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Agent provacateurs

Topic closed. 133 replies. Last post 10 years ago by LOTTOMIKE.

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Sunny California
United States
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May 31, 2006
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Posted: June 20, 2006, 9:52 am - IP Logged

Hello,Todd,

I've often thought of that possibility,that the numbers are already chosen. Not that I totally believe it,but I'm sure that's crossed everyone's mind once or twice especially when we look at our tickets and see we missed every number by one lousy digit. By all means,I believe a computerized system could be tampered with. Someone hacked into my paypal account and that's supposed to be the securist way to pay online,isn't it? Ha. Lottery balls,maybe not, but computers,have to agree wholeheartedly with you there!!

And BTW,my agree sign was meant for cps10's statement above! Yes,we have thick skin!!!

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    New Mexico
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    Posted: June 20, 2006, 9:56 am - IP Logged

    The problem is, the people who do it don't match the description, ignorant, arrogant, stubborn, one senses.

    I've watched this for an awfully long while.

    These aren't trolls.  These are intelligent people, probably nice folks in their personal lives.  They're people a person could come to like, meeting them somewhere.

    The only time they get nasty is during one particular circumstance.

    So the question again emerges.

    Why?  What motivates them to try to kill hope and innovation?

    Nice folks who only change during the full moon?

    Jack

    Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

    It's about number behavior.

    Egos don't count.

     

    Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

     

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      Sunny California
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      Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:03 am - IP Logged

      The problem is, the people who do it don't match the description, one senses.

      I've watched this for an awfully long while.

      These aren't trolls.  These are intelligent people, probably nice folks in their personal lives.  They're people a person could come to like, meeting them somewhere.

      The only time they get nasty is during one particular circumstance.

      So the question again emerges.

      Why?  What motivates them to try to kill hope and innovation?

      Nice folks who only change during the full moon?

      Jack

      Maybe they're not as nice as you think. I'm sad to say but I think of my mother as an example. She is always "nice" to everyone,acts nice,talks nice,everyone thinks she's the "nicest" lady on the block! That is until she gets behind closed doors and boy,does she let it rip!

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        New Mexico
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        Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:11 am - IP Logged

        Back during my student radical years at the U of Texas the agent provacateur phenomenon came to my attention the hard way.  That's a piece of humanity that's a reality.

        In those days organizers had to take it as a given that the person next to him trying to get him whooped up to say or do something stupid was there from the other side, and that allowing ones self to be led into the conversation or activity would very likely lead to an indictment for a felony.

        That's not precisely what appears to be happening here.  Instead, it appears that nice folks among us, when someone begins to discuss a topic that's entirely legitimate for a lottery forum, begin baiting and inviting their friends to bait the person.  They are joined by others and it begins a popular movement, frequently, probably including a number of others who merely are along for the ride.

        Agent provacateur seems to me to be one of the several possibilities.  That's precisely how an agent provacateur would behave if one were such an animal.

        Jack

        Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

        It's about number behavior.

        Egos don't count.

         

        Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

         

          Todd's avatar - Cylon 2.gif
          Chief Bottle Washer
          New Jersey
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          Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:12 am - IP Logged

          The problem is, the people who do it don't match the description, ignorant, arrogant, stubborn, one senses.

          I've watched this for an awfully long while.

          These aren't trolls.  These are intelligent people, probably nice folks in their personal lives.  They're people a person could come to like, meeting them somewhere.

          The only time they get nasty is during one particular circumstance.

          So the question again emerges.

          Why?  What motivates them to try to kill hope and innovation?

          Nice folks who only change during the full moon?

          Jack

          OK.  Maybe I just have certain individuals in mind, and I am transposing my views on them to the entire population of people who bash others' systems.  For example, there is a guy "Saliu" (or something like that) who is a self-proclaimed genious, and everyone else is a moron (in his myopic view).  Anyone who attempted to have a discussion on any point he made instantly became an "idiot", and was ridiculed.  That's the kind of person I'm talking about. 

           

          Check the State Lottery Report Card
          What grade did your lottery earn?

           

          Sign the Petition for True Lottery Drawings
          Help eliminate computerized drawings!

            cps10's avatar - Lottery-004.jpg
            The Carolinas - Charlotte
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            Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:18 am - IP Logged

            Jack certainly isn;t like what you mention there, Todd :)

            Jack - you certainly have me rolling with your prose in this discussion, and I can certainly see those people that you talk about trying to get you whooped up.

            The North Carolina Education Lottery - so much a joke that here are their mascots:

            Stooges

              Coin Toss's avatar - shape barbed.jpg
              Zeta Reticuli Star System
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              Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:20 am - IP Logged

              I was thinking that any lottery commission monitoring would apply much more greatly to marketing than to "system surpressing" or "lottery code breaking". Think for a momnet folks- the odds against a 6 or an 8 on a crap table are 6:5, and many a player has gone tapioca playing a 6 & 8 system.

              Compare that to lotto odds.  

              I think they'd be much more interested in "Would you play this?" type of threads.

               

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                Sunny California
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                Posted: June 20, 2006, 10:31 am - IP Logged

                Back during my student radical years at the U of Texas the agent provacateur phenomenon came to my attention the hard way.  That's a piece of humanity that's a reality.

                In those days organizers had to take it as a given that the person next to him trying to get him whooped up to say or do something stupid was there from the other side, and that allowing ones self to be led into the conversation or activity would very likely lead to an indictment for a felony.

                That's not precisely what appears to be happening here.  Instead, it appears that nice folks among us, when someone begins to discuss a topic that's entirely legitimate for a lottery forum, begin baiting and inviting their friends to bait the person.  They are joined by others and it begins a popular movement, frequently, probably including a number of others who merely are along for the ride.

                Agent provacateur seems to me to be one of the several possibilities.  That's precisely how an agent provacateur would behave if one were such an animal.

                Jack

                Have you ever heard the saying, The Masses are A**es? I don't know where I heard that but you will notice when people are together in a group they act much different than they would alone. It's easy to get caught up in a crowd,especially if you are not a strong minded person.  I don't think of myself as weak minded,yet sometimes in a movie theater during a funny scene and I hear people laughing,I will laugh too even though if at home watching the same movie again I probably wouldn't find it as funny. You got your leaders and your followers and most people become followers in a crowd,all it takes is that one person to get the ball rolling. Maybe it's just human nature taking over from there,survival of the fittest,if you will. We pick on the weak and try to bring him down.

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                  New Mexico
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                  Posted: June 20, 2006, 11:12 am - IP Logged

                  Back during my student radical years at the U of Texas the agent provacateur phenomenon came to my attention the hard way.  That's a piece of humanity that's a reality.

                  In those days organizers had to take it as a given that the person next to him trying to get him whooped up to say or do something stupid was there from the other side, and that allowing ones self to be led into the conversation or activity would very likely lead to an indictment for a felony.

                  That's not precisely what appears to be happening here.  Instead, it appears that nice folks among us, when someone begins to discuss a topic that's entirely legitimate for a lottery forum, begin baiting and inviting their friends to bait the person.  They are joined by others and it begins a popular movement, frequently, probably including a number of others who merely are along for the ride.

                  Agent provacateur seems to me to be one of the several possibilities.  That's precisely how an agent provacateur would behave if one were such an animal.

                  Jack

                  Have you ever heard the saying, The Masses are A**es? I don't know where I heard that but you will notice when people are together in a group they act much different than they would alone. It's easy to get caught up in a crowd,especially if you are not a strong minded person.  I don't think of myself as weak minded,yet sometimes in a movie theater during a funny scene and I hear people laughing,I will laugh too even though if at home watching the same movie again I probably wouldn't find it as funny. You got your leaders and your followers and most people become followers in a crowd,all it takes is that one person to get the ball rolling. Maybe it's just human nature taking over from there,survival of the fittest,if you will. We pick on the weak and try to bring him down.

                  Have you ever heard the saying, The Masses are A**es? I don't know where I heard that but you will notice when people are together in a group they act much different than they would alone. It's easy to get caught up in a crowd,especially if you are not a strong minded person. 

                   LottoLaughs:

                  Yep.  I'm familiar with the concept.  I'm not happy to admit I used it with some finesse during those years, many times.  Quite frankly, if it weren't true the Vietnam War would probably still be going on.

                  all it takes is that one person to get the ball rolling. Maybe it's just human nature taking over from there,survival of the fittest,if you will. We pick on the weak and try to bring him down.

                  Again, you've identified one of the less admirable flaws in the human creature.

                  I suppose if I believed the people instigating this were also the jackals you describe I'd see things differently.  I wouldn't like it better, but I'd see it differently.

                  There's no question the end result is a demonstration of the jackal phenomenon.  There's no question a lot of LP members who probably are not agents provacateur have adopted a jackal habit and derive satisfaction, when the right buttons are pushed, in trying to bring down the weak.

                  The only real question is whether the people who trained them in this response, and the people who push the buttons, are agent provacateurs, or whether they are merely low-life scum disguised as nice folks.

                  Jack

                   

                   

                   

                   

                  Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

                  It's about number behavior.

                  Egos don't count.

                   

                  Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

                   

                    cps10's avatar - Lottery-004.jpg
                    The Carolinas - Charlotte
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                    Posted: June 20, 2006, 1:12 pm - IP Logged

                    Those that run and take their ball when criticized are the weak. Strong people go about their business. Those that criticize may also be weak in that they cannot formulate their own strategies to beat whatever it is that comes across them.

                    The North Carolina Education Lottery - so much a joke that here are their mascots:

                    Stooges

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                      New Mexico
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                      Posted: June 20, 2006, 1:45 pm - IP Logged

                      Those that run and take their ball when criticized are the weak. Strong people go about their business. Those that criticize may also be weak in that they cannot formulate their own strategies to beat whatever it is that comes across them.

                      Cps10:

                      Human beings are weak.  All of us.

                      Some of us are merely better at simulating strength than others. 

                      Those who prey on weakness aren't strong.  They're merely opportunistic.

                      This website isn't a contest of strength and weakness.  A weak person (one who doesn't simulate strength easily and naturally) might well offer something valuable those of us with different traits miss.

                      Maybe I was wrong to bring up the agent provacateur question.

                      The reality is, it doesn't matter whether the jackals are in the employ of lotteries, or aren't.

                      What does matter is whether this website and the people who use it are able, strong, weak, or indifferent, to express ideas that might help each of us win a lottery. 

                      Whether they can do so without being attacked, ridiculed, vilified by people who represent the antithesis of that concept.

                      And whether those of us who are here in hopes of finding ways of winning lotteries are going to sit silently, as we've tended to do in the past, and watch it happen.  Watch it happen while it drives away, perhaps, the key (though maybe weak) person who might have helped.

                      I never say never, and I try not to forecast my own future behavior.

                      But if I were going to do so, if I could do so without feeling I'd have to then do it, I'd say I'm not planning to sit idly by and watch that sort of behavior here any more.  Not without making things as uncomfortable and difficult as I can for the jackals.  Which, I suspect, might amount to a middling amount of difficulty and discomfort.

                      But, I mightn't.  Life's short and we all have a lot to get done before we reach the exit ramp.

                      Jack

                      Absorb the good, ignore the bad, weigh the ugly.

                      It's about number behavior.

                      Egos don't count.

                       

                      Dedicated to the memory of Big Loooser

                       

                        cps10's avatar - Lottery-004.jpg
                        The Carolinas - Charlotte
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                        Posted: June 20, 2006, 1:52 pm - IP Logged

                        You've got that right, but I do commend you for sticking up for those who wish to express their ideas and defending those when they are jackal-ized.

                        The North Carolina Education Lottery - so much a joke that here are their mascots:

                        Stooges

                          konane's avatar - wallace
                          Atlanta, GA
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                          Posted: June 20, 2006, 2:55 pm - IP Logged

                          Rip believe I'm quoting you correctly when you said in one of your comments "who believe in themselves" which may be the core of anyone's system they find works for them. 

                          Belief is one of those personal intangibles that can't be passed on to others via a system, (or can't be controlled by whatever alterations a lottery might make) .... and that could be why people try a system then pummel the person posting that system if it doesn't live up to their expectations.

                          People who post their systems on LP are very generous and kind .... it's sad to see that kindness not returned with a simple "thank you, I'll see if it works for me." 

                          As usual with any of your writings, very interesting discussion!!

                          Good luck to everyone!

                            cps10's avatar - Lottery-004.jpg
                            The Carolinas - Charlotte
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                            Posted: June 20, 2006, 3:10 pm - IP Logged

                            konane

                            I have found that to be true in whatever gambling system you use. If you have faith in it, then it works for you. If you go in with the attitude that it will fail, then more than likely, it WILL fail.

                            The North Carolina Education Lottery - so much a joke that here are their mascots:

                            Stooges

                              konane's avatar - wallace
                              Atlanta, GA
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                              Posted: June 20, 2006, 3:17 pm - IP Logged

                              konane

                              I have found that to be true in whatever gambling system you use. If you have faith in it, then it works for you. If you go in with the attitude that it will fail, then more than likely, it WILL fail.

                              Thanks!!  Couldn't agree with you more.  "Old fashioned" but timeless concepts. Big Grin

                              Good luck to everyone!