Welcome Guest
Log In | Register )
You last visited January 19, 2017, 4:14 pm
All times shown are
Eastern Time (GMT-5:00)

Hoosier Lottery Does It Again

Topic closed. 60 replies. Last post 11 years ago by scott_one.

Page 2 of 5
PrintE-mailLink
LosingJeff's avatar - flower
Greenfield
United States
Member #3587
February 2, 2004
557 Posts
Offline
Posted: January 12, 2006, 7:59 am - IP Logged

Excellent work Jim! I can assure you that the 8888's were not available, as I have a printout that states, "this number has been cutoff". Ready for this one? Just 2 days later on the evening of Jan 10, I went to the Liquor Store in Cumberland, Indiana to purchase the 8888's again. This time I played 4444's on the betslip also. Guess What? I got the 4444's, but the 8888's were unavailable again. Can you believe it? Yet, you say that the Hoosier Lottery doesnt know about it. That does not surprise me. I have mentioned before that they dont know what is going on in their own backyard. And of course, that is highly probable seeing how this organization wasn't looked at or audited for a 16 year period. We all know what happens when there are no vulnerability assessments done; STRANGE THINGS CAN GO ON! It is mind boggling to believe the amount of secrecy that is going on. It needs to stop. As Jim 695 and I have discussed before, there are too many coincidences too often. The low payouts are mathmatically impossible, as stated in an earlier post by Jim 695. If the daily games are being manipulated then don't you think it is far time the Hoosier Lottery updated the odds on the back of the playslip. That way Hoosiers will know not to play these daily games anymore. Based on past years losing tickets, Jim and I figured out that the real odds of hitting a straight pic 4 are no less than 1 in 40,000. In my case, it has been even greater. Although the stated odds are 1 in 10,000. Enough is enough. The secrecy has to stop and so does the RNG. 

" FUN IS BAD " ----causes Bankruptcy

    Avatar
    Columbia City, Indiana
    United States
    Member #2978
    December 9, 2003
    381 Posts
    Offline
    Posted: January 12, 2006, 2:10 pm - IP Logged

    Powerplayer:

    We've taken this case to no fewer than five different law firms, one of which was in Chicago, the rest here in Indiana. We never heard back from Chicago, but three Indiana attorneys have told us that what we have is "probably sufficient to convict on at least three RICO predicates (wire fraud, conspiracy to commit wire fraud and misappropriation of public funds)." That's the good news. The bad news is that none of them are willing to file the case because, and I quote, "...the statehouse can make it very difficult for us to make a living."

    We're still waiting to hear from the fourth Indiana attorney. He's had the file for about a year now, but at least he hasn't said, "No," and until he does, we'll continue to wait. We check in with him periodically, but until something major breaks in the newspaper, he probably won't do anything to endanger his own livelihood. We can't blame the attorneys for that.

    The most obvious answers don't always provide the easiest path to one's goals, and this situation is a prime example. We've had interviews scheduled with print and TV reporters, only to have those interviews mysteriously canceled at the last minute, without explanation. After that, the reporters won't even take our phone calls.

    We've shown our evidence to three state representatives, all of whom agree that what we have proves the Hoosier Lottery is fixing their games. They were appalled, indignant, disgusted and amazed, but they refuse to do anything about it, except to protect their secret source of non-accounted funds. Representative Alderman pretended to introduce a bill which would have overhauled the Hoosier Lottery, requiring them to use mechanical draw machines and to televise live drawings (which is already required by state law). The bill sailed through committee, but then died when the democrats staged a walkout. Many other, less important bills were resurrected and eventually passed, but the lottery bill was left to rot. Given all the problems this agency has suffered since its inception, I find it somewhat incredible that the Hoosier Lottery has never been audited, sued or otherwise thoroughly investigated in its entire seventeen-year history.

    There have been investigations, such as the one conducted by the Marion County Grand Jury when the Build Indiana Fund mysteriously went bankrupt. It came as no surprise when they announced that the results of their inquiry were "inconclusive," but imagine how shocked I was to learn that the legal counsel for the now-bankrupt Build Indiana Fund, one Janna Shisler, had suddenly secured the same position with the Hoosier Lottery! Recently, someone from the Marion County Grand Jury (I don't have this person's name handy, but it's on their website) accepted a position with the Hoosier Lottery while the scratch-off ticket scandal was still being investigated. This place stinks like last year's Easter eggs.

    Quite frankly, I couldn't care less if you believe the Hoosier Lottery is crooked. I've presented enough evidence on this forum in various threads to provide you with sufficient research material to change your mind, should you be open to the option.

    The standard argument here seems to be, "The Hoosier Lottery can't possibly be crooked, because look at what would happen if anyone found out about it." Well, someone did find out about it, and now we know what happens. Nothing happens; not to them; nothing bad, anyway. What does happen is that people who were working for the investigative body charged with looking into the scratch-off ticket scandal (Marion County Grand Jury) accept positions with the Hoosier Lottery, even before the investigation is closed. Another thing that happens is that hundreds of millions of dollars simply vanish, with no explanation or accountability. Laws are passed to exempt their authors from suffering any penalties or consequences for violating any other laws they write to govern us. 

    For the fifth time, I'll state that we've met with or contacted over fifty state and federal agencies and individuals (reporters, attorneys, state reps, etc.) about this crooked lottery. Those who are in a position to do something about it don't want anything done about it. All the others either express their sympathy or are just not interested because they don't live here.

    We've spent a considerable sum on gasoline, hotel rooms, copy fees and phone calls over the past three years. Nobody gave us that money; it came out of our pockets. We spend this money knowing we'll never get it back. We could buy Hoosier Lottery tickets with the same expectation, but if we spend it to go after these crooks and thieves, we actually have a chance to win, so we feel it's money well spent. 

    Those of you who choose not to believe a state lottery can or would do these things are certainly entitled to your opinions. The evidence we have will stand on its own merit, so I would appreciate it if, in the future, you would take the trouble to look at the evidence we have, or, barring that, to at least read the many posts on this subject before suggesting that our efforts are worthless. 

    Come, Pinky; we must prepare for tomorrow night...

    Jim

      Avatar
      Indiana
      United States
      Member #29196
      December 29, 2005
      280 Posts
      Offline
      Posted: January 13, 2006, 10:31 pm - IP Logged

      OK...Winning Jeff's post got me to thinking and I set out on a mission.  I work for a retailer that sells lottery and today I got on the terminal and looked at the "reports."  There is actually a report on the lottery terminal that will give you a print out of what numbers have been "cutoff."  And today's lucky cutoff number was (Drum roll please)...

      9999!   Yes that's right boys and girls, today's Hoosier Lottery Daily 4 evening coutoff number was Quad 9's!

      Tune in tomorrow to see if your numbers are the lucky cutoff numbers from the Hoosier Lottery.  And remember:

      "We may not have mandated liability limits but that doesn't stop us from cutting off your favorite numbers!"

      Jim 


      Money frees you from doing things you dislike.  Since I dislike doing nearly everything, money is handy.  - Groucho Marx

        LOTTOMIKE's avatar - Lottery-063.jpg
        Tennessee
        United States
        Member #7853
        October 15, 2004
        11338 Posts
        Offline
        Posted: January 13, 2006, 10:43 pm - IP Logged

        so 8888 wasn't cutoff today? lol,8888 one day and 9999 the next.its like they might know whats coming in and maybe they don't want too many people buying a number.if too many people then buy that number they then decide to let another number hit that not many people have bought thus they bring in the maximum profit everyday......this thing is starting to really stink.there has got to be a media outlet sooner or later to expose these crooked people they call lottery personnel in indiana.just think of all the fancy things they have bought with jeff's hard earned money.for all we know one of these directors could be building a house with money out of the coffers that jeff helped contribute too....lets take these people down.

          four4me's avatar - gate1
          MD
          United States
          Member #1701
          June 18, 2003
          8393 Posts
          Offline
          Posted: January 13, 2006, 11:35 pm - IP Logged

          Every lottery has a threshold limit as to how much can be bet on a number when they sell so many tickets that numbers is cut off.
           

           

            Avatar
            Indiana
            United States
            Member #29196
            December 29, 2005
            280 Posts
            Offline
            Posted: January 14, 2006, 8:51 pm - IP Logged

            OK...first an update: today Jan 14, 2006...the number 9999 was once again cut off by the Hoosier Lottery for the Daily 4 evening game.

            I'd like to address the comments above because I think some people don't quite understand what we're complaining about here in Indiana.  I don't know if every lottery has betting limits on certain numbers.  I know that some states have mandated liability limits and do cutoff betting on certain numbers when they reach those limits.  I have been researching the Hoosier Lottery for about 1 year now and my understanding is that they do not have mandated liability limits. 

            Now perhaps they have the authority (if that's the right word) to cutoff betting on certain numbers when it reaches what they believe to be the threshhold limit.  I don't know but that would seem to make sense.  But even if that's true you must remember that the Hoosier Lottery has a history of corruption and a culture of secrecy that makes even the most rational player paranoid about it's actions.  

            First it is important to remember that when the issue of cutoff numbers first came up, then Executive Director Jack Ross was forced to admit that they did in fact cut off betting on certain numbers.  I can't find his exact quote but he said words to the effect that it did happen once but that it hadn't for quite sometime before or and (I believe he said) it hadn't happened since.  It was according to him a very rare occurance. 

            Next you need to remember that I asked a Hoosier Lottery rep if this happened (with the 8888 number Jeff mentioned) and was told not to their knowledge (ok...fair enough a rep can't possibly know everything that goes on in the course of a day) but then the rep went on to say that they doubted it actually happened.  I have asked this question of the current Executive Director and she has not responded to my e-mail yet.

            Now so far this week Jeff has tried to bet 8888 twice and found the number cutoff.  I have looked twice this week and found the number 9999 cut off twice.  True enough this week could be a fluke.  But I will continue checking and see how often numbers are cutoff from betting.

            But the issue (to me) isn't that they cut off numbers to limit liability but rather there are 2 aspects that bother me.  

            1. Without mandated liability limits (those set by the General Assembly) who decides when and if betting on a certain number is cutoff?

            2. And given the secretive nature of the Hoosier Lottery I have to wonder why they just don't admit what they're doing and give the players an explanation. 

            Rather than deny the action and say it didn't happen why don't they simply say when we receive X number of bets on a certain number we cut off betting in order to limit our liability. 

            Simpy put if there's nothing funny going on...they've got nothing to hide so telling the truth isn't particularily harmful. 

            Jim

            PS As a footnote according to the Hoosier Lottery website media page on January 10, 2006 someone (finally!) hit Pick 4 straight and won $5000.  I haven't checked the statistics on a daily basis but this is the first time in the year I've been looking at Hoosier Lottery statistics (and media releases) that I remember someone hitting a straight Pick 4.  If anyone has information to the contrary please by all means post it. 


            Money frees you from doing things you dislike.  Since I dislike doing nearly everything, money is handy.  - Groucho Marx

              four4me's avatar - gate1
              MD
              United States
              Member #1701
              June 18, 2003
              8393 Posts
              Offline
              Posted: January 15, 2006, 12:32 am - IP Logged
              Uncle Jim when I say threshold limit I am referring to the amount that can be bet before a number would have to pay out an exuberant amount above and beyond a limit that is set whether that limit is set by the amount taken in one days receipts or an amount that is set say at 21 million or whatever amount that is established.

              Like here in Maryland that amount for pick 4 was established some time ago because people bet a pick 4 number that they clamed broke the bank. Well, it didn't actually break the lottery it is used as a colloquial term (the people broke the bank) in any event so many people played the same pick 4 number straight that they paid out way more than they take in on pick 4 digits in a given time frame so a limit was set on the amount of tickets that can be sold for any particular pick 3/4 number that might reach threshold liability limits. It is my understanding that many states also have this liability limit in force.

              Now I sometimes play quads and on New Year's Eve I couldn't purchase any tickets for quad 0's 9's or 8's because they were cut off. They weren't cut of because someone said lets not take in any bets on any quads today. they were cut of because they sold x amount of tickets. I didn't have a problem for getting them ahead of time so I purchased my 3 dollars worth of quads for January 1st. In fact most of the time I try and buy them ahead of time because I don't like the fact that they might be sold out. It is a know fact among serious lottery players in Maryland that quad 9's have never hit and there are many days that they are sold out along with several other popular numbers.


               

              Now if your saying that Indiana has the power to cut of certain numbers without taking in any bets on certain numbers then that is a matter for the attorney general or whomever oversees the lottery authority.

                four4me's avatar - gate1
                MD
                United States
                Member #1701
                June 18, 2003
                8393 Posts
                Offline
                Posted: January 15, 2006, 12:43 am - IP Logged

                An example of what i am refering too

                Maryland Lottery Pays Out $7 Million
                Friday Evening's Pick 4 Number: 1-2-1-2 Proved Lucky

                (Baltimore) - By 11 AM this morning, Maryland Lottery officials greeted nearly 40 players who arrived at their claim centers to collect cash prizes won in Friday evening's Pick 4 game. Thousands of other lucky winners are expected to collect their winnings across the state today.

                Friday evening's Pick 4 number, 1-2-1-2, was selected by so many players that it will pay out $7,000,000 million in prizes for the single drawing. "I had no idea that 1-2-1-2 broke the bank," said one lucky winner who came to collect her $5,000 prize. "I don't usually play that number but I kept hearing ‘12' over and over again at work and I decided to play."

                Lottery officials report that 7,817 winning tickets were sold, with players wagering more than $467,000 for Friday evening's drawing

                 

                Big John says. You don't hit the number. The number hits you!!!!

                               I'm not Big John, I'm Four4me, Big John's a friend.
                  paurths's avatar - underground
                  Switching between Fairfax, VA and Belgium
                  Belgium
                  Member #19287
                  July 29, 2005
                  2254 Posts
                  Offline
                  Posted: January 15, 2006, 6:17 am - IP Logged

                  Uncle Jim, 0909 came out in IN, pff, close...

                    Zoozie's avatar - back
                    South Fort Myers
                    United States
                    Member #26835
                    November 23, 2005
                    454 Posts
                    Offline
                    Posted: January 15, 2006, 8:34 am - IP Logged

                    Jim and Jeff - and other Hoosier Lotto Players (like myself)... PLAY ONLINE!  You can play for a quarter (instead of the $1 minimum at the store) and if you win, make a LOT more money!  By the way it sounds, quads may be hitting in Indiana.  Maybe I will throw a couple bucks and play all the quads for that state online.

                    Zoozie  Dance

                     

                    "Whatever the mind can conceive and believe, it can achieve"
                    Napoleon Hill

                      Avatar
                      Indiana
                      United States
                      Member #29196
                      December 29, 2005
                      280 Posts
                      Offline
                      Posted: January 15, 2006, 9:05 pm - IP Logged

                      @four4me:

                      I understand limits.  What I don't understand is by what authority and what criteria the Hoosier Lottery uses to invoke limits and why don't they just admit that they have them.

                      Remember the issue here is the culture of secrecy that dominates the Hoosier Lottery.  I say again if they've got nothing to hide why don't they admit to cutting off numbers and tell people what criteria they use to determine the cut off and why they cut off betting on certain numbers.  

                      By the way...9999 was cutoff again on today's Daily 4 Evening.

                      Jim   


                      Money frees you from doing things you dislike.  Since I dislike doing nearly everything, money is handy.  - Groucho Marx

                        four4me's avatar - gate1
                        MD
                        United States
                        Member #1701
                        June 18, 2003
                        8393 Posts
                        Offline
                        Posted: January 15, 2006, 11:44 pm - IP Logged

                        I cant answer for the Indiana lottery commission but I suspect that somewhere there are rules and regulations governing the games in Indiana. That information should be on file somewhere either at lottery headquarters or the state house. Wherever the records are kept.

                        I don't think there hiding info. you request I think you haven't reached the person or persons who have the correct answers. When I seek answers such as you all are seeking I don't call and speak with a receptionist I try and reach a lottery commissioner, director or the person in charge of answering lottery related questions. if I hit a brick wall then I take a trip to the lottery office.

                        I was able to get 9's here in Maryland today but 4's were sold out.

                         

                          Avatar
                          Indiana
                          United States
                          Member #29196
                          December 29, 2005
                          280 Posts
                          Offline
                          Posted: January 16, 2006, 1:11 am - IP Logged

                          @four4me:

                          I'm not trying to be confrontational here but you might want to read what I said a little closer.  To reiterate:

                          1. I asked an official Representative of the Hoosier Lottery if the number 8888 was blocked and why.  This is not a receptionist but rather a Field Rep who deals with retailers.  This rep said they had no knowledge of blocked numebrs and went on to say they didn't believe it happened.  Well clearly it did happen and does happen.

                          2. I sent an e-mail to the Executive Director of the Hoosier Lottery last week.  You can't get much higher up the food chain than that.  Only a few days have gone by but as of yet I haven't received an answer.

                          The issue with me isn't so much that they cutoff betting on certain numbers.  The issue with me is that they deny it and/or won't answer the question.  It is the culture of secrecy and indeed the arrogance of the Hoosier Lottery that I take exception to. 

                          These are simple straight forward questions I'm asking and they should be answered with simple straight forward answers.  The fact that they are not gives rise to suspicion.  The history of scandal and corruption at the Hoosier Lottery only serves to deepen the suspicion.  There may be a perfectly rational explanation for what they are doing.  But the denials and the refusal to answer makes it seem like there is something amiss.

                          I say again if there's nothing funny going on then they have nothing to hide and nothing to fear by answering the question.

                          That's as simple as I can make it.

                          If and when I get an answer from the Executive Director then I will pass it on to the readers here.   

                          Jim   


                          Money frees you from doing things you dislike.  Since I dislike doing nearly everything, money is handy.  - Groucho Marx

                            four4me's avatar - gate1
                            MD
                            United States
                            Member #1701
                            June 18, 2003
                            8393 Posts
                            Offline
                            Posted: January 16, 2006, 1:38 am - IP Logged

                            Uncle Jim and I also am not trying to be asinine. On a daily basis they probably handle thousands of calls concerning many different questions and a lot of the calls are from people complaining that their particular number didn't hit and why won't there number hit and how come they drew 5923 instead of 5924 and so on and so on to the point that they are just plain tired of the annoying calls that people make. Bureaucracy in answering questions of any state or local government office worker be it the boss or a subordinate is usually replied with the easiest generic reply possible as to not ire the petitioner. I don't know how many times I tried to contact and get proper answers for any questions I might have regarding Affairs with the Veterans organization's. And I usually end up having to go straight down to the local office and dealing with matters in a more straight forward approach. I don't doubt for one-second that your state lottery has some underhanded practices. As is evident in the many post that concerning they Indiana lottery. Trying to get a proper answer from a lottery department might require similar steps. I feel for you all in that it irks me to no end to try and get answers and then end up having more questions that what I originally requested. If I lived there I would probably be arrested for confronting the lottery personnel in any and every chance I had the ability to ask questions in any open format at the lottery headquarters.

                              LOTTOMIKE's avatar - Lottery-063.jpg
                              Tennessee
                              United States
                              Member #7853
                              October 15, 2004
                              11338 Posts
                              Offline
                              Posted: January 16, 2006, 6:41 am - IP Logged

                              i'm going to make a prediction....i think at some point here in the near future someone is going to expose them and its going to be HUGE.maybe a disgruntled boss or someone that has a motive for revenge and then the media is going to get involved and its going to have some effects in indiana......the truth always comes out eventually.