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Money Matters 101

Topic closed. 131 replies. Last post 7 years ago by dr65.

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x1kosmic's avatar - neptune vg2.gif

United States
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Posted: August 10, 2009, 2:53 pm - IP Logged

          .....kinda looks like your saying

It takes money, to make money.       As I don't really play pick 3 or 4,  (mabey that lucky shot once a month)

  The scary part  for me would be that initial down-payment,   and my system (which I don't have)

        better start to produce within the first few draws,  or I'm in the hole big time.

                                        just an initial thought.


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    May 26, 2009
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    Posted: August 10, 2009, 11:11 pm - IP Logged

              .....kinda looks like your saying

    It takes money, to make money.       As I don't really play pick 3 or 4,  (mabey that lucky shot once a month)

      The scary part  for me would be that initial down-payment,   and my system (which I don't have)

            better start to produce within the first few draws,  or I'm in the hole big time.

                                            just an initial thought.

    It does take money to make money and this is especially true with any Lottery game. People do win from playing a few bucks but, there's really no strategy behind it. The winning number(s) drawn just happened to coincide with that person's selection of picks and if they tried to do that same thing again, the chances of the outcome being duplicated are extremely slim. That luck would move on to someone else.

    The right approach would be to have your system tailored to play certain types of drawings and only play when the conditions are right. I don't play every drawing unless I find the ones that meet my system's criteria for every draw. To be perfectly honest, it's not hard for me to find them at all because the numbers typically do (4) things very consistently from one draw to the next and I stated this when I first came to LP.

    It's important to just monitor behavior and design around what you see as being consistent. Believe it or not but, although this is a random game and anything can happen, there is a definite pattern to the random. You will never hear anyone else say that because they won't believe it or take the time to actually see it. When one can compile all this information together and validate their findings, only then can they develop a true system which produces consistent wins pretty much at will.

    But, to regress to my original point, it certainly costs money to accomplish this and is well worth it...at least in my opinion which this revolves around. The whole idea behind this is to cover enough ground to where each time you win, you're recovering your investment and when this is done you're not fronting the money to play anymore. Wouldn't it feel good knowing when you have to take that hit one day, you're not losing your own money? Just some food for thought...and I do appreciate your honesty.

      dr65's avatar - black panther.jpg
      Pennsylvania
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      Posted: August 10, 2009, 11:37 pm - IP Logged

      Matchmaker, did you escape again?

      You have too many numbers to play.

      That in itself is a profit eater.

      $75.00 profit isn't going very far at all playing like you want to play.


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        Posted: August 10, 2009, 11:52 pm - IP Logged

        Matchmaker, did you escape again?

        You have too many numbers to play.

        That in itself is a profit eater.

        $75.00 profit isn't going very far at all playing like you want to play.

        Yeah, but what we're dealing with here is consistency which requires a robust amount of numbers played. Try not to focus on "just" the $75 profit but, rather how fast you've made the $150.00 back in two wins which includes the first win. At this point, does making $75 in clear profit still sound shabby? This is only if you play once per day, also. Can you not use $150.00 extra dollars in addition to your day job which doesn't take eight hours to make? Best thing is, nothing changes except the profit which rises with the wager because the system is already "set" at 600 total numbers in this case. At $1.00 per number, this generates $300.00 on a $900.00 payout.

        Please try and understand the numbers here and you'll see what I'm gettin' at. I appreciate your input as well.

          RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
          mid-Ohio
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          Posted: August 10, 2009, 11:53 pm - IP Logged

          .... to regress to my original point, it certainly costs money to accomplish this and is well worth it...at least in my opinion..... 

          Matchmaker, the problem with your strategy is it's based on your opinions, not facts.

          If you had a strategy to make money playing lotteries and you wanted to share it, you could simply state these are the combinations I'm playing for this game on this date for this amount.  Then anyone interested could check the game results and payouts for that date and decide for themselves if you made a profit.

           * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
             
                       Evil Looking       


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            Posted: August 11, 2009, 12:04 am - IP Logged

            .... to regress to my original point, it certainly costs money to accomplish this and is well worth it...at least in my opinion..... 

            Matchmaker, the problem with your strategy is it's based on your opinions, not facts.

            If you had a strategy to make money playing lotteries and you wanted to share it, you could simply state these are the combinations I'm playing for this game on this date for this amount.  Then anyone interested could check the game results and payouts for that date and decide for themselves if you made a profit.

            Okay, that's reasonable and I just might take you up on that. However, the profit will be there because the cost is still lesser than the payout in all instances. With me? See, most people look at "profit" the wrong way when it comes to these Pick games. Profit occurs when you've made above and beyond what you have in anything. Spending $25 on Pick 3 and actually winning anything over that is profit. However, this also happens when you invested $150.00 and win $75.00 in profit based on a $225.00 payout and eclipsing that investment. Everything won after that investment is satisfied is pure profit. It's good to hear from you.

              RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
              mid-Ohio
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              Posted: August 11, 2009, 12:16 am - IP Logged

              Okay, that's reasonable and I just might take you up on that. However, the profit will be there because the cost is still lesser than the payout in all instances. With me? See, most people look at "profit" the wrong way when it comes to these Pick games. Profit occurs when you've made above and beyond what you have in anything. Spending $25 on Pick 3 and actually winning anything over that is profit. However, this also happens when you invested $150.00 and win $75.00 in profit based on a $225.00 payout and eclipsing that investment. Everything won after that investment is satisfied is pure profit. It's good to hear from you.

              Okay, that's reasonable and I just might take you up on that.

              If you do and you show even a nickle profit, you will be first as far as I know since I've been coming here.

               * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
                 
                           Evil Looking       

                BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
                Dump Water Florida
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                Posted: August 11, 2009, 3:11 am - IP Logged

                Ok, you're describing a wager doubling system.  600 straight plays at the lowest buyin of .25, then .50, then .75 then 1.00 per play.   The most you can lose is $150. of your own money, though when I win money I consider all of it mine!

                Playing 600 out of 1,000 is still expected to be 6 wins out of 10 draws played with 4 losses and they don't have to come in clusters.  Win, Lose, Win, Lose, Win, Win, Win, Lose, Win, Lose . . . any order, the average should remain except for the power of the system.    Whatchagot? 

                BobP


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                  Posted: August 11, 2009, 11:23 am - IP Logged

                  Ok, you're describing a wager doubling system.  600 straight plays at the lowest buyin of .25, then .50, then .75 then 1.00 per play.   The most you can lose is $150. of your own money, though when I win money I consider all of it mine!

                  Playing 600 out of 1,000 is still expected to be 6 wins out of 10 draws played with 4 losses and they don't have to come in clusters.  Win, Lose, Win, Lose, Win, Win, Win, Lose, Win, Lose . . . any order, the average should remain except for the power of the system.    Whatchagot? 

                  BobP

                  Hi Bob. You and I talked very briefly once before about high buy in to make a low but consistent profit. At the time, I wasn't sure if you really believed and understood that I knew what I was talking about. You'll have to tell me more about the wager doubling system because I'm not sure that I know what it is. Anyhow, here is the conclusion I arrived at in order to play with all the numbers set before me and I'll stick with .25 cent wagers so people can see the affordabilty.

                  Half of $225.00 is $112.50 which means that you'd actually be playing the house "dollar for dollar". In other words, for every dollar you put up they also "put up" a dollar and when you win it's a $112.50 profit hence "half" of the total payout is won. Make sense? This ratio is very attainable as I've tried it but, it's very tricky and risky because you're only playing with a total of 450 numbers and the win, lose, win, lose you described has a better chance of prevailing. Less numbers and worse odds. 

                  I decided to severely offset the investment/profit ratio into the "negative" by spending a lot more (more numbers) and sacrificing that "possible" big profit margin for a lesser yet consistent profit I could count on. I figured, after crunching and testing in (50) number increments, that the magic number was 600 at an absolute minimum. This translates into the $150.00 I've been discussing @ .25 cent / number. Now, the next magic number involved is $75.00 which is the profit created and allows one to quickly and safely recover their initial investment in two plays.

                  At $300.00 the money is recovered as you can see. Also, this $75.00 allows the player to immediately move on to the next possible wager / payout amount for more money with minimal plays involved. See, it's inevitable that a player will eventually lose even with the best system out there if they keep playing. So, what these numbers do is allow the player to cover as much ground as possibly safe while making descent money. A dedicated system will allow you to be very picky with your drawings and win very easily at least 85%-90% of the time. How many times one has to play is factored into this, okay.

                  I said that when I first came to LP and I'm sticking with it because it works. joker17 and I have our spats but, I'll give credit where it's due. I was hoping he'd see the light when he posted that set of numbers and challenged that he could do the same thing I could with lots of numbers and he pretty much did. If he'd use the same system and just add a more generous amount of numbers, he'd be a happy man so long as the cost didn't scare him.

                  You need not worry about much about losing if you only play those drawings which your system is specifically designed to work with. This is why it's called a system...it will only work with predetermined conditions implemented by the player based on monitored behavior. If you don't find it, don't play and this is the protocol with Pick 3. Safety is always first and is directly related to odds in this game, and, equates to an easier win which can produce more money. Easy money is the term for this and it does exist.

                  So, basically, the win averages are in the player's control so long as they're not "stingy" with their numbers. All I can say is that this works and is very dependable if you take the time to incorporate it into your system and not get greedy. So many people here have said "anyone can play lots of numbers and get those hits". I totally agree...

                  Glad you jumped in, Bob.

                    BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
                    Dump Water Florida
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                    Posted: August 11, 2009, 6:26 pm - IP Logged

                    Call it a stepping system instead of doubling because the .75 throws that name off, .25 to .50. to $1. to $2 would be doubling the wager after a win.

                    What I don't understand is if the goal is to make $75 profit, why not play boxed doubles?

                    Wait out about five draws or so until doubles are due and put .50 on all 90 boxed doubles, cost is $45 toward a prize of $150.  If we lose there is enough room in the $150 prize for two more tries to recover our investment and still show a small profit.

                    Of course with a win we can double the next bet to $1 on all 90 boxed doubles toward a prize of $300.  followed by $2 on all 90 for $600 followed by $4 on all 90 for $1,200.  or write yourself a paycheck at any point and play with what's left as the new starting point.

                    The shame is these payouts are online where our state lotteries should be and open to all players with a fair return.  Only government would consider a 50% return to be fair.  Even at the state return we can play all 90 doubles for $90 for a $160 prize and there is no house limit on doubling wagers, but there is no soft landing pillow of two more tries at less profit to try again if we lose.

                    BobP

                    Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day.  Teach a man to play lotto and he will dream about eating for the rest of his life.

                      Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
                      Zeta Reticuli Star System
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                      Posted: August 11, 2009, 7:17 pm - IP Logged

                      Ok, you're describing a wager doubling system.  600 straight plays at the lowest buyin of .25, then .50, then .75 then 1.00 per play.   The most you can lose is $150. of your own money, though when I win money I consider all of it mine!

                      Playing 600 out of 1,000 is still expected to be 6 wins out of 10 draws played with 4 losses and they don't have to come in clusters.  Win, Lose, Win, Lose, Win, Win, Win, Lose, Win, Lose . . . any order, the average should remain except for the power of the system.    Whatchagot? 

                      BobP

                      OK, you guys have lost me here, or I'm figuring it wrong, or you're figuring it wrong.

                      600 X .25 = $150 right there, no? If you don;t hit with the 25 cwnt ppays you are already stuuck $150, so if the next comes .50 and then .75, how is $150 the most you can lose?

                      So another 600 X .50 = $300 and 600 X .75 = $450.

                      If you run onto a wall- WHICH IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN ANY FORM OF GAMBLING - you are already stuck $150 + 300 + $450, which is $900.

                      From that point on you're playing catch-up.

                      One of the major tenets of gambling 101 is NEVER ASSUME A WIN. 

                      Anyone assuming a win in lotto is their own worst enemy.

                      If my figuruing is wrong, then my faux pas, but if it's not, this is the kind of hype system sellers and touts use and no one is supposed to catch.

                      "Hey stick, tell 'em double up and catch up, it males a lot of money for the house."

                      - Las vegas dice pit boss to stickman on a crap table.

                      See my sigs, especially the last two.

                      Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

                      Lep

                      There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

                        BobP's avatar - bobp avatar.png
                        Dump Water Florida
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                        Posted: August 12, 2009, 4:13 am - IP Logged


                        As I understand the system, he only increases the bet after a win using house money.  If he loses he loses $150. and starts again.   You could even pocket your original investment and start again with only the house money.

                        An ideal money management system will allow you some losses, but you don't win as fast.  People work these systems out all the time for roulette, trying to squeeze in one more doubling before hitting the house limit.  All you have to do is keep on winning.

                        BobP

                          Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
                          Zeta Reticuli Star System
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                          Posted: August 12, 2009, 10:24 am - IP Logged

                          BobP

                          "People work these systems out all the time for roulette, trying to squeeze in one more doubling before hitting the house limit"

                          Right you are there, and that's why there is a house limit. But as John Scarne and others have said, anyone who would be willing to keep doubling up to show a profit of one chip (whatever denomination they are betting) isn't exactly a "feared player" by the house.

                          "Red (or black) can't possibly hit again" has been the ruin of many a roulette player trying out a system.

                          You know those post they have now with the last 20 or so spins of the wheel on them? since the casinos put thos in, the money volune on roulette increased by 22 %.

                          The game is a apin to deal because it attracts so many system players.

                          You're still confusing me here:

                          "As I understand the system, he only increases the bet after a win usinghouse money.  If he loses he loses $150. and starts again."

                          Since you said the most you can lose is $150, what if you lose two or three drawings in a row here? Then you're stuck $300 or $450. Like I said, never assume a win. In any game, players are going to run into a wall (a long cold streak).

                          This still sounds liike a system seller to me not warning people of the potential flaws. The average lottery player isn't going to play 600 numbers on a drawing.

                          Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

                          Lep

                          There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

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                            Kentucky
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                            Posted: August 12, 2009, 11:30 am - IP Logged

                            BobP

                            "People work these systems out all the time for roulette, trying to squeeze in one more doubling before hitting the house limit"

                            Right you are there, and that's why there is a house limit. But as John Scarne and others have said, anyone who would be willing to keep doubling up to show a profit of one chip (whatever denomination they are betting) isn't exactly a "feared player" by the house.

                            "Red (or black) can't possibly hit again" has been the ruin of many a roulette player trying out a system.

                            You know those post they have now with the last 20 or so spins of the wheel on them? since the casinos put thos in, the money volune on roulette increased by 22 %.

                            The game is a apin to deal because it attracts so many system players.

                            You're still confusing me here:

                            "As I understand the system, he only increases the bet after a win usinghouse money.  If he loses he loses $150. and starts again."

                            Since you said the most you can lose is $150, what if you lose two or three drawings in a row here? Then you're stuck $300 or $450. Like I said, never assume a win. In any game, players are going to run into a wall (a long cold streak).

                            This still sounds liike a system seller to me not warning people of the potential flaws. The average lottery player isn't going to play 600 numbers on a drawing.

                            Because they are playing 600 numbers, they have a 60% chance of winning in each drawing and it sounds great until we do the math. If they play 10 drawings they should win 6 of them but would still lose $150 unless they double up after a win and win in two consecutive drawings. The key would be choosing which 600 numbers to play and giving yourself the best chance of winning two or more days in a row.


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                              Posted: August 12, 2009, 1:38 pm - IP Logged


                              As I understand the system, he only increases the bet after a win using house money.  If he loses he loses $150. and starts again.   You could even pocket your original investment and start again with only the house money.

                              An ideal money management system will allow you some losses, but you don't win as fast.  People work these systems out all the time for roulette, trying to squeeze in one more doubling before hitting the house limit.  All you have to do is keep on winning.

                              BobP

                              Bob, you're right on point with what I'm saying here, and, actually what I'm using to play as we speak. This isn't some marketing deal as it's been said already. I made it clear when I started this thread that I'M NOT trying to market anything here. Rather, it's simply demonstrating the efficiency of a true system in addition to using a given amount of numbers to produce consistency with a lower profit.

                              The key ingredient here is playing ONLY when ideal conditions are conducive to the system winning the draw and NOT playing every single draw. However, with so many numbers being played, it's very hard to miss the hit evn with a random draw. This system isn't perfect but, it allows one to get ahead in the money / profit very quickly so long as you're patient and don't deviate from what you've designed it to do. It's a system of duplicated production.

                              CoinToss and the other fella have these percentages all wrong and I'll tell you why. Playing 600 out of 1,000 numbers DOES NOT mean you only have a 60% chance of winning. Dead wrong. The reason why is because these numbers are constantly repeating themselves from draw to draw in some fashion. Whether it's a single number being drawn again in the same place it was before, a pair of numbers, a "complimenting pair" of numbers, a range-sum of numbers etc. This repeated activity increases the hit ratio automatically and as long as you're meeting at least two of these criterias, your chances are very high...consistently.

                              This isn't based on just sums but, check this out. The average sum range in ALL states is around 11-19 (approx.) which means that all the sums inclusive of that range has a toal of 600 numbers. I did the math and have the spreadsheet to prove it. Now, this is a very "short" range to play and is deadly to play despite its' consistency. Sums generally only move within (3) to (5) points of each other drawing to drawing and this is proven as well. But, they do move by as much as(10)  points and even more which will take you out of that 11-19 range and you lose even though ALL the numbers are there.

                              Now, the worse part about this is that once the sum range "shifts", it also stays there for a couple of drawings, "maybe". This is a BIG maybe, too. This "shift" in sum actually begins with a shift in the single digit contained in each column as most of the time, the digit itself only moves within (2) to (4) spaces forward or backwards. Look into this as well, guys. It pans out. When this single digit makes a move beyond (5) spaces, it's actually on its' way "back to itself". This is becasue we're only dealing with a scale of and including 0-9 and it's possible that when that digit makes such a big move that it's actually "eclipsing" the scale.

                              In other words, if 3 goes to 9 it doesn't necessarily mean it moved (7) spaces inluding itself. It could've went backwards (5) to arrive at that same digit. This might make perfect sense to some and be a complete blur to others. Either way, I've learned over the years to keep an open mind with this game and consider ALL possibilites which is how I've arrived at my current level of play and success. I'm now trying to share what I believe to be the absolute best way to approach playing this game.

                              You must learn to duplicate, via true system, what the numbers are duplicating and it's only then that you'll be successful with winning. As usual, I will end this comment with what this whole thread deals with: It costs to accomplish such a thing but is well worth it due to repetitve nature of the drawings.

                              Again, I will give credit where it's really due. RJOH has a cliche attached to his avatar stating that what happens most will most likely happen again. This is true and works hand in hand with a dedicated system of approach...THE EPITOMY OF A SYSTEM.

                              Bob, I know you're gonna do some number crunchin'. Let me know how you come out as I firmly believe you'll agree with everything said here. There is ONE thing numbers don't do and that's LIE. ONE thing they always do is PRODUCE the same product over, and over, and over again...