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Ohio Lottery investigating frequent winners

Topic closed. 23 replies. Last post 2 years ago by GAman03.

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Kentucky
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February 14, 2006
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Posted: September 16, 2014, 4:56 pm - IP Logged

"The odds are pretty good that several LP members won't understand how the players spending hundreds a day on scratch-offs, pick-3, and pick-4 tickets will win more of the prizes than $5 a week player."

Obviously the state understands that it's unlikely anyone can afford to spend hundreds a day on scratch-offs, pick-3, and pick-4 tickets and win more per dollars spent than $5 a week players, the odds of winning are the same for all. 

It's more likely these pretend winners are discounting the winning tickets of real winners so they can avoid paying back taxes, child support and other obligations and cashing their tickets for them.  The lotteries shouldn't allow organized criminals to use legal state lotteries in their businesses.  It is a crime to aid someone doing something that's illegal.

The Mass Lottery knew a small group of people were spending thousands to create a roll over in their Cash Win Fall game, but saw no problem because it didn't affect the bottom line. It wasn't until someone pointed out it was unfair to the average player who was unaware of the roll over that anything was done. Mathematically someone could wager $600,000 and get a 15% to 20% return when there was a roll over and the lottery still profited around 50 cents on every dollar spent.

"It's more likely these pretend winners are discounting the winning tickets of real winners so they can avoid paying back taxes, child support and other obligations and cashing their tickets for them."

I won't agree "more likely" is fact because there are no statistics on those not cashing their winning tickets, but there are statistics on the players that do. If 70% to 80% of all lottery players owe child support than 70% to 80% of the winners owe child support. If you know the percentage of the real winners saying they owe back taxes, child support, or other obligations, the percentage of those buying tickets should be the same. 

"The lotteries shouldn't allow organized criminals to use legal state lotteries in their businesses."

How do you purpose preventing organized crime from using the official pick-3 results as their "game" result?

"It is a crime to aid someone doing something that's illegal."

Actually there is a fine line between direct and indirect aid and usually something that must be proved in a court of law. I'll give you this though; if a store owner or clerk knows for a fact the real winner is avoiding taxes or child support, but still cash the ticket, they are aiding. I know in Ohio (they did when I lived there), winners check "yes or no" to the question of back child support and a Notary affirms they signed their name. I always checked "no" so I don't know what happens to those checking "yes".

If it's fact a large percentage of lottery winners of over $600 own money, the lottery could add "did you purchase the ticket and if no, who did you get it from" to the claims form, but the sellers name is still irrelevant to the buyer whether they know it was sold because of money owed or not.

The state lotteries could make it even more difficult to cash winning tickets, but difficulty is probably why some players are selling their winning tickets.

    RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
    mid-Ohio
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    Posted: September 16, 2014, 6:45 pm - IP Logged

    The Mass Lottery knew a small group of people were spending thousands to create a roll over in their Cash Win Fall game, but saw no problem because it didn't affect the bottom line. It wasn't until someone pointed out it was unfair to the average player who was unaware of the roll over that anything was done. Mathematically someone could wager $600,000 and get a 15% to 20% return when there was a roll over and the lottery still profited around 50 cents on every dollar spent.

    "It's more likely these pretend winners are discounting the winning tickets of real winners so they can avoid paying back taxes, child support and other obligations and cashing their tickets for them."

    I won't agree "more likely" is fact because there are no statistics on those not cashing their winning tickets, but there are statistics on the players that do. If 70% to 80% of all lottery players owe child support than 70% to 80% of the winners owe child support. If you know the percentage of the real winners saying they owe back taxes, child support, or other obligations, the percentage of those buying tickets should be the same. 

    "The lotteries shouldn't allow organized criminals to use legal state lotteries in their businesses."

    How do you purpose preventing organized crime from using the official pick-3 results as their "game" result?

    "It is a crime to aid someone doing something that's illegal."

    Actually there is a fine line between direct and indirect aid and usually something that must be proved in a court of law. I'll give you this though; if a store owner or clerk knows for a fact the real winner is avoiding taxes or child support, but still cash the ticket, they are aiding. I know in Ohio (they did when I lived there), winners check "yes or no" to the question of back child support and a Notary affirms they signed their name. I always checked "no" so I don't know what happens to those checking "yes".

    If it's fact a large percentage of lottery winners of over $600 own money, the lottery could add "did you purchase the ticket and if no, who did you get it from" to the claims form, but the sellers name is still irrelevant to the buyer whether they know it was sold because of money owed or not.

    The state lotteries could make it even more difficult to cash winning tickets, but difficulty is probably why some players are selling their winning tickets.

    The state lotteries could make it even more difficult to cash winning tickets, but difficulty is probably why some players are selling their winning tickets.

    In Ohio claims of $600-$5000 only require a local retailer verify the winning ticket and a claim form be filled out and notarized before being taken to a local bank to collect the winnings.  I'm sure discounters aren't buying tickets that haven't been verified so the only reason for winners to use them is to avoid legal obligations and the retailers and discounters know this.

    If the lottery required people cashing tickets to state that they are the original owner of the ticket or name the original owner it would put a dent in such operations.  After all Iowa lottery didn't have to go to court to refuse to pay the NY lawyer who try to cash a $14M+ winning ticket he didn't buy.  http://www.lotterypost.com/news/241710

     * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
       
                 Evil Looking       

      helpmewin's avatar - dandy
      u$a
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      Posted: September 17, 2014, 11:14 am - IP Logged

      All these winners in my state and I can't break more than 35, lol.

      Maybe you go to the wrong store Smash

      Let it Snow Snowman

        Scratch$'s avatar - sm lottery.jpg

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        Posted: September 17, 2014, 2:25 pm - IP Logged

        Wow intresting story, well u know the old saying.Money is the root of all evil.I really need some of that root. lol. A dollar or 2 dollars an a dream.

        That "old saying" originated in the Bible, and actually states that the LOVE of money is the root of all evil.

        Scratchers ~ Cash 5 ~ Powerball ~ Mega Millions

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          Kentucky
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          Posted: September 17, 2014, 2:27 pm - IP Logged

          The state lotteries could make it even more difficult to cash winning tickets, but difficulty is probably why some players are selling their winning tickets.

          In Ohio claims of $600-$5000 only require a local retailer verify the winning ticket and a claim form be filled out and notarized before being taken to a local bank to collect the winnings.  I'm sure discounters aren't buying tickets that haven't been verified so the only reason for winners to use them is to avoid legal obligations and the retailers and discounters know this.

          If the lottery required people cashing tickets to state that they are the original owner of the ticket or name the original owner it would put a dent in such operations.  After all Iowa lottery didn't have to go to court to refuse to pay the NY lawyer who try to cash a $14M+ winning ticket he didn't buy.  http://www.lotterypost.com/news/241710

          "I'm sure discounters aren't buying tickets that haven't been verified so the only reason for winners to use them is to avoid legal obligations and the retailers and discounters know this."

          Using that logic (the only reason), should we assume anyone claiming a large jackpot anonymously are doing it to avoid legal obligations?

            RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
            mid-Ohio
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            Posted: September 17, 2014, 3:02 pm - IP Logged

            "I'm sure discounters aren't buying tickets that haven't been verified so the only reason for winners to use them is to avoid legal obligations and the retailers and discounters know this."

            Using that logic (the only reason), should we assume anyone claiming a large jackpot anonymously are doing it to avoid legal obligations?

            "Using that logic (the only reason), should we assume anyone claiming a large jackpot anonymously are doing it to avoid legal obligations?"

            No because simply claiming a prize anonymously doesn't allow one to avoid getting a W-2G and not showing their prize as earned income.

            Remember the mother in Detroit who was denied welfare after claiming her million dollar lottery prize legitimately?  Had she used a discounter she wouldn't had to pay income taxes and could have continued receiving her welfare checks and receive benefits from programs intended for those with little or no income.

             * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
               
                         Evil Looking       

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              Posted: September 17, 2014, 11:19 pm - IP Logged

              "Using that logic (the only reason), should we assume anyone claiming a large jackpot anonymously are doing it to avoid legal obligations?"

              No because simply claiming a prize anonymously doesn't allow one to avoid getting a W-2G and not showing their prize as earned income.

              Remember the mother in Detroit who was denied welfare after claiming her million dollar lottery prize legitimately?  Had she used a discounter she wouldn't had to pay income taxes and could have continued receiving her welfare checks and receive benefits from programs intended for those with little or no income.

              Amanda Clayton won her prize on a game show so she couldn't have hid it if she wanted to. But even if she had, Federal and state taxes are still paid on the winnings by someone. She didn't have to pay back any of the benefits she got before winning, but continuing to collect, was what got her in trouble.

              It doesn't look like they are cashing any $1 million tickets and based on the amounts, it probably prizes under $25,000. And makes more sense for someone  winning $5000 to have someone cash to avoid paying child support. Taxes will still be paid regardless who collects.

                CDanaT's avatar - tiger avatar_04_hd_pictures_169016.jpg
                TX
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                Posted: September 18, 2014, 6:11 am - IP Logged

                OMg! This is crazy! lol

                I am not surprised if these stores has thousands of dollars of winners. It's as tempting as working for the federal reserve. When you have stacks of money laid before you everyday, you can only contain the urge for so long.

                LL....There's a very simple theme that people who"can only contain the urge for so long" need to consider and it goes like this:

                It's much easier to stay out of trouble rather than it is to get out of trouble.  Patriot

                If they are stealing from their customers by lying about a winning ticket that's another issue, but if they are cashing in tickets that are legal, then the lottery just has to live with it. For example, the gentleman that was shown on The Lottery Changed My Life. He owned a repair garage(up in the northeast I believe) and he wins on Keno along with other games. They showed him going into the lottery commission and the representative knows him quite well, calls him by his first name.....Granted its not hundreds of times...But he is a repeat customer and will he be the next denied payout ?  My trust in government run agencies is limited and there are too many examples going on right now to back that up....just my 2 cents worth

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                  Rome, Georgia
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                  Posted: September 20, 2014, 9:22 am - IP Logged

                  I don't really see the big deal or why Ohio Lottery Commission are investigating winners. As long as taxes are paid on the "winning" tickets, the winners aren't doing anything illegal. Ohio courts should garnish child support and taxpayers paychecks and stop depending on "catching" them through lottery winnings.