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Are QPs randomly generated numbers?

Topic closed. 181 replies. Last post 4 years ago by RJOh.

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Posted: October 5, 2012, 8:03 pm - IP Logged

Just wondering if anyone has ever inquired of the software company if the numbers generated are random or does it systematically use up all the possible combinations and than start over??

    Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

    Bahamas
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    Posted: October 5, 2012, 8:11 pm - IP Logged

    During high jackpots when lottery officials report all combinations have been sold, I have been driven to question this as well. Not sure what algorithms are in use.

    "Everything works  ONCE!"

      RJOh's avatar - chipmunk
      mid-Ohio
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      Posted: October 5, 2012, 8:40 pm - IP Logged

      Just wondering if anyone has ever inquired of the software company if the numbers generated are random or does it systematically use up all the possible combinations and than start over??

      If combinations are randomly picked then there can be no guarantee that all possible combinations are ever picked because then you would be targeting combinations that hadn't been picked. 

      Random is like pulling one of the millions of combinations out of a barrel, reading it and replacing it back into the barrel.  Every combination has an equal chance of being picked every time one is pulled out of the barrel.

       * you don't need to buy more tickets, just buy a winning ticket * 
         
                   Evil Looking       


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        Posted: October 5, 2012, 8:44 pm - IP Logged

        Right   RJOh, I have never heard of "reports that all combinations have been sold"

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          Kentucky
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          Posted: October 5, 2012, 8:58 pm - IP Logged

          Just wondering if anyone has ever inquired of the software company if the numbers generated are random or does it systematically use up all the possible combinations and than start over??

          The odds of matching MM's bonus number is 75 to 1 so theoretically there should be 75 five number matches to expect a jackpot winner or $293 million in QP ticket sales. If they do in fact systematically sell combinations, it would be the five number combos because they all probably get a random bonus number. A way to determine that would be to divide the total ticket sales for a drawing by 3.9 million and see if the number of five number matches is about the same.

          The total sales includes self picks so if 70% of the 17 million tickets sold for Tuesday's drawing were QPs, there should be 3 five number matches and there were. Most lottery websites say the machines will generate a random combination, which is true even if they print out all 3.9 million five number combos and start over when all the 3.9 million combos are sold if each combo is given a randomly generated bonus number.

            savagegoose's avatar - ProfilePho
            adelaide sa
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            Posted: October 6, 2012, 12:08 am - IP Logged

            there was a report of something like 18 qps being spat out all with the same numbers. it was on texas lotto report ill see if i can find

            ok it was 7 repeat QP's

             

            something non random going on there

             

            <snip>/PBDuplicateQPs.htm

             

             

            This post has been automatically changed by the Lottery Post computer system to remove inappropriate content and/or spam.

            2014 = -1016; 2015= -1409; 2016 JAN = -106; FEB= -81; MAR= -131; APR= - 87: MAY= -91; JUN= -39; JUL=-134; AUG= -124; SEP = -123; OCT= -84  NOV=- 73 TOT= -3498

            keno historic = -2291 ; 2015= -603; 2016= JAN=-32, FEB= +12 , MAR= -86, APR = -77. MAY= -48, JUN= -29, JUL=-71; AUG = -52; SEPT= -43; OCT = +56 NOV = -33 TOT= -3297

              Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

              Bahamas
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              Posted: October 6, 2012, 12:29 am - IP Logged

              Right   RJOh, I have never heard of "reports that all combinations have been sold"

              In the L A Times dated March 30th, officials gave an estimate that 95% of all combinations would be sold by draw time, but not that all were sold.

              "Everything works  ONCE!"

                Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                Posted: October 6, 2012, 10:54 am - IP Logged

                If combinations are randomly picked then there can be no guarantee that all possible combinations are ever picked because then you would be targeting combinations that hadn't been picked. 

                Random is like pulling one of the millions of combinations out of a barrel, reading it and replacing it back into the barrel.  Every combination has an equal chance of being picked every time one is pulled out of the barrel.

                This is the best answer on the block...especially the part about targeting combinations that haven't been picked. In my opinion, a truly random draw is to go from one single draw to the very next without any pre-tests. But, this idea directly supports the odds (likelihood) of a particular thing NOT occurring again although those same numbers/combinations are in the barrel. Those officials fully understand that all these games are based on systematically eliminating certain things according to history. Pre-testing simply puts those things right back into the mix, and, allows it happen again in the very next draw...partially or wholely.

                For this reason, we see the same numbers being drawn in the same position frequently. Gotta ask yourself how they manage to draw the same number, out of (56), AGAIN from one draw to the next. What happens in between makes all the difference in the world. Otherwise, RJOh, the second part of your first sentence would prevail everytime and we'd have more strategic winners. 

                 

                L.L.

                 

                Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....

                There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.

                #lotto-4-a-living


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                  Posted: October 6, 2012, 10:58 am - IP Logged

                  If I understand you correctly LL, you are saying that you can predict the pre-draw but NOT the actual draw.

                  Interesting to say the least.........

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                    Zeta Reticuli Star System
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                    Posted: October 6, 2012, 11:13 am - IP Logged

                    Just wondering if anyone has ever inquired of the software company if the numbers generated are random or does it systematically use up all the possible combinations and than start over??

                    There have been times when the Illinois Pick 5 game (it was Little Lotto then) had jackpots close to or slightly over $1M, got a lot of play, and the JP was split by 3,4, or 5 players. sometimes all had played a QP, so I don't think all combinations were used and then started over.

                    Granted that's a game with odds of half a million, not multi-millions, but I'd guess the QP method is the same for all games.

                    Those who run the lotteries love it when players look for consistency in something that's designed not to have any.

                    Lep

                    There is one and only one 'proven' system, and that is to book the action. No matter the game, let the players pick their own losers.

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                      Chief Bottle Washer
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                      Posted: October 6, 2012, 11:21 am - IP Logged

                      The Quick Picks are random numbers generated by the lottery terminal itself.  They are not drawn from a master list of numbers until the list is exhausted.

                      However, my feeling is that the random number generators built into lottery terminals tend to be pretty poor, very basic psuedo-random number generators.  They are fine for last-minute ticket buys, but if you have the time and you still want random numbers, I would recommend using Lottery Post's Quick Picks Generator, which uses a much better random number generator than you can find elsewhere.

                       

                      Check the State Lottery Report Card
                      What grade did your lottery earn?

                       

                      Sign the Petition for True Lottery Drawings
                      Help eliminate computerized drawings!

                        Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                        Posted: October 6, 2012, 11:55 am - IP Logged

                        If I understand you correctly LL, you are saying that you can predict the pre-draw but NOT the actual draw.

                        Interesting to say the least.........

                        Actually, I'm saying the opposite of this. Ronnie, you're very sharp with numbers, and, I consider myself to be pretty decent as well. You've proven that with enough money and strategic combinations involved, a person can actually win on such a large game like PB. I mean, you've done it and it's not even rocket science. Numbers and money simply go hand in hand in this regard. What I'm getting at is this: the same thing(s) that won on the last official results can win on the next official results directly due to the process of pre-tests.

                        Even though they claim it's to promote fairness, randomness, and proper function of the machines, it still begins with every single possible combination AS A BI-PRODUCT OF PRE-TESTS. With a truly random process with no pre-tests whatsoever, the odds of certain numbers/combinations re-occurring again in the next draw are extremely slim. Without pre-tests, players like you and I could team up with someone with very deep pockets and actually win on (5) of (5) with the odds in our favor. Pre-tests remove our favor by allowing what we'd probably remove (combination-wise), and, put it back into the mix.

                        Ronnie, here's an actual test we did. We purchased (56) ping-pong balls, numbered them, and placed them into a bucket. One person put a lid on the bucket and then the next person picked it up and shook it. Then, the lid was removed and the bucket placed "behind" me while I was blind-folded. I reached in and grabbed a ball (10) times in a row with no "pre-grabs", simulating no pre-tests. I never once grabbed the same ball and this is no BS. Just one grab to the next with the same exact same process.

                        We did the same thing simulating Pick 3 and only had (10) balls in the bucket. I grabbed (10) times and grabbed the same ball only (1) time. In both tests, with several pre-grabs involved, we realized repeated balls in different simulated positioning. In my opinion, it's all about the odds of something re-occurring and the money to cover those odds. With pre-tests, you have to cover much more. Without them, you can cover much less and win with more certainty. Just my .02.

                        I completely support most of your studies here because they make perfect sense.Thumbs Up

                         

                        L.L.

                         

                        Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....

                        There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.

                        #lotto-4-a-living

                          Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

                          Bahamas
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                          Posted: October 6, 2012, 12:05 pm - IP Logged

                          Actually, I'm saying the opposite of this. Ronnie, you're very sharp with numbers, and, I consider myself to be pretty decent as well. You've proven that with enough money and strategic combinations involved, a person can actually win on such a large game like PB. I mean, you've done it and it's not even rocket science. Numbers and money simply go hand in hand in this regard. What I'm getting at is this: the same thing(s) that won on the last official results can win on the next official results directly due to the process of pre-tests.

                          Even though they claim it's to promote fairness, randomness, and proper function of the machines, it still begins with every single possible combination AS A BI-PRODUCT OF PRE-TESTS. With a truly random process with no pre-tests whatsoever, the odds of certain numbers/combinations re-occurring again in the next draw are extremely slim. Without pre-tests, players like you and I could team up with someone with very deep pockets and actually win on (5) of (5) with the odds in our favor. Pre-tests remove our favor by allowing what we'd probably remove (combination-wise), and, put it back into the mix.

                          Ronnie, here's an actual test we did. We purchased (56) ping-pong balls, numbered them, and placed them into a bucket. One person put a lid on the bucket and then the next person picked it up and shook it. Then, the lid was removed and the bucket placed "behind" me while I was blind-folded. I reached in and grabbed a ball (10) times in a row with no "pre-grabs", simulating no pre-tests. I never once grabbed the same ball and this is no BS. Just one grab to the next with the same exact same process.

                          We did the same thing simulating Pick 3 and only had (10) balls in the bucket. I grabbed (10) times and grabbed the same ball only (1) time. In both tests, with several pre-grabs involved, we realized repeated balls in different simulated positioning. In my opinion, it's all about the odds of something re-occurring and the money to cover those odds. With pre-tests, you have to cover much more. Without them, you can cover much less and win with more certainty. Just my .02.

                          I completely support most of your studies here because they make perfect sense.Thumbs Up

                           

                          L.L.

                           

                          The differences I can see between your experiment and the lottery is that after each pre-test and the offcial draw, the balls are reloaded in ascending order. So they are distributed the same way for each run.

                          While you were blindfolded your hand would have a tendency in moving in certain areas of the container. Did your observers monitor this and collected data respectively for analysis?

                          "Everything works  ONCE!"

                            Lucky Loser's avatar - bucks
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                            Posted: October 6, 2012, 12:19 pm - IP Logged

                            The differences I can see between your experiment and the lottery is that after each pre-test and the offcial draw, the balls are reloaded in ascending order. So they are distributed the same way for each run.

                            While you were blindfolded your hand would have a tendency in moving in certain areas of the container. Did your observers monitor this and collected data respectively for analysis?

                            To be perfectly honest, I just pulled right off the top because if the bucket is shaken and mixes the balls, it shouldn't matter as the balls are agitated equally.  In other words, the first ball I touched is the one I grabbed in every single test. This is the way it should be in my personal opinion, but, it gives the player a distinct advantage as far as I can see. Those officials and mathematicians are sharp as well...which is why they go through all the RIGMAROLE of simply selecting a ball.

                            You should honestly try this some time with some friends just for fun. It's truly revealing.

                             

                            L.L. 

                            Small games, frequent wins, and regular payouts 'cause.....

                            There are seven days in the week...'Someday' isn't one of them.

                            #lotto-4-a-living

                              Original Bey's avatar - Lottery-022.jpg

                              Bahamas
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                              Posted: October 6, 2012, 12:34 pm - IP Logged

                              To be perfectly honest, I just pulled right off the top because if the bucket is shaken and mixes the balls, it shouldn't matter as the balls are agitated equally.  In other words, the first ball I touched is the one I grabbed in every single test. This is the way it should be in my personal opinion, but, it gives the player a distinct advantage as far as I can see. Those officials and mathematicians are sharp as well...which is why they go through all the RIGMAROLE of simply selecting a ball.

                              You should honestly try this some time with some friends just for fun. It's truly revealing.

                               

                              L.L. 

                              Gotcha!

                              You do have me re-thinking of possible ways to refine my elimination strategy. I need to get up to 23 and I always miss by one. I have to really ponder this one and see if there's something to these pre-tests which I have reviewed time and again but never factored them in the overall scheme of things.

                               

                              If I win by this, I will donate a dollar to your favorite charity.

                              "Everything works  ONCE!"

                                 
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