Should tax payers be paid back after a winPrev TopicNext Topic

• time*treat

  

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  Dec 10, 2007, 8:09 pm

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  I'm still waiting on an explanation of this taxpayer "payback" thing. I've heard of it, but never seen one.

  If Bob Slob collected $50,000 while on the dole and he wins $5 mil, roughly half that is taken in income taxes. Now, the local yokel gov't says, "Bob, you owe us a repay of $50,000."

  If Bob writes a check, where does the money go? 
  

  In neo-conned Amerika, bank robs you.
  Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms should be the name of a convenience store, not a govnoment agency.
• csfb

  

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  Dec 10, 2007, 11:16 pm

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  In response to tntea

  Quote: Originally posted by tntea on Dec 8, 2007

  Would you think those who wouldn't want to pay back the assistance receive would be those who are greedy?

  Greedy?  Can't say.  Maybe so, maybe not.

  What I can say however is that honesty and generosity are not instinctive in man.  Not part of human nature.  These are traits one has to be taught and learned at a very young age, and by example.  We follow in the footsteps of our parents.

                        
• tntea

  

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  Dec 10, 2007, 11:26 pm

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  In response to csfb

  Quote: Originally posted by csfb on Dec 10, 2007

  Greedy?  Can't say.  Maybe so, maybe not.

  What I can say however is that honesty and generosity are not instinctive in man.  Not part of human nature.  These are traits one has to be taught and learned at a very young age, and by example.  We follow in the footsteps of our parents.

  Bingo..

  My parents raised me that way.. I cannot complain...

       OLD/Vtrac   Lottery Bible         Double Warnings      TN F34/F44
• four4me

  

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  Dec 10, 2007, 11:58 pm

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  Nobody has the right to put anybody down for their economic status. Nor should said persons be concerned whether a person pays back taxes on something they got through government systems.

  I will agree that some people abuse the system and many times they get caught but i think some people aren't aware that you just cant get gov assistance without due cause. So what if they use certain loopholes to get on assistance. Even upstanding citizens and many buisnesses use loopholes to their advantage.

  Next time you get around to it ask the gas and electric company representative how much they paid in taxes for the income they earned last year. After having ripped of every person who buys their services. If you think for one minute they paid an equal share you better get your head examined.
• Jorli D

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 12:04 am

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  In response to four4me

  Quote: Originally posted by four4me on Dec 10, 2007

  Nobody has the right to put anybody down for their economic status. Nor should said persons be concerned whether a person pays back taxes on something they got through government systems.

  I will agree that some people abuse the system and many times they get caught but i think some people aren't aware that you just cant get gov assistance without due cause. So what if they use certain loopholes to get on assistance. Even upstanding citizens and many buisnesses use loopholes to their advantage.

  Next time you get around to it ask the gas and electric company representative how much they paid in taxes for the income they earned last year. After having ripped of every person who buys their services. If you think for one minute they paid an equal share you better get your head examined.

  Whether she ask the gas & electric companies that question or not, the problem remains that TnTea does not think, and she needs her head examined.
• justxploring

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 12:31 am

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  No.  Again, like the other poll it's too general.   

  First of all, getting on disability isn't that easy.  Most people have serious medical conditions.  Unfortunately, as I said on the other thread, there are a lot of cheaters who get lost in the system.   

  Regarding payback, there is a difference between a gift and a loan.  So if you determine that the money received is not a loan, then it never needs to be paid back.   
• four4me

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 1:24 am

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  I wasn't going to get into this thread buy i guess i am involved so now I'll say what i think needs to be said. This post isn't about the lottery and should be in a blog. These posts are about personal feelings towards the general populace and the states allowing people to seek refuge in the system and some getting away with it. Some needing it, and some getting off of it and back into the workplace. And whether or not they should pay back the system.

  There are no rules or stipulations that say if you come into money that you have to pay back any moneys to the state other than what is owed when you cash your big windfall check. If on the other hand a person feels or deems it necessary to pay back the state for services rendered i don't think they will accept your money at least not in the general thinking that your paying back the state. They might let you donate money to their organizations.

  Suppose you won some big money and you were on the welfare system and you went to the comptrollers office and said i want to pay the state back all the money i was given while i was on welfare or whatever kind of assistance you were on. I can hear the laughter now as the office people start rolling on the floor laughing. They would think you were a nut case. They might question you to see if you committed fraud, to obtained money from them but would advise you it you received the money honestly and were in need of it then it's not necessary to pay it back. They might suggest giving some money to a charity.

  If tntea is having a problem with people in her area ripping of the system and can prove it then she should be contacting the appropriate authorities. Personally i wouldn't get involved unless i knew for sure that wrongdoings were taking place. I would think twice about reporting someone that for whatever reason might come back to me and do bodily harm to me or my family members so by all means report it anonymously.
• KY Floyd

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 1:39 am

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  In response to justxploring

  Quote: Originally posted by justxploring on Dec 11, 2007

  No.  Again, like the other poll it's too general.   

  First of all, getting on disability isn't that easy.  Most people have serious medical conditions.  Unfortunately, as I said on the other thread, there are a lot of cheaters who get lost in the system.   

  Regarding payback, there is a difference between a gift and a loan.  So if you determine that the money received is not a loan, then it never needs to be paid back.   

  Why does it matter whether it's easy to get the assistance, or why you're getting the assistance? It's assistance that comes from people who pay taxes because they have to.

  You're a fine, upstanding and productive member of the community. You pay your taxes, and in your spare time you're a scout leader and a volunteer EMT. On Christmas Eve you respond to a call about a nun who was pushed down the stairs by one of the homeless people she was helping at the soup kitchen. FWIW, his lot in life isn't really his fault, because he was born with a serious brain injury, which, among other things, severely limits his coordination. That's why he accidentally pushed the nun down the stairs. As you carefullly operate your low-carbon-footprint Geo Metro through the icestorm, a tree, covered in heavy layers of ice, falls at just the wrong time, crushing your car and causing severe physical and mental injuries. At the tender young age of 23 you're ability to enjoy normal activities is pretty much over, and there's not a chance that you will ever be able to work and be productive ever again.

  It's a terribly sad and tragic scenario, and we're all deeply sorry for your suffering, but exactly why is it our problem or our responsibility to provide for you?  If it is our responsibility to provide for you, what is the extent of that responsibility? And what responsibility do you owe in return?

  Here's the short version of my take on it. Especially since you aren't abusing the system we aren't going to stand by and let you starve, so we'll make sure your basic needs are met. We'll even go a bit beyond the essentials and try to provide some level of enjoyment of life. What we don't intend to do is make you rich, either directly or indirectly. The assistance you get should be considered a loan, even though we understand that you may never be able to pay it back. If your ability to generate income on your own becomes adequate, for any reason, to pay your own way and reimburse those who helped you when you needed it, then the loan should be repaid in whole or part.

  The devil is in the details. Some people will require constant care, and have bills that can't be covered by the income from a modest jackpot, or perhaps even a moderately big one.  Other people, including all but the most long-term abusers, will have received more modest amounts of assistance that could easily be paid back and still allow them to enjoy the same lifestyle provided by public assistance.
  
• justxploring

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 2:05 am

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  "Why does it matter whether it's easy to get the assistance, or why you're getting the assistance? It's assistance that comes from people who pay taxes because they have to." 

  When I wrote that, it was because everyone is posting as if you can just pick up the phone and get a check from the government because you are broke or sick.  That's all.  I actually wrote a long comment and deleted it because the topic is too general.

  Regarding payback, what does the lottery have to do with taxes?  Seriously, everyone keeps saying it's voluntary and it is not a tax.  So what or whom are you paying back?  Our taxes didn't pay for the lottery.

  By the way, you are reading me all wrong.  One of my biggest rants is how we reward people for living irresponsibly.   However, to me the lottery is a separate operation.  The question didn't address the amount of the jackpot either.  If someone wins a little money and pays it all back, they'll just be right back on assistance again.  I would love to see you try to enforce this. 
• weshar75

  

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  Dec 11, 2007, 1:15 pm

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  No.-weshar75
• KY Floyd

  

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  Dec 12, 2007, 2:08 am

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  In response to justxploring

  Quote: Originally posted by justxploring on Dec 11, 2007

  "Why does it matter whether it's easy to get the assistance, or why you're getting the assistance? It's assistance that comes from people who pay taxes because they have to." 

  When I wrote that, it was because everyone is posting as if you can just pick up the phone and get a check from the government because you are broke or sick.  That's all.  I actually wrote a long comment and deleted it because the topic is too general.

  Regarding payback, what does the lottery have to do with taxes?  Seriously, everyone keeps saying it's voluntary and it is not a tax.  So what or whom are you paying back?  Our taxes didn't pay for the lottery.

  By the way, you are reading me all wrong.  One of my biggest rants is how we reward people for living irresponsibly.   However, to me the lottery is a separate operation.  The question didn't address the amount of the jackpot either.  If someone wins a little money and pays it all back, they'll just be right back on assistance again.  I would love to see you try to enforce this. 

  I think most people realize it isn't quite that easy to get assistance even if you obviously qualify, but I also think most people agree that the system is broken and there's plenty of abuse. Like many things, it's a good idea that hasn't worked out as well as was hoped for.

  Of course the lottery and public assistance are separate operations, but that's not the point.  I don't care where somebody gets money from, whether it's the lottery, an inheritance from a rich uncle they never even knew about, or from inventing artificial gasoline that can be produced for ten cents a gallon. What matters is where the public assistance came from. When they needed help it came from the public, so if by some good fortune they find themselves with enough money to do so, the public that should be reimbursed.
  

  Most of the mechanism is already in place, or there would be no way to know who qualifies or how much they should get, but enforcement would be just like any other government program: inefficient to wasteful, on a case by case basis. For somebody who wins a modest amount it can be figured the same way any other income is accounted for. $100,000 means they have an income of 25 grand for the next four years, so for the next four years they get whatever assistance 25 grand a year qualifies them for. If they spend it too fast and don't have any left after 3 years I've got no problem with letting Darwin deal with them.