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# what is your thoughts on randomness is there structure even in chaos?

Topic closed. 32 replies. Last post 5 years ago by Ronnie316.

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texas
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September 15, 2003
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 10:10 am - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

Pinecrest Sephardim
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 10:23 am - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

Yes.100 percent.

mid-Ohio
United States
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March 24, 2001
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 12:54 pm - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

There are those who claim there are pattern in chaos but claiming it and proving it are two different things.  When considering lotteries, there are a fixed number of possible outcomes so there must be a fixed amount of chaos too.

* you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket *

Whiskey Island
United States
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April 24, 2010
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 1:04 pm - IP Logged

The only true act of randomness is the first draw in the game .

United States
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 1:09 pm - IP Logged

There are those who claim there are pattern in chaos but claiming it and proving it are two different things.  When considering lotteries, there are a fixed number of possible outcomes so there must be a fixed amount of chaos too.

patterns can be more than just claimed...they can be measured...with vtracs...

to have precise results variable tracking needs to be more than just last digits...

for example i track the occurrence of two last digit twos in one game...

currently in take five two last digit 5, two last digit, 1 and two last digit 2 offer the best chance at jackpot.

obvious patterns in Pick 5 games are

1)long shots

2)long bottoms

3)trend reversal or trend reversal fake (gail calls the fake something else)...the TR or TRF both hit twice in four draws...

btw the trend reversal...is one of the best patterns to bank on because you are assuming with 100% faith that a particular number will score within three draws...the faster the cheaper!

in pick5 there are two candidates 3 and 18 that i assume will hit within three days...all or nothing...do or die..

no balanced wheels...all two power numbers...

these are three easy patterns that do exist...i dont claim they exist...i actively track them...resulting in 11 four prize wins over 7 years...one easy missed jackpot over three years ago...and a whole lot of frustration...

i track also occurence of positional repeats....

there is no claiming...it is verified fact...

i track many patterns...unfortunately my spreadsheets have gotten a little to large and confusing...

so i need to rexamine my pattern recognition layout...for repeatablity...

i have more patterns to track...but i would like some help from some of you vba people...

i would be willing to share my discoveries.

as for rules...i cant say i have found some sort of ion saliu formula...but if i tried, i might be able to find some general rules for top ten hottest numbers

and top five worst numbers...

i believe there are only x amount of available patterns in a fixed matrix...and that each number is in its place...

that is how you find a jackpot.

the predictions board is supposed to be a tool to test this theory...but too many people making too many bets...especially in pick 3 and pick 4

i dont know of any member who kicks ass in jackpot games...

the true gambler plays the games that are in his favor...especialy 5/34 or 5/30, i dont even know why somebody would predict on a harder game without proving their mettle in a easier game...and playing more lines in more states doesn't make you a better player...it just means you will go broke faster in the real world...

if you look at the prediction board statistics...i dont see any good gamblers...just a lot of broke ass people!!

thats just my opinion...and winning the small jackpot is a good grubstake for the harder games...

Texas
United States
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January 30, 2010
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 10:35 pm - IP Logged

The only true act of randomness is the first draw in the game .

FINALLY! SOMEONE THAT SEES THIS GAME THE SAME WAY I DO!!!! Thank you so much, CW4!!! This is where it's at, players. If it weren't for so many pre-draws, 90% of the systems, methods, approaches, or, whatever you choose to call them, would absolutely work flawlessly. See, we as players, base this game on what's likely to NOT HAPPEN in terms of the next draw...right? Sure, I'm right and I know it. This is why the lotteries conduct all the lame pre-draws...so they can eliminate the possibilities of what we see as not happening again. In other words, the pre-draws make it to where the same things can happen over, and over, and over again in the same positions.

In all reality, from one draw to the next and with no pre-draws, most of you players are actually winners. I've covered this many, many times. I've checked my numbers and validated that I actually won on the very first pre-draw, and, ended up losing on the actual posted results after as many as (5) pre-draws. Excuse my french, but this is where the lotteries f*** all the players at! Todd, let me slide on that one, please, because I'm telling these people the absolute truth of this matter.

The pre-draws give the lotteries a sense of leverage, so to speak, in that it eliminates the idea of pairs, one number, a format, or anything else being duplicated. Again, since this is a game based on numbers, and, the removing of them thereof, they conduct pre-draws to make it possible for a player to still lose on what they've taken out...which is based on the idea of it not happening again. As CajunWin4 has already said it best, the only act of randomness here is the very (1st) draw after the last one....PERIOD!!!!

There is no true randomness in these games, people. Sorry if I've upset anyone in any way, okay. They claim the pre-draws are to make sure the machines are working properly, and, to provide randomness in the official draw. They can't do both...RIGHT? Each pre-draw throws out even the BEST LOTTERY SYSTEM out there...and I consider myself to be a pretty decent player after (10) years of juggling numbers!

Check this out. I can see why a card deal needs to re-shuffle the cards after hand...when he gathers them, they're all together and need to be broken up again. Cool. Lottery balls, however, are AUTOMATICALLY RE-SHUFFLED when the machine is FIRST STARTED UP, so there's no need for a pre-draw at all. Make sense? It does to LUCKY LOSER!!! There's nothing fair about a pre-draw...at all. NOTHING PREEMPTS RANDOMNESS...which is why it's called random. I rest my case.

L.L.

Whiskey Island
United States
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April 24, 2010
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 Posted: April 10, 2012, 10:54 pm - IP Logged

Thank You  , L.L

I could not have said it better ...

Everything should be made simple as possible , but not simpler ....

To many systems are over complicated tracking to many variables for game play .

CW4

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Wheeling, West VA
United States
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August 17, 2011
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 Posted: April 11, 2012, 1:53 am - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

Funny how this question just came to my mind when I noticed my Unix system shows up here in the Active Users list as Windows 7.

NASHVILLE, TENN
United States
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February 20, 2006
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 Posted: April 11, 2012, 11:55 am - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

There may be rules and there may not be rules.  At this point in time, no one knows for sure.  We are still looking, researching, trying new algorithms, and so on.

What we are doing is finding those things that do not work.  By eliminating the dead ends we are gaining on the Yellow Brick Road.

We will find that road one of these days and when we do, all the mathematicians will convene, scratch their heads, then pronounce that they knew all along the rules of random and will begin applying them to Social Darwinism.  Even LL will change his mind.

Texas
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January 30, 2010
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 Posted: April 11, 2012, 11:49 pm - IP Logged

There may be rules and there may not be rules.  At this point in time, no one knows for sure.  We are still looking, researching, trying new algorithms, and so on.

What we are doing is finding those things that do not work.  By eliminating the dead ends we are gaining on the Yellow Brick Road.

We will find that road one of these days and when we do, all the mathematicians will convene, scratch their heads, then pronounce that they knew all along the rules of random and will begin applying them to Social Darwinism.  Even LL will change his mind.

With the utmost respect to you and your thoughts, I seriously and highly beg to differ with your last sentence. I base this statement on all the points I've made previously regarding pre-draws, and, will this time provide a very simple example of my proofs. Let us take a looksie at the state of Delaware and its' last (4) draws IN A ROW. Position (C) has seen the number (3) drawn (4) consecutive times. I'm ready and willing to bet you some real good money that on the draw which took place RIGHT AFTER the last official results, and, the draw RIGHT BEFORE the next official result, the number (3) was not drawn at all.

Pre-draws are designed to "re-enter", if you will, what a player has taken out based on the overall likelyhood of that particular thing being drawn again...be it a single digit, pairs, format, etc. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about.

L.L.

Texas
United States
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January 30, 2010
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 Posted: April 12, 2012, 12:00 am - IP Logged

With the utmost respect to you and your thoughts, I seriously and highly beg to differ with your last sentence. I base this statement on all the points I've made previously regarding pre-draws, and, will this time provide a very simple example of my proofs. Let us take a looksie at the state of Delaware and its' last (4) draws IN A ROW. Position (C) has seen the number (3) drawn (4) consecutive times. I'm ready and willing to bet you some real good money that on the draw which took place RIGHT AFTER the last official results, and, the draw RIGHT BEFORE the next official result, the number (3) was not drawn at all.

Pre-draws are designed to "re-enter", if you will, what a player has taken out based on the overall likelyhood of that particular thing being drawn again...be it a single digit, pairs, format, etc. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about.

L.L.

The biggest losers in this particular state were the players who removed combinations that ended with the number (3), or, had no (3) in their numbers after the third draw. Guess what? Well, you can see what happened yourself. Been there, done that, learned the lesson. This will happen many, many, many, many more times in all states...due to the pre-draws. Pre-draws are the state lotteries' friend, buddy. They rake in lots of money by finding what a player has removed.

L.L.

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Taiwan
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April 12, 2012
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 Posted: April 12, 2012, 3:24 am - IP Logged

Hi I'm interested in your "pre-draw" fact here  and its consequences on lottery future draws

but our state emphasizes that there should be a pre-draw and here are the procedures:

Note: Mega gem are the lottery machine

1. The panel inspects each of the Mega Gems to be used in the draws for a draw day, including the interior of the blowing chamber and the blowing mechanisms. This is to make sure there is nothing hidden in the Mega Gems that will invalidate the entire draw, such as hidden balls or obstructions. The Mega Gems are also given a dry run using a set of unmarked ping-pong balls to test if they would work as they should come the actual draw.
2. The balls to be used in each game are stored inside briefcases. There are usually three cases of balls to be used on each game, distinguished by either numbers or uppercase or lowercase letters. The panel randomly chooses one set using cards and its chosen card is shown. In the lot games such as the Super Lotto 6/49 and EZ-2 Lotto, the balls are of one color, and each set may have a different color. In the digit games such as the 6-Digit Game, no matter the set chosen, each digit from 0 to 9 has a different color, and each set is identical.
3. After one set of balls has been chosen for a game, each of the balls is weighed to see if they have the same or almost the same weight using a digital scale. This part of the procedure is covered by a separate video camera, which will record any abnormal circumstance, such as ball switching or a ball which either is overweight or is too light, should it comes out.
4. After the balls for the game are weighted, they are loaded by hand by the head of the panel into the loading bays of the game's Mega Gem. This is the only first of the two times human intervention is needed as each Mega Gem is operated using a remote console stationed a small distance away from the unit. The second, never shown but implied, is the removal of the balls from the Mega Gem after each draw show has ended and the results of the draws are recorded. In the case of digit lottery games, the removal of balls is the third time, as the drawn balls are also adjusted (see below).

As you can see at number one it says there that the balls will be used are unmarked ping pong balls and not the balls to be used in draw,

my question is Does having pre-draw affects the future lottery draws at all? irregardless if the the materials used in the pre-draw are blank ping pong balls?

And the number 2 here is quite intriguing
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Taiwan
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April 12, 2012
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 Posted: April 12, 2012, 3:47 am - IP Logged

one more thing, had number 2 been a fact then were screwed because using the past draws as mirror for future draws would be a big trouble since we are dealing with many ball numbers,

example: draw 1 comes from briefcase A

draw 2 comes from briefcase C

draw 3 comes from briefcase A

and so forth.....

And another point to be taken is that the lottery officials change the briefcase name: for example- this draw the briefcase would be A B C, tomorrow it would  F U C, that is why tracking it would be hard

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Taiwan
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April 12, 2012
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 Posted: April 12, 2012, 8:45 am - IP Logged

what are your thoughts on random events is there structure even in chaos?

are there rules that even random events have to follow ?

Sorry about the rating , I accidentaly clicked it while the page is loading, <snip> I wish I could back it,

back to the topic umm there is one person here in LP that is expert in terms of "random structure", forgot his name, but he studied random almost his life (starting his 20's I think).... and he has a lot of facts, which you may judge like including how the lottery officials won't let you get a target "lock" in past draws which makes look like that lottery is random every draw and etc...

I hope he sees this thread and post some :)

This post has been automatically changed by the Lottery Post computer system to remove inappropriate content and/or spam.

texas
United States
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September 15, 2003
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 Posted: April 13, 2012, 1:20 am - IP Logged

my thoughts on randomness,,,say you were throwing dice,,if you knew everything about

the dice,,pull of gravity,,the weight how to throw them and so on and could manipulate

them every time,,,,random is no longer random...because you know the rules of that random event.

so in one sense of the word,,,there is no random event just properties were not aware of..

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