numbers match with tickets.

                When I buy personal tickets, I always buy in increments "not" divisible by 20. Not that it should matter because everyone has copies of their tickets before the first drawing.

                Does this seem like a hassle, maybe, but "only" because of the 4 turdheads. Templates are already made and I have a distribution email list. It's just a matter of deleting/adding one or more of the 4 names and scanning tickets every month.

                Is it worth it "yes" because I don't have $900 a month to increase my chances of winning by 10 fold and I'm not greedy.

                I would be happy(er) with a private island but living debt free and/or retiring early sounds good too.

                But dreaming of myself and my 42 friends (sometimes 46) giving a simultaneous "finger to the man" makes it all worth it.

                Taking your friends winnings to pay for your gas and lunch?

                Whoa.

                And buying "personal tickets" too?

                You run the kind of pool everybody here warns people not to join.

                And for good reason.


                                                             
                                     
                                                         

                 

                 

                 

                 

                                                                                                                   

                "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"

                                                                                                            --Edmund Burke

                 

                 

                  Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

                  Bahamas
                  Member #133462
                  September 30, 2012
                  5946 Posts
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                  Posted: April 17, 2013, 8:06 pm - IP Logged

                  Taking your friends winnings to pay for your gas and lunch?

                  Whoa.

                  And buying "personal tickets" too?

                  You run the kind of pool everybody here warns people not to join.

                  And for good reason.

                  Great catch Ridge. I didn't make it down that far.

                   

                  Therein lies the first loophole. If he/she wins, the pool will argue he/she took liberties with their money or is that in black and white as well?

                  "Everything works  ONCE!"

                    rdgrnr's avatar - walt
                    Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
                    United States
                    Member #73904
                    April 28, 2009
                    14903 Posts
                    Offline
                    Posted: April 17, 2013, 8:17 pm - IP Logged

                    Great catch Ridge. I didn't make it down that far.

                     

                    Therein lies the first loophole. If he/she wins, the pool will argue he/she took liberties with their money or is that in black and white as well?

                    Oh, he's got it all in there.

                    Bullet-proof, lol.


                                                                 
                                         
                                                             

                     

                     

                     

                     

                                                                                                                       

                    "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"

                                                                                                                --Edmund Burke

                     

                     

                      Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

                      Bahamas
                      Member #133462
                      September 30, 2012
                      5946 Posts
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                      Posted: April 17, 2013, 10:18 pm - IP Logged

                      Oh, he's got it all in there.

                      Bullet-proof, lol.

                      LOL

                      "Everything works  ONCE!"

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                        NY
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                        October 16, 2005
                        3501 Posts
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                        Posted: April 18, 2013, 2:22 am - IP Logged

                        There is no such thing as litigation proof. Suing you requires a filing fee, not a winnable case.  Of course if you should happen to win when the 4 "turdheads" weren't participating you can expect that they will definitely be suing you. The same is probably true of anyone else who didn't pay for that drawing. The most that you can hope for is that you've done enough to be sure that anyone suing you doesn't have a good case.

                        If you don't have a written contract that clearly explains procedures for excluding people you can expect to be sued, and there's a chance you'll lose. If you don't have a written contract that clearly explains procedures for buying group vs personal tickets you can expect to be sued, and there's a chance you'll lose. If you deviate from your written rules you can expect to be sued, and there's a chance you'll lose.

                        It should go without saying that you should permanently dump anyone who consistently gives you problems.

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                          Posted: April 18, 2013, 5:43 am - IP Logged

                          If everyone pitches in 20 and I buy 10 separate for myself, and they have all scanned copies of tickets (46X20=920) before the first drawing. How can it be argued the 10 tickets weren't separate?

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                            Posted: April 18, 2013, 5:46 am - IP Logged

                            Even if they take 54% taxes, it's still a million each. That is one hell of a month long vacation, 4 tires and dinner. Really?

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                              Posted: April 18, 2013, 5:48 am - IP Logged

                              At shift change. Because 920 chances are better than 20