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Does Mathematical Innumeracy foster superstitions and support the belief in them?

Topic closed. 122 replies. Last post 6 years ago by Delta Draw.

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Does Mathematical Innumeracy foster superstitions and support the belief in them?

Yes [ 9 ]  [45.00%]
No [ 11 ]  [55.00%]
Total Valid Votes [ 20 ]  
Discarded Votes [ 4 ]  

United States
Member #93947
July 10, 2010
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Posted: May 23, 2011, 11:30 am - IP Logged

The man in this link was the most intelligent person, I have ever known or work with. Never once did I hear him talk down to someone or belittle someone, due to lack of education or understanding the point, he was addressing.

http://www.gfy.ku.dk/~iag/newslett/news7606.htm

CARBOB,

This gentleman appears to have been a good person who died too young.

How did he respond when someone attacked or ridiculed him when he attempted to explain a misconception they may have had?

Perhaps I should first ask if this ever happened to him.

--Jimmy4164

    CARBOB's avatar - FL LOTTERY_LOGO.png
    ORLANDO, FLORIDA
    United States
    Member #4924
    June 3, 2004
    5896 Posts
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    Posted: May 23, 2011, 12:46 pm - IP Logged

    Whenever you asked him a question, he tried very hard to explain in layman terms. Never seen anyone attack him or disagree with him. Before you walked away from him, you understood the explanation. A very good sense of humor.

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      Posted: May 23, 2011, 5:53 pm - IP Logged

      Whenever you asked him a question, he tried very hard to explain in layman terms. Never seen anyone attack him or disagree with him. Before you walked away from him, you understood the explanation. A very good sense of humor.

      A sense of humor is a valuable trait.

        RL-RANDOMLOGIC's avatar - usafce

        United States
        Member #59354
        March 13, 2008
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        Posted: May 24, 2011, 3:08 am - IP Logged

        Seems to me some sort of challenge could be made that would settle the mud slinging once and for all.

        This would need to be a test of intelligence so much thought would be needed.  A math problem would

        be too easy to get outside help or cheat so we must think of somthing a little more then that.  I think

        that a design contest which required many disciplines would make a nice contest.  Something that included

        a few skills like programming, electronics, mechanics, robitics, wireless, ect...  It would also need to perform

        some complex task.  Everything would need to be hand designed using no kits, prebuilt parts and every

        aspect would need to be original in design.  I would let jimmy and DD splice their minds togeather and work

        as team.  How about it.   

        RL

        Working on my Ph.D.  "University of hard Knocks"

        I will consider the opinion that my winnings are a product of chance if you are willing to consider

        they are not.  Many great discoveries come while searching for something else

        USAF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Base_Engineer_Emergency_Force

          US Flag Trump / 2016 & 2020  

          RL-RANDOMLOGIC's avatar - usafce

          United States
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          Posted: May 24, 2011, 7:50 am - IP Logged

          Came up with a good idea that pertains to the lottery, math and intelligence so as to stay with the 

          trashing.  Design and build a wireless lottery betslip printer.  This could be built with very few tools

          a solderless breadboard and a few parts taken from an old junk printer.  Add $50.00 in electronics,

          wire and a few other odds and ends and your ready to begin.  Instead of steppers maybe use regular

          dc motors which would require one to design encoders to track the travel.  Hmmm, sounds fun.

          RL

          Working on my Ph.D.  "University of hard Knocks"

          I will consider the opinion that my winnings are a product of chance if you are willing to consider

          they are not.  Many great discoveries come while searching for something else

          USAF https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Base_Engineer_Emergency_Force

            US Flag Trump / 2016 & 2020  

            Avatar

            United States
            Member #105312
            January 29, 2011
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            Posted: May 24, 2011, 8:28 am - IP Logged

            Seems to me some sort of challenge could be made that would settle the mud slinging once and for all.

            This would need to be a test of intelligence so much thought would be needed.  A math problem would

            be too easy to get outside help or cheat so we must think of somthing a little more then that.  I think

            that a design contest which required many disciplines would make a nice contest.  Something that included

            a few skills like programming, electronics, mechanics, robitics, wireless, ect...  It would also need to perform

            some complex task.  Everything would need to be hand designed using no kits, prebuilt parts and every

            aspect would need to be original in design.  I would let jimmy and DD splice their minds togeather and work

            as team.  How about it.   

            RL

            RL:  No way of walking through it without getting it on your boots.  Afterward if there was any stink in what he was walking through the aroma follows a person around until he takes the trouble of scraping it off.

            It would be nice to see some new threads on the Math Forum involving lottery related math minus a lot of personality juice, but until someone chooses to begin threads of that sort there won't be much to draw a person to the Math Forum, instead of one of the others.

            You've started some lottery/math threads and I've started a few of my pseudo-science threads, along with a few other threads begun recently involving forum-topic-appropriate discussion possibilities, but mostly they haven't taken off like rockets.

            Partly I think it's because we're all involved in our own projects and headed in our own directions to a degree we're each responding to our own priorities.  But another part of it, I suspect, is that flame wars just aren't interesting enough to justify the time it takes to follow them.

            It would take some subject-matter containing moxie, new ideas, methodology, and a degree of promise to get members interested enough to participate in what would rapidly and certainly become another battlefield of feints and diversions provided by the trolls.

            I don't think that's likely to happen.  Someone on one of the threads on the Lottery Systems Forum a while back expressed fairly succinctly what I suspect is the dominant attitude among LP members: 

            "This is too complicated!  I don't want to know all that.  I just want to know how to win jackpots."

            Attempting to instigate discussions between people of that mindset and the numerous people within the forums and lurking on the sidelines who are working at it from every possible direction probably doesn't have much chance of success. 

            Reading through old threads I've seen a lot of IDs who used to post a lot with thinking-type threads, but who now post only rarely, and when they do it's usually just a brief comment or two.  Probably they haven't given up their projects, but they've evidently given up trying to explain them on LP forums.  Evidently they do communicate by email and PM with contacts they established here when they were active, judging from asides and responses when they do post something.

            Challenges do seem to work well on the jackpots forum.


              United States
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              July 10, 2010
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              Posted: May 24, 2011, 8:51 am - IP Logged

              RL:  No way of walking through it without getting it on your boots.  Afterward if there was any stink in what he was walking through the aroma follows a person around until he takes the trouble of scraping it off.

              It would be nice to see some new threads on the Math Forum involving lottery related math minus a lot of personality juice, but until someone chooses to begin threads of that sort there won't be much to draw a person to the Math Forum, instead of one of the others.

              You've started some lottery/math threads and I've started a few of my pseudo-science threads, along with a few other threads begun recently involving forum-topic-appropriate discussion possibilities, but mostly they haven't taken off like rockets.

              Partly I think it's because we're all involved in our own projects and headed in our own directions to a degree we're each responding to our own priorities.  But another part of it, I suspect, is that flame wars just aren't interesting enough to justify the time it takes to follow them.

              It would take some subject-matter containing moxie, new ideas, methodology, and a degree of promise to get members interested enough to participate in what would rapidly and certainly become another battlefield of feints and diversions provided by the trolls.

              I don't think that's likely to happen.  Someone on one of the threads on the Lottery Systems Forum a while back expressed fairly succinctly what I suspect is the dominant attitude among LP members: 

              "This is too complicated!  I don't want to know all that.  I just want to know how to win jackpots."

              Attempting to instigate discussions between people of that mindset and the numerous people within the forums and lurking on the sidelines who are working at it from every possible direction probably doesn't have much chance of success. 

              Reading through old threads I've seen a lot of IDs who used to post a lot with thinking-type threads, but who now post only rarely, and when they do it's usually just a brief comment or two.  Probably they haven't given up their projects, but they've evidently given up trying to explain them on LP forums.  Evidently they do communicate by email and PM with contacts they established here when they were active, judging from asides and responses when they do post something.

              Challenges do seem to work well on the jackpots forum.

              "You've started some lottery/math threads and I've started a few of my pseudo-science threads, along with a few other threads begun recently involving forum-topic-appropriate discussion possibilities, but mostly they haven't taken off like rockets."

              That's true.  Witness the ridiculous responses to my recent attempts to introduce backtesting of lottery systems - not conducive to a successful launch.  One would think that those who believe systems can be designed to beat the lottery odds would welcome a systematic way to test their efficacy, but that's not the case.  It's amusing to me that you would lament the failure of serious mathematical discussion here when you have led the charge in several instances to bring about its demise.

              (Joey has me blocked, so others should feel free to comment.)


                United States
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                October 31, 2009
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                Posted: May 24, 2011, 11:00 am - IP Logged

                "You've started some lottery/math threads and I've started a few of my pseudo-science threads, along with a few other threads begun recently involving forum-topic-appropriate discussion possibilities, but mostly they haven't taken off like rockets."

                That's true.  Witness the ridiculous responses to my recent attempts to introduce backtesting of lottery systems - not conducive to a successful launch.  One would think that those who believe systems can be designed to beat the lottery odds would welcome a systematic way to test their efficacy, but that's not the case.  It's amusing to me that you would lament the failure of serious mathematical discussion here when you have led the charge in several instances to bring about its demise.

                (Joey has me blocked, so others should feel free to comment.)

                Yea Jimmy, there are some malicious people here on site that feel asking
                questions and changing the thread topic is brilliance. Every one of them take
                shots at any systematic approach but generally stay clear of doing so in the systems
                forum because it would be too obvious and warrant getting banned.

                So to begin with, they change the focus and start making demands. They
                continue to ask foolish questions and never reply to an answer but continue to
                shift the focus. It is a thread killer.

                They are site trolls. As RL suggests,
                you and I should coop on a project of his outline. He wishes to make yet another
                demand for a proof of talent and ultimately intelligence. It is a ridiculous demand
                and a suggestion that is pure fantasy. Whatever be the fruits of my labor never
                make it to hogwaller anymore to be nuzzled with the snout of a swine.

                What the educated find is an often throwing-down insult to make one look
                stupid. It is an invitation to join them at their level where they can exclaim “you
                are not that smart” or “I don’t need all that education to be this smart”. CT
                does it all the time it seems, and he slights people who in his opinion are
                going about things the wrong way (sounds like RL). One should apply ‘luck’ and
                avoid any systematic play. Members are criticized for failing at predictions
                and the seeds of doubt are sown. Proof to buy QP's?

                RL just wants to be a hitch-hiker like the guy that just wants the winning
                numbers and is too lazy to apply themselves in WORK. Just because someone wants
                a proof does not mean they want to learn HOW to prove. I have seen new members insult their way into
                getting another member to give up the goods implying that members are selfish.
                Sadly, the demanding member never looked
                to see if his request was being answered and since it was work, most have
                ignored it. I saw a recent post of his where he lamented about not finding a
                suitable working solution. Those kind should stick to Quick Picks. The desire
                to win exceeds the desire to try.

                It is like pearls before the swine where they tread them underfoot. That is
                why some members no longer share or contribute. They are well aware of their
                price to see that what they offer has fallen on deaf and dumb ears. To add
                insult, the swine derail a thread and succeed to populate the site with more
                jackasses and less jacks. Innumeracy rules! http://gurukalehuru.com/2010/12/17/why-stupid-people-rule-the-world/
                 

                 

                It is like having a business and a relative gets involved to screw up at
                every turn, blame the help and prove to the owner-relative how valuable they
                are to the business as a trusted influence. The customers go away, there is a
                high turn-over, the business seems to continue but there is no end to the
                tricks and ploys of the manipulative destructive elements. Any other employee would
                be out the door holding their butt down the road.

                The Dunning-Krugar effect is where the dumb get confident and the smart get doubtful.
                These trolls are perfecting that when they challenge with whit they themselves do
                not possess (the right spelling RL). The very idea of using their gray matter
                to improve themselves is foregone to deliver useless dribble that is off topic.
                Their biggest thrill to their fragile self esteem is to appear more informed
                and more brilliant than any threat that makes them insecure. Their redirecting questions are not really cleaver, they just might look that way.

                Moonwatcher threw his bone and howled because he felt good about himself
                after brow-beating his fellow ape. To throwbacks like that, might is always
                right. “we don’t need no stink’n badges”.

                CT calls it the Monkey Mind from Ornamental teachings he took about self and ego. It is all over him like ugly on an ape. Welcome Jimmy to the real world where innumeracy rules. Learn to exploit it in honest ways like suggesting QP's and luck.

                DD


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                  Posted: May 24, 2011, 11:31 am - IP Logged

                  Great post DD.  Gotta' run now - will comment later...

                  Kalehuru rocks!

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                    Kentucky
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                    Posted: May 24, 2011, 11:48 am - IP Logged

                    jimmy: "One would think that those who believe systems can be designed to beat the lottery odds would welcome a systematic way to test their efficacy"

                    We never saw a test of an actual lottery system. However you did show how 50,000 random pick-3 QP players would do if they all bet $1 in 20,000 drawings. Don't now why you believes 54 years is a valid test or how that even applies to realistic pick-3 play when almost all of the systems in the Systems Forum are for the next drawing, the next week, or the next month.

                    Maybe someone can offer Jimmy a link to "realistic lottery play".


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                      Posted: May 24, 2011, 11:55 am - IP Logged

                      jimmy: "One would think that those who believe systems can be designed to beat the lottery odds would welcome a systematic way to test their efficacy"

                      We never saw a test of an actual lottery system. However you did show how 50,000 random pick-3 QP players would do if they all bet $1 in 20,000 drawings. Don't now why you believes 54 years is a valid test or how that even applies to realistic pick-3 play when almost all of the systems in the Systems Forum are for the next drawing, the next week, or the next month.

                      Maybe someone can offer Jimmy a link to "realistic lottery play".

                      Oh my. A thread title and topic convergence.

                      Good for one last Banana

                      DD

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                        Kentucky
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                        Posted: May 24, 2011, 12:00 pm - IP Logged

                        "Now that I have 1,000 views in three days I got the 5 G's."

                        And 0.97% of viewers voted on your poll; that's a very impressive figure and should be worth at least 10 G's!

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                          Krakow
                          Poland
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                          Posted: May 24, 2011, 12:51 pm - IP Logged

                          Well guys, no wonder that males are supposed to die out like dinosaurs. Each and every forum frequented mostly by men sooner or later turn into a macho

                          contest. It helps nobody, even if such an intention was at the very start. Just a fight like so many times in history.

                            rdgrnr's avatar - walt
                            Way back up in them dadgum hills, son!
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                            Posted: May 24, 2011, 1:22 pm - IP Logged

                            Mathematical Innumeracy... hmmm...  Is there some other kind?

                            Oh well, whatever...

                            I'm just glad this dry drought is over.

                            I'm glad we're getting some wet rain.


                                                                         
                                                 
                                                                     

                             

                             

                             

                             

                                                                                                                               

                            "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing"

                                                                                                                        --Edmund Burke

                             

                             

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                              Kentucky
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                              Posted: May 24, 2011, 2:20 pm - IP Logged

                              Mathematical Innumeracy... hmmm...  Is there some other kind?

                              Oh well, whatever...

                              I'm just glad this dry drought is over.

                              I'm glad we're getting some wet rain.

                              "Mathematical Innumeracy... hmmm...  Is there some other kind?"

                              I'll bet you a cold ice tea someone wishes they had said "does innumeracy foster superstition...yadda yadda"!