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Mathematical Sequences

Topic closed. 49 replies. Last post 12 years ago by RJOh.

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ayenowitall's avatar - rod serling4.jpg

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Posted: May 22, 2004, 6:46 am - IP Logged

I really appreciate the attention that this mathematical sequences topic has received. Much thanks to all who have made meaningful contributions related to mathematical sequences. I hope you will all continue to offer your input on mathematical sequences. An occasional tangential remark is understandable, but this topic is really about mathematical sequences. We have a great group of people here at Lottery Post, and I'm sure that there must be considerable knowledge about mathematical sequences. I'm looking forward to learning more about mathematical sequences from those who have such knowledge.

Also, we all make typographical errors from time to time, but gross misspellings that occur repeatedly reflect poorly on the writer's intelligence and credibility. They are also quite an annoying distraction. There is a Spell Check function available.

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    Wheaton
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    Posted: May 22, 2004, 7:47 am - IP Logged

    Also, we all make typographical errors from time to time, but gross misspellings that occur repeatedly reflect poorly on the writer's intelligence and credibility. They are also quite an annoying distraction. There is a Spell Check function available.

    ==============================================

    How is it that you equate someone's misspellings with intelligence? I mean that's a pretty lousy insinuation to make. Perhaps there is another variable you hadn't considered. One that gives credibility to the content rather than the syntax. Maybe the keys don't all work. Maybe they type with a stick strapped to there head because of some hindering accident.  I don't know, maybe they just cant spell. But to make a determination like that because its "quite an annoying distraction" brings many more questionable thoughts about ones character than poor spelling does of ones intelligence.

    That's like if I said that people from Louisville KY talk funny, they must all be ignorant hicks. One would hope that we all had the intelligence to see past such meaninglessness. It also makes me wonder about your credibility. If your so easy to assume such a thing without considering or investigating the possible reasons for it. How is one to be assured that you consider a larger set of possibilities in your mathematical sequences

      hypersoniq's avatar - 8ball
      Pennsylvania
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      Posted: May 22, 2004, 10:02 am - IP Logged
      Quote: Originally posted by ayenowitall on May 22, 2004



      I really appreciate the attention that this mathematical sequences topic has received. Much thanks to all who have made meaningful contributions related to mathematical sequences. I hope you will all continue to offer your input on mathematical sequences. An occasional tangential remark is understandable, but this topic is really about mathematical sequences. We have a great group of people here at Lottery Post, and I'm sure that there must be considerable knowledge about mathematical sequences. I'm looking forward to learning more about mathematical sequences from those who have such knowledge.

      Also, we all make typographical errors from time to time, but gross misspellings that occur repeatedly reflect poorly on the writer's intelligence and credibility. They are also quite an annoying distraction. There is a Spell Check function available.





      sorry bout the O.T. posts...

      here's something interesting...

      Mathematical mysteries: Hailstone sequences


      This problem is easy to describe but it is one of mathematics' unsolved problems.

      Starting with any positive integer n, form a sequence in the following way:

      If n is even, divide it by 2 to give n' = n/2.
      If n is odd, multiply it by 3 and add 1 to give n' = 3n + 1.
      Then take n' as the new starting number and repeat the process. For example:

      n = 5 gives the sequence
      5, 16, 8, 4, 2, 1, 4, 2, 1,...
      n = 11 gives the sequence
      11, 34, 17, 52, 26, 13, 40, 20, 10, 5, 16, 8, 4, 2, 1, 4, 2, 1,...
      These are sometimes called "Hailstone sequences" because they go up and down just like a hailstone in a cloud before crashing to Earth - the endless cycle 4, 2, 1, 4, 2, 1. It seems from experiment that such a sequence will always dventually end in this repeating cycle 4, 2, 1, 4, 2, 1,... and so on, but some values for N generate many values before the repeating cycle begins. For example, try starting with n = 27. See if you can find starting values that generate even longer sequences.

      An unsolved problem is, can it be proved that every starting value will generate a sequence that dventually settles to 4, 2, 1, 4, 2, 1,...? Could there be a sequence that never settles down to a repeating cycle at all?

      Playing more than one ticket per game is betting against yourself.

        ayenowitall's avatar - rod serling4.jpg

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        Posted: May 22, 2004, 2:16 pm - IP Logged

        hypersoniq,

        There's no need to apologize. Actually, some of those off-topic posts were interesting, but I just didn't want the matter of mathematical sequences to get altogether lost in the shuffle. Maybe you can start up a thread about the other things if there seems to sufficient interest.

        Thanks for the information about the Hailstone sequences. I've got some numbers that I'm dying to plug in.  Those longtime unsolved problems usually stay that way, but the prospect of finding a solution holds a certain allure. In this case, it could be that it unlocks the secret to consistently beating the lotteries. I'll surely play around with it for a while to give it a shot. I've stumbled across a number of mathematical sequences since I started fooling around with the Fibonacci, but this Hailstone sequence is a new one for me. I'm hoping that the initial appeal does lead to something useful.

        Thanks for yet another quality contribution. Feel free to offer anything else that you think might be helpful.

        P.S. - Check out JADE's 5-22-04 PowerBall discussion. 

          ayenowitall's avatar - rod serling4.jpg

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          Posted: May 23, 2004, 2:46 pm - IP Logged

          hypersoniq,

          I've been playing around with that Hailstone sequence for a good part of the day... very interesting. I'm not ready to call this a prediction, but I've achieved some results suggesting that the 27 will return as the red PowerBall on Wednesday. This may be wishful thinking, but we won't have to wait too long to find out for sure. The downside is, I can't find any usable numbers in the sequence beyond that. This may just be a fluke. It may be nothing at all. I just thought I'd let you know what I've stumbled across.


            Australia
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            Posted: May 26, 2004, 3:17 am - IP Logged

            There is no sequence that is applicable to any lottery.

            Randomness and sequentialness are dichotomous ( and if that ain't a word it should be.)

            This is not an invitation for argument as it is not possible to argue that black is white; it is a declaration of sanity by the writer to the casual reader and an invitation not too be completely turned off this forum before looking at other threads. 

              ayenowitall's avatar - rod serling4.jpg

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              Posted: May 26, 2004, 5:33 am - IP Logged

              It was stated early on in this topic that sequences are generally believed to have no useful application in predicting lottery outcomes. It is also widely held that there is no method which can be used to predict any lottery outcomes. Notwithstanding, many of us here at Lottery Post try to do just that by a wide variety of means. This thread was started for people who are interested in working with mathematical sequences for that purpose.

              Thanks for your concern about those who might be turned off by our efforts, Colin. My apologies to anyone who is offended or discouraged by this thread. Indeed, if the administrator of this site deems this an inappropriate avenue of exploration, I would take no offense at this thread being locked or deleted altogether.

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                Posted: May 26, 2004, 10:49 am - IP Logged

                Quote: Originally posted by ayenowitall on May 26, 2004





                It was stated early on in this topic that sequences are generally believed to have no useful application in predicting lottery outcomes. It is also widely held that there is no method which can be used to predict any lottery outcomes. Notwithstanding, many of us here at Lottery Post try to do just that by a wide variety of means.





                So long as lottery draws are regarded as independent dvents, I can't imagine any way to link them together. However, a crazy Hungarian named Bolyai once wondered what kind of geometry he'd have if parallel lines intersected ... and dventually a fellow named Einstein wandered by and found it useful.

                Therefore, since we won't get anywhere otherwise, and since strange assumptions sometimes prove to be true after all ... why not assume that lottery draws are NOT independent dvents?

                This is actually the assumption underlying all the investigations currently underway in these forums. But to merely assume a dependent relationship says nothing about the nature of that relationship -- and there are as many approaches to discovering that relationship as there are sands on the beach. It would be useful to narrow the field.

                It seems to me that approaches involving naturally-occurring sequences is probably a better approach than many. The Fibonacci sequence pops up in nature; so, why not? Personally, my first choice would be something based on chaos theory.

                However, far more interesting to me, from a "pure science" standpoint (searching for lottery connections is "applied science") would be the investigation into the character (for lack of a better word) of this dependent relationship. How are they related? Maybe the relationship isn't direct, but instead through a third factor ... or fourth ... or fifth. Or through a conglomerate of factors.

                Perhaps lottery balls behave like waves crashing onto a rocky beach, rolling over one another until the wave that just happens to be in front when the rocks are met becomes the spray.


                MAW 92 Postcard

                A non-linear approach (for a change). Look good to anyone?

                Credits: Picture is the MAW 92 Theme Postcard, found at http://mathforum.org/mam/92/  © 1994-2004 The Math Forum http://mathforum.org/. It is used here without permission.

                Where n is equal to the number of tickets bought, the odds of winning in the MegaMillions lottery is given by 1 - [(1 - 0.023399196957)^n]

                  WIN  D's avatar - q05Q0
                  Stone Mountain*Georgia
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                  Posted: May 26, 2004, 3:45 pm - IP Logged

                   Much of the research on math sequences seems to assume some sort of sapient personality sending out coded messages. I guess letters are just independent dvents until you break the code. Then, eureka..."Gone With the Wind!" They're kinda like fractals......huh? Results speak louder than words or......their letters.What ever came first.

                   What came before numbers or fingers and toes? I know... the I.R.S 

                    Without telling them the origin .......it would be fun to send a batch of blind sequences(old powerball database) over to the cryptology folks at NSA,DIA,CIA ......and ask them to find the message. Give them a deadline and a bonus... only if they perform well before the next draw! LOL It would probably end up looking like this:

                    " Ira=  has  weapo=s  of   ma==   destru=tio="  " Pb #13"

                   Ahhh...... the power! LOL

                   

                   ps..hyper, do you still have that web address concerning "math sequences? " I posted some time ago ...think it was a dept. of bell labs.

                   

                   

                  The only real failure .....is the failure to try.                               

                                                Luck is a very rare thing....... Odds not so much. 

                                                Odds never change .....but probability does. 

                                                                                                         Win d    

                    hypersoniq's avatar - 8ball
                    Pennsylvania
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                    Posted: May 28, 2004, 6:55 pm - IP Logged

                    this one?

                    http://www.research.att.com/~njas/sequences/

                    Playing more than one ticket per game is betting against yourself.

                      WIN  D's avatar - q05Q0
                      Stone Mountain*Georgia
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                      Posted: May 29, 2004, 4:43 pm - IP Logged

                       Thanks hyper but not the one. Oh well... not a biggie.

                       Here is an interesting view of sequences and formulas. I like it. I think it demo's the need to incorperate multi-dvent contest into sequence prediction probability. Correct me if I'm wrong ....but this requires the use of past dvents as predictors of a future dvent.

                        http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/56493.html 

                       I especially liked this part about ...having to link "independent dvents":

                        "What a beautiful problem! Thank you for sending it. I had no idea what
                      the solution might be when I first read your problem
                      (although I
                      figured your answer was wrong, as it assumes that each set of three is
                      independent of the others, and of course they are not.
                      But I surely
                      never expected to find our old friend Fibonacci hiding in the
                      woodshed, so to speak..."

                       

                       

                      The only real failure .....is the failure to try.                               

                                                    Luck is a very rare thing....... Odds not so much. 

                                                    Odds never change .....but probability does. 

                                                                                                             Win d    

                        Cleveland,Oh
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                        Posted: June 11, 2004, 1:53 am - IP Logged
                        Quote: Originally posted by ayenowitall on May 08, 2004



                        RJ,

                        Some years ago when I first started playing the lottery, I tried selecting numbers based on the historical parameters for each position. I had no trouble coming up with numbers, but I never had any success with cashing tickets. I hope you can manage to do better than I did. Good luck.

                        BTW, I read through all the posts of a thread about the Lottosync system. It looks like there are quite a few unhappy campers out there. I sure hope Guru didn't market the same thing I'm developing. I'll not call mine a success unless and until it wins the big one for me.





                        I played 60 groups of numbers based on the numbers that came in I won $ 60.00 + but could not get that 4 or 5 number was just always 1 or 2 off more than I could remember not every day but once or twice a week!


                          Belgium
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                          Posted: June 14, 2004, 6:47 pm - IP Logged

                          RJ:

                          We do have quite a few happy campers also. Unfortunately the unhappy campers just tend to speak a little louder.

                          Wait for the Lottosync V1.8 live testcase on this forum, and watch closely what happens.

                          We had a bit of a bumpy ride with the first lottosync versions, but we are rolling smooth now.

                            RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
                            mid-Ohio
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                            Posted: June 14, 2004, 9:07 pm - IP Logged

                            Guru,

                            That remark about the unhappy campers was in a post by ayenowitall not me. I been watching the prediction board and the winning predictions percentage is usually 0.5% or less which convinces me that expecting 1% of the predictions to win something is expecting a lot.  Good luck on your new version of Lottosync.

                            RJOh

                             * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                               
                                         Evil Looking       


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                              Posted: June 15, 2004, 12:58 am - IP Logged

                              Dear Mr Guru

                              My unbiased independent testing facilities are at your disposal and anyone else for that matter. The only proviso is that you give permission for the results to be published.

                              I look forward to you availing yourself of this marvelous opportunity to measure your product against the published odds or random selections.

                              Sincerely at your service

                              Colin