Can Lottery Ball Machines Cheat - Be RIGGED ?Prev Topic Next Topic

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destinycreation

South Carolina
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Feb 25, 2014, 11:14 am

In the back of my mind, I have never believed that the Lottery is random, particularly Ball Machines. It's just a "funny feeling" that I have, called my Deeper Intuition, that should NEVER BE IGNORED.

That being said, is it possible that these so called Random Ball Machines, can be Computerized without the public knowing it, in such a manner that the Ball Machine can somehow ATTRACT the balls that the hidden computer determines should be drawn.

Those balls would be the number combinations that have been played the Least in the state, on that date, for that particular drawing [Midday or Evening]. These balls would be ATTRACTED by the machine via Weighed Balls or Magnetic Balls, or some other Hidden Manner in which the Ball Machine is programmed to draw computerized pre-determined particular numbers, i.e. suck up the balls.

What I am trying to say, is that I do not believe that those Lottery Balls are HOLLOW, and Randomly sucked up into the Ball Machine. There may be some hidden way in which those Balls are selected by the Ball Machine, which may be computerized. This process appears to be a Random drawing, because that is what the State Lottery Commission wants the Public to believe. This is what WE want to believe, to make it seem as if there is some "fairness" in this process of playing the Lottery, but perhaps we should all have a Real "Reality Check".

Any Game of Chance can be Rigged in any manner, even Legally Rigged !!!! To believe otherwise, would be foolish, lacking in common sense.

If the public knew that Lottery Ball Machines were actually somehow computerized, people would be trying to HACK into the Hidden Computer. Then we would have a problem. This would destroy the Illusion of Fairness, and the Lottery would Cease to Exist.

Therefore, I guess we have to continue to make believe that the Lottery is Random, and play into the Facade, so that everyone can benefit from the DELUSION.
Lucky Loser

Texas
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Feb 25, 2014, 11:57 am
Quote: Originally posted by destinycreation on Feb 25, 2014
In the back of my mind, I have never believed that the Lottery is random, particularly Ball Machines. It's just a "funny feeling" that I have, called my Deeper Intuition, that should NEVER BE IGNORED.

That being said, is it possible that these so called Random Ball Machines, can be Computerized without the public knowing it, in such a manner that the Ball Machine can somehow ATTRACT the balls that the hidden computer determines should be drawn.

Those balls would be the number combinations that have been played the Least in the state, on that date, for that particular drawing [Midday or Evening]. These balls would be ATTRACTED by the machine via Weighed Balls or Magnetic Balls, or some other Hidden Manner in which the Ball Machine is programmed to draw computerized pre-determined particular numbers, i.e. suck up the balls.

What I am trying to say, is that I do not believe that those Lottery Balls are HOLLOW, and Randomly sucked up into the Ball Machine. There may be some hidden way in which those Balls are selected by the Ball Machine, which may be computerized. This process appears to be a Random drawing, because that is what the State Lottery Commission wants the Public to believe. This is what WE want to believe, to make it seem as if there is some "fairness" in this process of playing the Lottery, but perhaps we should all have a Real "Reality Check".

Any Game of Chance can be Rigged in any manner, even Legally Rigged !!!! To believe otherwise, would be foolish, lacking in common sense.

If the public knew that Lottery Ball Machines were actually somehow computerized, people would be trying to HACK into the Hidden Computer. Then we would have a problem. This would destroy the Illusion of Fairness, and the Lottery would Cease to Exist.

Therefore, I guess we have to continue to make believe that the Lottery is Random, and play into the Facade, so that everyone can benefit from the DELUSION.
He he...I hear and know exactly what you're sayin'. To be very honest, I'm gonna say the same thing I've said about this for years after I learned of all the protocols and failsafes they use just to draw three (or more in the case of larger games) balls. The lotteries purchase their ball sets from independent manufacturers and they're supposed to already be weighed/balanced, fully inspected, quality assured, and free of any defects which would cause any bias to a draw. This also applies to the machines used to draw those same balls. With all this in mind and all the money spent on such sophisticated equipment, I still see big problem just as you do.

This operation isn't random in any sense of the word. You don't conduct pre-tests or post-tests on equpipment you've already spent thousands of dollars on that's already tested and approved for you by professionals in that business. But, no, they conduct all these tests before and after each and every draw...FOR WHAT REASON? Let's take a good look at the definition of RANDOM:

ran·dom
'rand?m/
adjective

1.

made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

"a random sample of 100 households"

synonyms: unsystematic, unmethodical, arbitrary, unplanned, undirected, casual,indiscriminate, nonspecific, haphazard, stray, erratic; More

2.

informal

odd, unusual, or unexpected.

"I find it impossible to not laugh at such a random guy"

Now, as far as I can tell, none of these apply to lottery drawings...at all. They are all pre-planned to have pre-tests, they are directed, expected, systematic, and are chosen with a method or conscious decision. Well, hell, they say one thing and do just the complete opposite...just like the government. If these drawings were truly random, they'd simply fire up the machine and let 'er rip...whatever happens just happens and there are no pre or post tests. That's random in my book but, it's way too much like right for them.

You know, I really hate it when folks try and impose on...tread on my intelligence.

L.L.
Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....

There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.

#lotto-4-a-living
rcbbuckeye

100

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Feb 25, 2014, 12:10 pm

Well.......

using just a little common sense.....

just for fun, take a look at the odds of any game, especially any jackpot game.

With odds we are playing at, they don't need to rig anything.

But....... to each his own.......conspiracy.

CAN'T WIN IF YOU'RE NOT IN

A DOLLAR AND A DREAM (OR $2)
mrcraft

Los Angeles, California
United States
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Feb 25, 2014, 12:13 pm

It's been done before.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Pennsylvania_Lottery_scandal
LottoMetro

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Feb 25, 2014, 12:17 pm

The first thing losing players scream, "It's rigged!" The truth is, there's no need for it to be rigged. The odds do their job— taking your money.

I know I'm spitting in the wind on this, but the whole point of pre-tests is to make sure the ball sets and machine are performing randomly. Sure it would be great to just start up the machine and have a go, but not if someone has sneaked in there and swapped out the balls. Right? The lottery uses outside contractors for their balls and machines, and what a PR disaster it would be if a manufacturer rigged the balls or machine but the lottery never tested it to make sure it was right. By doing pre-tests they can detect any bias, use an alternate ball set if necessary, and AVOID another 1980 incident. This whole notion of 'messing with the randomness', or 'flow of numbers' is complete nonsense. That's like saying the drawing is affected because the balls were dropped in a different order. The balls are blown around for a full minute before being drawn. Each machine is calibrated differently (depending on number of balls usually), but there is no way of getting specific balls to show up, unless of course the balls are flawed. And that is detected during pre-tests.

The only possibly rigged drawings I can think of today would be RNG, and that would likely be unintentional but rather a software glitch.

If the chances of winning the jackpot are so slim, why play when the jackpot is so small? Your chances never change, but the potential payoff does.
If a crystal ball showed you the future of the rest of your life, and in that future you will never win a jackpot, would you still play?

P&L % = Total Win($)/Total Wager($) - 1
Jon D

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Feb 25, 2014, 12:34 pm

Quote: Originally posted by mrcraft on Feb 25, 2014
It's been done before.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_Pennsylvania_Lottery_scandal

Yeah, the Triple Six Fix is well known among lottery players. But it's also an ameteurish and ultimately a fail as far as a rigged lottery draw goes.

This whole deal about carefully calibrated machines, weighed and measured balls, etc., is just smoke and mirrors. It's a red herring. Only an amateur would try and rig the draw this way.

A better way of rigging has nothing to do with tampering with the balls or machine, but involves WHEN the wager is placed, such as placing a wager AFTER the draw has been completed. So called late betting or other time shifting frauds have been committed before in the lottery, and probably will again.

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/165830

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/248809
CDanaT

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Feb 25, 2014, 12:40 pm

Quote: Originally posted by rcbbuckeye on Feb 25, 2014
Well.......

using just a little common sense.....

just for fun, take a look at the odds of any game, especially any jackpot game.

With odds we are playing at, they don't need to rig anything.

But....... to each his own.......conspiracy.

RCB, I have to concur with your statement. I respect the poster of this thread and Lucky's statement as well. We will always have doubt in anything that is done/created by mankind. There are ALWAYS those folks that are going to express "conspiracy" to anything, especially with money !...and I respect that right to do so....There does come a time where you have to reasonably believe that something is created, without malice or without intentional deception for the purpose of providing an ending neutral result. With folks winning 7 figure prizes all over the country every single week, I have to lean towards "non corruption" with the system that's in place. If we can improve/change something to being 100%(like death and taxes) I am absolutely supportive. If we can't, then we should learn to accept what is currently at hand....But, that's just MHO

Si vis pacem, para bellum.
Stack47

Kentucky
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Feb 25, 2014, 2:04 pm

Quote: Originally posted by Jon D on Feb 25, 2014
Yeah, the Triple Six Fix is well known among lottery players. But it's also an ameteurish and ultimately a fail as far as a rigged lottery draw goes.

This whole deal about carefully calibrated machines, weighed and measured balls, etc., is just smoke and mirrors. It's a red herring. Only an amateur would try and rig the draw this way.

A better way of rigging has nothing to do with tampering with the balls or machine, but involves WHEN the wager is placed, such as placing a wager AFTER the draw has been completed. So called late betting or other time shifting frauds have been committed before in the lottery, and probably will again.

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/165830

https://www.lotterypost.com/news/248809

"A better way of rigging has nothing to do with tampering with the balls or machine, but involves WHEN the wager is placed, such as placing a wager AFTER the draw has been completed."

It's possible a lottery could past post once a month (maybe to make their monthly payroll?), but it's much easier to take the money from the unclaimed prize fund. To have a decent conspiracy theory, we need a legitimate reason why any state lottery would cheat and take the chance of killing their cash cow.

There are over 175 million possible PB combinations and 96.875% of those combos win nothing in every drawing, but players are standing in line and paying two bucks a ticket. There is a greed factor, but being that greedy defies logic.
chrissy16

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Feb 25, 2014, 2:16 pm

Majority of the drawings are conducted just the way it is depicted in this NC Lottery video. As you can see, the balls are totally protected and have been examined. Moreover, alot of them have excellent Internal Control of the process, meaning no one ever has dual jobs in the Lottery.. If something like this was to occur, it is more likely that it would come from a rouge employee. I don't don't think anyone once to be charged of a felony.
bigbear29

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Feb 25, 2014, 2:20 pm

I agree, it does not appear to be truly random. I see people saying why would the lottery rig the game? I say, why would Wall St. rig their trading/funds, GREED! I believe anything can be rigged. If you watch the powerball drawing on tv, can you say that the balls are picked from that big bowl of balls, no. You can not see that, all you see is the balls being lifted.

See for yourself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDv9nGUhmL4
Jon D

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Feb 25, 2014, 2:21 pm

Quote: Originally posted by Stack47 on Feb 25, 2014
"A better way of rigging has nothing to do with tampering with the balls or machine, but involves WHEN the wager is placed, such as placing a wager AFTER the draw has been completed."

It's possible a lottery could past post once a month (maybe to make their monthly payroll?), but it's much easier to take the money from the unclaimed prize fund. To have a decent conspiracy theory, we need a legitimate reason why any state lottery would cheat and take the chance of killing their cash cow.

There are over 175 million possible PB combinations and 96.875% of those combos win nothing in every drawing, but players are standing in line and paying two bucks a ticket. There is a greed factor, but being that greedy defies logic.

To have a decent conspiracy theory, we need a legitimate reason why any state lottery would cheat and take the chance of killing their cash cow.

You've hit the nail on the head there. We see threads of people complaining all the time about rigged draws, and about the lottery intentionally drawing least picked combos and creating rollovers, etc. Now that has got the be the absolte WORST REASON EVER to commit fraud in the lottery, just so the lottery can get a little more profit!?

For one thing, the lottery isn't supposed to make a profit. It's more like a non-profit. It has to payout excess funds taken in to either additional pubic benefit funding, or extra bonus draws/prizes, etc.

No, for a rigged draw, there needs to be personal greed involved. Where a person or persons stands to be personally enriched to the tune of millions of dollars by the draw outcome going their way. As was the case in many past lottery fraud incidents.

Now, if the lottery director stood to gain a $5,000,000 bonus or something if the profits exceeded a certain level, well then yeah, maybe personal greed would be involved. Otherwise as you said, it's probably easier to steal from the unclaimed prize fund than to try and rig the draw.
chrissy16

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Feb 25, 2014, 2:22 pm

Quote: Originally posted by Jon D on Feb 25, 2014
To have a decent conspiracy theory, we need a legitimate reason why any state lottery would cheat and take the chance of killing their cash cow.

You've hit the nail on the head there. We see threads of people complaining all the time about rigged draws, and about the lottery intentionally drawing least picked combos and creating rollovers, etc. Now that has got the be the absolte WORST REASON EVER to commit fraud in the lottery, just so the lottery can get a little more profit!?

For one thing, the lottery isn't supposed to make a profit. It's more like a non-profit. It has to payout excess funds taken in to either additional pubic benefit funding, or extra bonus draws/prizes, etc.

No, for a rigged draw, there needs to be personal greed involved. Where a person or persons stands to be personally enriched to the tune of millions of dollars by the draw outcome going their way. As was the case in many past lottery fraud incidents.

Now, if the lottery director stood to gain a $5,000,000 bonus or something if the profits exceeded a certain level, well then yeah, maybe personal greed would be involved. Otherwise as you said, it's probably easier to steal from the unclaimed prize fund than to try and rig the draw.
maringoman

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Feb 25, 2014, 5:15 pm

Can Lottery Ball Machines Cheat - Be RIGGED ?

NO. I believe them when they say that they audit the balls and weigh them and the draw room is under high surveilance blah blah blah

What concerns me is the number of pre draws. Are they consistent in every draw? If not, what is it that they are looking for?

That money's gone fo ever
Lucky Loser

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Feb 25, 2014, 5:31 pm

Quote: Originally posted by maringoman on Feb 25, 2014
Can Lottery Ball Machines Cheat - Be RIGGED ?

NO. I believe them when they say that they audit the balls and weigh them and the draw room is under high surveilance blah blah blah

What concerns me is the number of pre draws. Are they consistent in every draw? If not, what is it that they are looking for?

What concerns me is the number of pre draws. Are they consistent in every draw? If not, what is it that they are looking for?

My point(s) exactly. This is also why I geared up my response towards all the rigamarole they go through just to draw 'X' number of balls for a winning combination to be posted. Let's take a look at the casinos at how they 'roll'...literally. Roulette...they don't spin the table 4-5 times before allowing the ball to land. Craps...he or she doesn't throw the dice out there 4-5 times before allowing them to land on their respective numbers. Black Jack...the dealer doesn't shuffle and deal 4-5 times before dealing an actual hand to play on.

Many more examples where those come from as well. People can say what they want and give these lotteries a pass, but the whole deal makes absolutely no sense to me. This has been my argument for years and always will be...because it's perfectly legit and reasonable.

L.L.

Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....

There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.

#lotto-4-a-living
bluerain

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Feb 25, 2014, 6:53 pm

I HAVE BEEN PLAYING PICK 3 FOR 35YRS JERSY,AND BASCICALLY IT BOILS DOWN TO THIS, I PLAY MAINLY DOUBLES EASEIR TO TRACK THERE ARE ONLY 10 DOUBLES, I TRACK ALL THE DIGITS EVERYDAY IN EACH POSITION,,,, MIDDAY AND EVENING, AND ALSO TRACK EACH DIGIT IN COMBINED GAME, I USE PAST HISTORY OF THE DOUBLES,HOW LONG EACH DOUBLE DID NOT SHOW,, I CHART EACH DIGIT LAST HIT HOW LONG OUT IN EACH GAME MIDDAY EVE, AND COMBINED GET THE PIC? EVERY DAY EACH GAME AND COMBINED, I CHECK THE PAST 14 DRAWS HOW THE DIGITS ARE RUNNING,FOR REF TODAY MORN N.J. I HIT 353 WHEELED 3TIMES 3 TIMES BOX, LAST WEEK IN THE MORN THE 3 HIT 1 TIME THE 5 HIT 0 TIMES,,WHEN I DID MY DIGIT CHECK FOR THE MORN, FOR THE PAST 6 MORN DRAWS THE 5 AND 3 WHERE STILL THE COLDEST DIGITS FOR MORN, SO I WHEELED 553 AND 533 AND ST AND BOX, AND WON, TWO WEEKS AGO THE SAME HAPPENED, 929, I WON. SEE WHAT I DO IS LIMIT MY PLAY ABOUT 4 NUMBERS DOUBLES ONLY, I DONT PLAY EVERY DAY,, ONLY WHEN I SEE A GOOD PICS OF THE RUNNING DIGITS, GOOD LUCK

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