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If Your State Pre-Test's its Draws List it here

Topic closed. 32 replies. Last post 10 years ago by amsoly41.

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United States
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June 22, 2005
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Posted: March 23, 2007, 7:57 pm - IP Logged

you are absolutely right Pacattack05...

I used to like ball draws until I found the ugly truth behind the masquerade. I started to lean towards a computer picking the numbers. Sure...people say it can be tampered with. Oh really? Are they saying that the shuffle of balls and tubes and pre-tests isn't defined as tampering? All for the sake of not having mishaps occur during a live drawing? What makes anyone think that mishaps can't happen after a test. It's like saying...OH okay...now that we got this possible mishap out of the way, there won't be one for a while...we're safe...What? OK>>.I believe that one...duh!!! I'm such a dumb dumb...hello which way did he go?

I'd rather have a computer program with a seed picking the numbers. If there is abuse within the programming of how the numbers are selected, well...I'm sure that it only represents a minority.

The difference between movement of balls and tubes, as opposed to a minority of hacks breaking the rules on the computer end...well....I'd choose the computer. Why?

Here's why...

The ball switching tube manipulation are done intentionaly on a much larger scale, as opposed to computers, where you cross your fingers you don't live in a state that has a hack fixing things. I'd rather take my chances with the possible hack scenario, than to have no choice in the matter, and deal with the officials playing with their balls. 

Re edited........................."on a much larger scale" In the last paragraph...LOL

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    Kingston, Ontario
    Canada
    Member #46867
    October 5, 2006
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    Posted: March 23, 2007, 11:01 pm - IP Logged

    In Ontario, no pre-testing is done with the real sets of balls.  If OLG/OLC needed to test a game or its equipment they would use a set of practice balls, usually an old set that doesn't meet up to the OLG/OLC's stringent regulations.  That would be a ball set that is out a few grams of one another and can not be used in the games any longer. 

    If they did pretesting with the real set and called it a pre-test, the gaming public could/should argue that the combination are the real winning numbers as they were the first numbers that fell when the machine was turned on.   I am not sure how the states can get away with doing pre-tests.   

    "Together We're Making Good Things Happen,  Ontario's Lotteries...WE ALL WIN"

      amsoly41's avatar - ron paul_gold_standard.jpg
      Tennessee
      United States
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      October 29, 2005
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      Posted: March 24, 2007, 10:41 am - IP Logged

      I know on the Main Power Ball website

      when you click on the Powerball Numbers Link (in the upper lefthand cornner) 

      under the numbers you will see a box that says

       


      Every attempt is made to ensure that this list of numbers is accurate, the official winning numbers are recorded in the official draw files as certified by an independent accounting firm. Winning numbers are not official until confirmed by the auditing firm of LWBJ, LLP.  Click here if you are having trouble seeing the most recent numbers. 


      if you click on the little red ball in the lower cornner it will give you some pre draw results.

      Money can't buy you happiness... but it does bring you a more pleasant form of misery Wink

        Miss Bee's avatar - strawberry
        nashville
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        Posted: March 24, 2007, 11:06 am - IP Logged

        For Tenn. I forgot to add they also do 3 pretest after each drawing, So that is 6 total  for each drawing 3 before and 3 after.

          four4me's avatar - gate1
          MD
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          Posted: March 24, 2007, 11:38 am - IP Logged

          the idea behind pretest is to assure that the same digits don't come up over and over again repeatedly. To rule out tampering. And to assure equipment is functioning properly.

          In many cases it is also done so new lottery attendants can familiarize the 2 minute episode that will take place live on air. 

          don't try and say that pre tests ruin the outcome of a draw. the on air drawing is the only draw that matters. they could run pre test for 5 hrs if they wanted to... in the end the official drawing is the only drawing that matters.

            Miss Bee's avatar - strawberry
            nashville
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            Posted: March 27, 2007, 8:43 pm - IP Logged

            For Tenn. I forgot to add they also do 3 pretest after each drawing, So that is 6 total  for each drawing 3 before and 3 after.

            Tennesseeottery reply to my email.

             

            Thank you for your interest in the Tennessee Lottery. Results of pretest draws are not availble daily. However, results for pretest drawings can be made available to you, upon request, on a monthly basis. In addition, you are welcome to make arrangements through the Tennessee Lottery to view a live drawing at News Channel 2 studios in Nashville.

            -----
            This email is in response to the comment below:
            How do we find the results of the pretest drawings?
            I would like to know what they are.
            Can I get them emailed or can I call dailey for results?

              lotterybraker's avatar - pyramid
              mississippi
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              Posted: March 27, 2007, 8:55 pm - IP Logged

              Miss Bee..I would HIGHLY SUGGEST to you to obtain those pre-test results if you can get them..I think they will be a valuable source of information for you when you do your workouts..because lets face the facts..everyone knows there are hot digits..hot pairs..and even hot combos..but there has to be cold digits..cold pairs and cold combos also to make things balance out..if you have chosen a cold anything and it shows or has shown in the pre-test..it may be a while before you see it again..and I would mainly be concerned with a pair..and any 3 digit combo..a single digit will show faster even if it comes in the pretest..but an exact pair or an exact 3 digit combo..well thats a different story..you may get lucky quick ..or you may have to wait a while..and yes..it would be some very good information to include in your workouts..good luck..

              "Attention all Mathematicians: Check your degree at the door because when it comes to whole numbers you are the Amateur"

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                NY
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                Posted: March 28, 2007, 3:14 am - IP Logged

                Just out of curiosity I used Google and got this from the Calif Lottery FAQs.  I am highlighting in red what really bothers me about the claim that pre-tests ensure randomness.  Are they saying that a HUMAN makes a decision on what he thinks looks kosher?  I mean, what if your numbers are 1-2-3-4-5-6 and he thinks "that's unbelievable" or the number 25 is drawn 5 consecutive times.  So what? Isn't that what random means, that is, anything can happen. 

                From Wikipedia:  Random: "used to express lack of purpose, cause, order, or predictability..."

                 

                "An independent statistician reviews all results of pre-test draws and actual draws to further ensure ongoing randomness. The statistician and the Lottery's Internal Audits Office keep track of draw results to make sure no numbers come up more often than they should -- statistically speaking!"

                 

                Interesting that they use an automated draw machine for other games like pick-5.

                The statistician they use (and there's a reason they use a statistician and not just somerun of the mill government bureaucrat) won't think 1,2,3,4,5 means there's a problem, but what if he did? If it's a pre-test it doesn't matter whether or not they think there's a problem. It's a test and the outcome doesn't determine the winning numbers. Your combination turning up in the pre-test is exactly like a combination you didn't play coming up in the real drawing: you don't win. Simple as that, and already covered in the rules.

                As far as determing randomness, you're right that a number coming up 5 consecutive times may simply be probability working exactly as it should, but if several test draws result in an improbable outcome it might indicate a problem and there's nothing wrong with investigating to be sure that there is nothing else to suggest that something other than an improbable outcome is the cause. 25 coming up in all 5 of 5 tests could be  the  1 in 1000 result that should be expected in 1 out of 1000 tries, but would warrant rechecking to make sure it isn't the result of the 25 ball being a different weight or size. Simply put, pre-tests can increase randomness because by making sure that the inevitableoutcomes that are improbable aren't the result of something that isn't random the tests can help eliminate factors that aren't random.

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                  Posted: March 28, 2007, 3:28 am - IP Logged

                  hi, does ky. pretest?

                    lotterybraker's avatar - pyramid
                    mississippi
                    United States
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                    March 3, 2006
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                    Posted: March 28, 2007, 7:04 am - IP Logged

                    The statistician they use (and there's a reason they use a statistician and not just somerun of the mill government bureaucrat) won't think 1,2,3,4,5 means there's a problem, but what if he did? If it's a pre-test it doesn't matter whether or not they think there's a problem. It's a test and the outcome doesn't determine the winning numbers. Your combination turning up in the pre-test is exactly like a combination you didn't play coming up in the real drawing: you don't win. Simple as that, and already covered in the rules

                    I think you are missing the main point here...lets look at this like this..take pic 3..only 1000 combinations..if you write those out and check them off as they come out..PRETEST OR NOT..you will see that in the entire set of 1000 you will get many repeats..IF YOU INCLUDE THE PRETEST..THE SET OF 1000 will fill up much faster therefore shrinking the set faster so you can get a better handle on straights that hasnt shown yet..same for pic 4 with 10,000 combinations..pic 5 has even more combinaions..the set becomes bigger..it has way more combinations..the pre-test plus actual draws will fill up that set even faster as well..IF A COMBINATION COMES OUT OF THAT MACHINE IT HAS TO COUNT IN THE ENTIRE SET...it will be another combination that has come out that belongs to the set of 1-2-3-4-5 through 36-37-38-39-40 IF YOU PIC 5 IS 5/40..now it doesnt matter if you win or get paid or if they post it for you or the whole world to see or if they keep it for themselves as pretest top secret file..a combination is a combination is a combination that has came out..with those bigger games the likelihood of an EXACT REPEAT of a combination becomes even less..I see this as something different than most I guess..because I work in sets and I may be the only person on this planet that uses them..but as others haven mentioned..most of our systems are based on past numbers to do our workouts..now if they are taking out combinations that they are not showing to the public..THAT WILL ABSOLUTELY MESS UP WHAT EACH AND EVERYONE OF US DO..any combination that comes out of that machine has to be counted in the set..there is no getting around that..I dont care if you or anyone gets paid for it..it is still a natural combination that came out when they turned the machine on and belongs to the set ..it has to count..!!!

                    "Attention all Mathematicians: Check your degree at the door because when it comes to whole numbers you are the Amateur"

                      Ms5PennieGen's avatar - aeonflux
                      Texas
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                      July 23, 2004
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                      Posted: March 28, 2007, 10:42 am - IP Logged

                      The statistician they use (and there's a reason they use a statistician and not just somerun of the mill government bureaucrat) won't think 1,2,3,4,5 means there's a problem, but what if he did? If it's a pre-test it doesn't matter whether or not they think there's a problem. It's a test and the outcome doesn't determine the winning numbers. Your combination turning up in the pre-test is exactly like a combination you didn't play coming up in the real drawing: you don't win. Simple as that, and already covered in the rules

                      I think you are missing the main point here...lets look at this like this..take pic 3..only 1000 combinations..if you write those out and check them off as they come out..PRETEST OR NOT..you will see that in the entire set of 1000 you will get many repeats..IF YOU INCLUDE THE PRETEST..THE SET OF 1000 will fill up much faster therefore shrinking the set faster so you can get a better handle on straights that hasnt shown yet..same for pic 4 with 10,000 combinations..pic 5 has even more combinaions..the set becomes bigger..it has way more combinations..the pre-test plus actual draws will fill up that set even faster as well..IF A COMBINATION COMES OUT OF THAT MACHINE IT HAS TO COUNT IN THE ENTIRE SET...it will be another combination that has come out that belongs to the set of 1-2-3-4-5 through 36-37-38-39-40 IF YOU PIC 5 IS 5/40..now it doesnt matter if you win or get paid or if they post it for you or the whole world to see or if they keep it for themselves as pretest top secret file..a combination is a combination is a combination that has came out..with those bigger games the likelihood of an EXACT REPEAT of a combination becomes even less..I see this as something different than most I guess..because I work in sets and I may be the only person on this planet that uses them..but as others haven mentioned..most of our systems are based on past numbers to do our workouts..now if they are taking out combinations that they are not showing to the public..THAT WILL ABSOLUTELY MESS UP WHAT EACH AND EVERYONE OF US DO..any combination that comes out of that machine has to be counted in the set..there is no getting around that..I dont care if you or anyone gets paid for it..it is still a natural combination that came out when they turned the machine on and belongs to the set ..it has to count..!!!

                      I Agree!  Lotterybraker, I so agree with your strategy. Triple 999 has shown up in pretest through the years but never in actual drawing.  We haven't had a triple since Oct. yet triples have shown in pretest. Many times I have seen my predictions show up in the pre-test and I had already played the numbers. I think you are on to something with your strategy! Good luck$$

                      Your present situation is not your final destination!
                      Good luck...5pennies Dance
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                        NY
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                        Posted: March 28, 2007, 1:29 pm - IP Logged

                        "I think you are missing the main point here"

                        I haven't missed anything. The pre-tests do absolutely nothing to change the outcome of the drawing, which for those who have forgotten, is supposed to be random. Basically, you're complaining that you don't get all of the data, which makes it harder to guess what the results might be.  Too bad, boo hoo.Even if the lottery releases all of the data, including which machines and which balls are used for previous drawings and tests you will never know which machine and balls will be used for a drawing that hasn't happened yet. If you think that measuring enough cans of fruit tail will give you some special insight onto what might come out of an unlaeled can that might contain apples, oranges or grapes, feel free to have at it. You already know that you don't have all of the data you'd like to have, so you've got two choices. You can play anyway or you can choose not to play. You can whine either way, but that won't affect the outcome either.

                          Guru101's avatar - rw6jhh
                          Indiana
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                          Posted: March 28, 2007, 1:49 pm - IP Logged

                          I agree with four4me and KY Floyd. Random is random. Who cares if there is pretests? If it's random, it doesn't matter.

                          Gonna win.Big Smile

                            four4me's avatar - gate1
                            MD
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                            Posted: March 28, 2007, 2:14 pm - IP Logged

                            I gonna jump back in this thread again. When they select the balls for the various drawings and run pre tests. It will do nothing for you to have at that information. The main reason is they rarely use the same balls from drawing to drawing. They aren't going to tell you which ball sets they are using for a particular drawing. If they rotate the ball sets for every draw. By the end of the month you would be left with hundreds of pre test results that will in no way help you determine a winner.

                            Here's an idea your welcome to play around with buy some pingpong balls 30 for pick 3 and an additional 10 for pick 4. write the digits on them 0 thru 9 just like your setting up your own lottery. place 10 balls in 3 separate paper bags shake the bag up draw a number from each bag. Place the balls back in the bag and have at it say for 20 pre tests. make all the workouts you deem necessary. Then hold your official drawing. No peeking. or have someone else draw the balls. See if your workout comes up with the winning combination either straight or box.  

                            I'm willing to wager that it would be no different then tracking the last twenty official drawings. In that you might draw the digits you selected in your workout using the paper bag method. And you might not. And the reality of this theory is you will have the ability to track all your pre test with the same set of balls. While the actual lottery might be rotating 20 different sets of balls or more.

                              lotterybraker's avatar - pyramid
                              mississippi
                              United States
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                              March 3, 2006
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                              Posted: March 28, 2007, 3:12 pm - IP Logged

                              A.=I already know what is in the Can before it is opened..0-9..in fact..that is in "EVERY CAN"..I dont need to look any further than that..

                               

                              Too bad, boo hoo.Even if the lottery releases all of the data, including which machines and which balls are used for previous drawings and tests you will never know which machine and balls will be used for a drawing that hasn't happened yet. If you think that measuring enough cans of fruit tail will give you some special insight onto what might come out of an unlaeled can that might contain apples, oranges or grapes, feel free to have at it.

                               

                              B.I use way more than 20 draws four4me..and by the way..they could change the balls every day..wouldnt make a difference..they could change the machines..they could even have blind people pick the balls..IT JUST DOESNT MATTER..it doesnt effect what I do one way or the other..lol

                               

                              Here's an idea your welcome to play around with buy some pingpong balls 30 for pick 3 and an additional 10 for pick 4. write the digits on them 0 thru 9 just like your setting up your own lottery. place 10 balls in 3 separate paper bags shake the bag up draw a number from each bag. Place the balls back in the bag and have at it say for 20 pre tests. make all the workouts you deem necessary. Then hold your official drawing. No peeking. or have someone else draw the balls. See if your workout comes up with the winning combination either straight or box.  

                              "Attention all Mathematicians: Check your degree at the door because when it comes to whole numbers you are the Amateur"